Case 530ck engine removal

[JAMH]

I inherited a Case 530ck backhoe from my uncle who passed away. He had used water instead of antifreeze as coolant because he though coolant was leaking into the crankcase and he thought antifreeze would damage the journal bearings. As he got older (85+) he forgot to drain the water on time before winter in Canada and the block ended up freeze cracked along the left side behind the diesel injection pump and diesel fuel filters.

I repaired the cracked block with JB Weld and it is holding but the head gasket is now leaking combustion gas into the coolant. I found a good used 188 diesel engine block so I decided to change out the block. Next step is to remove the engine from the backhoe. I can see how the engine block unbolts from the torque tube but I would like to know how to disconnect the end of the crank shaft from the torque converter so that I can pull the engine away from the torque tube and torque converter.

Can anyone describe how this works?

 

[John Saeli]

The engine will slide away from the Converter. How do you know it is a head gasket leaking, and did you install the correct head gasket? There are 2 different head gaskets for the 188. The later head gasket will not hold on an earlier 188.

 

[JAMH]

Good to hear that the engine will just pull away from the torque converter because I didn't want to have to remove the top off the torque tube which would be a lot more work.

I'm not certain it is the head gasket but I'm certain that combustion gases are getting into the cooling system. I agree that there are other ways for the combustion gas to get into the cooling system such as a pin hole leak in a sleeve or a cracked sleeve but either way I have to take off the head to determine which it is.

The serial number on the engine is 2111837 which is before 2610966 so it is a narrow flange block and the block that I just recently purchased is also a narrow flange block. I have found a supplier here in Canada that can get a narrow flange head gasket but I want to take the head off first to verify that the sleeves are in fact narrow flange sleeves because I've heard that some narrow flange blocks were machined out to wide flange size so that wide flange sleeves can be installed in them.

 

[mEl]

I have never seen an early block machined that way, if I were you since you are going that in depth with the repair I would take the block to a reputable auto engine rebuilder and have the block machined for the wide flange sleeves, the reason for the change in the first place was sleeve settling from lack of support from the narrow lip on the sleeve top. That was standard practice at our shop for years. The block probably split between the sleeves from the freeze allowing the sleeve to drop enough to allow the gasket to leak. If you decide to machine the block for the wide sleeves the machinist must know to only take enough off the block deck to get a good counterbore without raising the piston height very much as valve to piston clearance is critical.

 

[John Saeli]

The correct head gasket from CASE is very expensive, so we had these made.
http://external_link.com/product/case-430-530-630-a36299-1349115c1-a36877-188-201-gas-diesel-engine-small-flange-head-gasket/

 

[JAMH]

I debated between machining the block to accept wide flange sleeves or just re-install my
narrow flange sleeves into the purchased block. I priced it out and the cost to install new
wide flange sleeves will be twice the cost. Also, I'm concerned about the risk of the machine
shop making an error which would leave me with no block other than the one I repaired with JB
Weld.

I plan on measuring the cylinder sleeve protrusion with my existing sleeves in the purchased
block and if that looks ok I will use a narrow flange head gasket and put it together. I only
plan on putting a few hours per year on the backhoe so I'm hoping it will last several years
like this.

I'm also concerned about the torque converter. When I first start the backhoe it seems like
the torque converter slips quite a bit. It gets much better when it warms up but I'm not
sure it isn't still slipping more than it should. I'm wondering if the stator one-way clutch
may not be holding properly and therefore the torque multiplier may not be happening. Any
thoughts on how to check the stator one-way clutch without taking it apart?

 

[JAMH]

I think my supplier in Canada gets the narrow flange head gaskets from this supplier.

 

[mEl]

The TC has no sprag, it is a Twin Disc bolt together fully servicable with ordinary tools. High hour machines usually have some hub and bushing wear but are resealable and parts can be reconditioned. The TC oil level should check on full immediately after shutdown after running at least a few minutes. It is totally acceptable and expected for the unit to not move properly till the TC fills as they drain out overnite. In cold weather it fills slower than when it is warm out. If the engine rpms are not up to spec it has a tremendous effect on the machines drive power, open the throttle wide open and check the stop screw on the side of the injection pump. The screw should be tight against the stop. the engine does not have to be running to do this. Make adjustments as needed to et the rpms up as I stated before, that is the sinle most thing that will kill the engines performance. What are your gauge readings both in TC and direct. That tells much about the systems condition!

 

[JAMH]

Thanks for clarifying. Everything I've seen about stators in torque converters is that they
have a sprag one-way clutch, so I assumed this one was the same which was incorrect. Does the
stator turn with the impeller, the turbine or is it stationary?

Regarding the oil level, I know where the dip stick is but I wasn't sure how it should be
checked (cold, warm, running or off). I replaced the oil with Case HY-TRAN ULTRA so the oil
is very clean and clear and hard to read on the dip stick so I checked the level when cold
which is easier to check. I recently read on this forum that the level should be checked
warm and either running or within a minute or 2 after shutting off the engine. I also painted
one side of the dip stick with a flat black paint which helps a lot in terms of seeing the
oil level on the stick. Checking the oil level with the oil warm and tractor running revealed
that the oil level was too low. I added 2 to 3 quarts of HY-TRAN which brought the level up
to between add and full on the dip stick. I haven't used the backhoe much since adding the
oil but the torque converter seems to be performing better although still sluggish on first
start up and cold which I understand now is to be expected.

I see from your comments that revving the engine up is key. I was a little reluctant to do
that because I was concerned about possibly damaging the TC with it slipping. I guess I
shouldn't be concerned about that.

The gauges on the dash are not working but I bought a new gauge and checked the clutch
pressure with the multi-disc clutch engaged and also with the direct drive lever engaged and
in both cases the pressure read about 120 psi. I haven't checked the converter pressure yet
because I have to figure out how to connect the gauge to the right spot.

I think the multi-disc clutch and the direct drive clutch are working ok because when I
engage the direct drive lever the backhoe jumps up in ground speed abruptly. I believe that
when the direct drive clutch is engaged the torque is transferred from the engine through the
direct drive clutch and through the multi-disc clutch through to the wheels. So, as I
understand it, since the two clutches are arranged in series, the abrupt jump up in ground
speed when the direct drive lever is engaged is evidence that both clutches are holding
properly.

 

[mEl]

Everything you are describing sounds like a good TC as the DD clutch is the first to fail and yours sounds in good operating condition. There is a small valve on top of the top by the main control valve with a line on it. that is the TC pressure regulator. you can check the TC pressure there. 25-35 lbs I am guessing should be good. you will be more impressed when you start using the engines rpm. TCs thrive on rpms. The Impeller is bolted to the support hub of the unit. If you go the Case parts site you can view the internals of the TC as it is shown broken down.