Cylinder Head studs

[Walter1945]

Hello Tractor Fans,

I'm working on the Head of my 1952 Ford 8n and I'm wondering if someone has an idea on how much torque the studs get. Second question would be, does anyone recommend putting some sort of Anti seize on the studs.

I got the ford 8n Manuel and it only mentioned the torque for the nut itself.

Thanks guys!

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 10:57:24 11/21/23) Hello Tractor Fans,

I'm working on the Head of my 1952 Ford 8n and I'm wondering if someone has an idea on how much torque the studs get. Second question would be, does anyone recommend putting some sort of Anti seize on the studs.

I got the ford 8n Manuel and it only mentioned the torque for the nut itself.

Thanks guys!

ou know that they go into the water jacket.

 

[Jim in LA]

A 52 8N should have bolts, not studs.

 

[R Geiger]

(quoted from post at 08:57:24 11/21/23) Hello Tractor Fans,

I'm working on the Head of my 1952 Ford 8n and I'm wondering if someone has an idea on how much torque the studs get. Second question would be, does anyone recommend putting some sort of Anti seize on the studs.

I got the ford 8n Manuel and it only mentioned the torque for the nut itself.

Thanks guys!

Thread sealant not antiseize on the bolts or studs if you have them. Studs would not be torqued.

 

[John P.]

This is what is in the Ford 8N repair manual for cylinder head stud replacement.

 

[Dave G9N]

(quoted from post at 07:57:24 11/21/23) Hello Tractor Fans,

I'm working on the Head of my 1952 Ford 8n and I'm wondering if someone has an idea on how much torque the studs get. Second question would be, does anyone recommend putting some sort of Anti seize on the studs.

I got the ford 8n Manuel and it only mentioned the torque for the nut itself.

Thanks guys!

dited to correct misinformation.
The studs are installed to a certain depth.
The FO-4 manual does not have anything to say about replacing studs, and it would be nice if they had mentioned how deep they should be installed and what to use for a sealant. So perhaps the answer is that the torque is not important, but the depth and sealant used are important. And the correct depth is not in the manual, so what is it? {John P. posted instructions saying to run the stud in until no threads are showing and others have said that it is important not to drive them any further.}

Someone please correct me if I am wrong. { I was wrong. The coarse threads on the studs go into the block. The bolts used in later years had coarse threaded bolts. This means that it is possible to use either bolts or studs on any block.}


This post was edited by Dave G9N on 11/24/2023 at 04:43 pm.

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 10:57:24 11/21/23) Hello Tractor Fans,

I'm working on the Head of my 1952 Ford 8n and I'm wondering if someone has an idea on how much torque the studs get. Second question would be, does anyone recommend putting some sort of Anti seize on the studs.

I got the ford 8n Manuel and it only mentioned the torque for the nut itself.

Thanks guys!

img]https://i.imgur.com/IcqLirl.jpg[/img]

 

[Walter1945]

Yes I do. What has that to do with Anti seize?

 

[Walter1945]

(quoted from post at 10:55:07 11/21/23) A 52 8N should have bolts, not studs.

that's not my question but thank you anyway. as far as i know, later models of the N series had studs.

 

[Walter1945]

(quoted from post at 12:11:34 11/21/23)

(quoted from post at 08:57:24 11/21/23) Hello Tractor Fans,

I'm working on the Head of my 1952 Ford 8n and I'm wondering if someone has an idea on how much torque the studs get. Second question would be, does anyone recommend putting some sort of Anti seize on the studs.

I got the ford 8n Manuel and it only mentioned the torque for the nut itself.

Thanks guys!

Thread sealant not antiseize on the bolts or studs if you have them. Studs would not be torqued.

Thanks for the info! Do you have any type of brand for the thread sealant?? So for the studs just hand tight?

Thanks in advance!

 

[Walter1945]

(quoted from post at 05:58:51 11/22/23)

(quoted from post at 10:57:24 11/21/23) Hello Tractor Fans,

I'm working on the Head of my 1952 Ford 8n and I'm wondering if someone has an idea on how much torque the studs get. Second question would be, does anyone recommend putting some sort of Anti seize on the studs.

I got the ford 8n Manuel and it only mentioned the torque for the nut itself.

Thanks guys!

img]https://i.imgur.com/IcqLirl.jpg[/img]

e

doesn't mention the torque for the stud itself. That was my question ;-)

 

[Walter1945]

(quoted from post at 16:06:28 11/21/23)
This is what is in the Ford 8N repair manual for cylinder head stud replacement.

perfect! So no torque.

Thank you!

 

[HFJ]

'1949 Serial number 8N141370 - 8N245636
There were some notable changes in '49. At serial number 158162 the cylinder head studs were replaced by bolts.'

 

[lha]

I used Gasgacinch,an old school sealant,but I would imagine form-a-gasket or pipe dope would work.

 

[John P.]

