D17(IV) vs. 180 gas

[BrianRBM]

I