ARP manufactures stud sets for the Ford Flathead V8.
After chasing all the threaded stud holes to be sure the threads are cleaned out, this is what they say to apply to the portion of the studs that go down into the block:

 

[Hobo,NC]

(quoted from post at 21:23:09 11/22/23)

(quoted from post at 12:11:34 11/21/23)

(quoted from post at 08:57:24 11/21/23) Hello Tractor Fans,

I'm working on the Head of my 1952 Ford 8n and I'm wondering if someone has an idea on how much torque the studs get. Second question would be, does anyone recommend putting some sort of Anti seize on the studs.

I got the ford 8n Manuel and it only mentioned the torque for the nut itself.

Thanks guys!

Thread sealant not antiseize on the bolts or studs if you have them. Studs would not be torqued.

Thanks for the info! Do you have any type of brand for the thread sealant?? So for the studs just hand tight?

Thanks in advance!

Permatex Aviation Form-A-Gasket No. 3 Sealant Liquid. Not to say other sealants will work this has never failed me NEVER the others have.

Studs just snug'em up.

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley RIP]

Torque is often misunderstood and very few know how to apply it correctly. First is to know what the spec is in. Torque can
be in Inch-Pounds, Inch-Ounces, Foot-Pounds, and Newton-Meters. Know how to convert from one to another as not all wrenches
are created equal. Applying torque is often in a specific sequence, usually working from the inside area outwards. Torque
must be done in THREE steps. Take spec value and divide by three. Set wrench thimble to that value and tighten sequence.
Next reset wench to next mid-range value and repeat. Final value is spec setting. Forget torquing the studs. It is the
nut/fastener that matters. Stud gets screwed in til in stops -then LEave it. The 7/16 Stud has a Coarse Thread (NC) on one
end which always goes into the cast iron part; and the other end is a Fine Thread (NF) which always accepts the
nut/fastener. Between the two ends is a non-threaded shoulder. You don't want to bottom this out in the block as could cause
stripping or worse, snapping it off. 9N-6050 Head, early uses three 7/16- 14 x 7/16-20 x 2.9L and fifteen at 2.78L. Know
which ones are shorter. Some fellas choose to replace the studs with the later 7/16-14 Hex Bolts. Know what each torque spec
is - they are different. Some guys choose to use stainless steel bolts. Whatever; yu money, your tractor. Not needed. A
Grade 8 Hex Bolt is all. You don't need a washer or lockwasher under either. Stud puckey/ant-seize lubricant will affect
torque. At original assembly, FORD used a dab of plain clean engine oil on threads. Avoid silicone/Permatex on stud/bolts.

Tim Daley (MI)

 

[Dave G9N]

As Tim said, the lubricant used has a large effect on the clamp load (tension in the bolt). Lubricating under the head of the bolt or the face of the nut with a stud has a large effect as well. A dry steel bolt in dry steel has a friction coefficient of 0.3. Oil on both the head and threads brings it down to 0.15 and some moly greases and anti seize compounds can get the friction coefficient down to 0.1.

The stress on the bolt or stud for each foot pound of torque torque goes as follows for different lubricants:
Dry 75
Oil 140
Moly 196

Torque and tension is a quirky science. When you dig in deep enough you will find that the best advice is to test your exact assembly and adjust accordingly. What follows is the generic case. The fact that broken head bolts and studs is not a major issue indicates that the book is right and the generic numbers need some adjustment. The stress on the bolt at 55 ft lb will be around 4,000 lb. dry; 8,000 lb. oiled; and 11,000 lb/ moly lube. A grade 5 screw 7/16-14 will yield at a load of 10,200 lb.
(Looks like I can't use a link to the Fastenal FASTENER REFERENCE GUIDE on the forum. It should be easy enough to search on the net)
A grade 2 will yield at only 6,200 lb and most stainless steel bolts will yield at 4,000 lb and break at 11,000 (ASTM A193 Grade B8M). The saving grace of stainless steel is that it tends to gall causing the friction to increase under high loads, so they might not break. That is also a conservative estimate and does not take into account the slight work hardening from thread rolling and heading. A grade 8 should start to stretch at 14,000 lb and break around 20,000. (Don't use stainless.) The torque values given in FO-4 for stud nuts appear to be for Grade 5 fasteners. The torque values for studs look like they are for ASTM A354 Grade BC, which is not exactly what I expect to find on the shelf locally.

 

[Tim PloughNman Daley RIP]

Hello Tractor Fans,

I'm working on the Head of my 1952 Ford 8n and I'm wondering if someone has an idea on how much torque the studs get. Second question would be, does anyone recommend putting some sort of Anti seize on the studs.

I got the ford 8n Manuel and it only mentioned the torque for the nut itself.

Thanks guys!

Torque. Another misunderstood function. Most guys don't know how to use and set it anyway. Different scales. Gotta know how to convert. Applied in a specific sequence. Applied in three step settings. Forget stud torque. Use correct length of part and a dab of clean engine oil on threads. That is all that FORD used at assembly. A 52 head would use HEX BOLTS anyway. A dab of Anti-Seize as an option but I'd avoid Permatex. Use no lockwashers.

Tim Daley (MI)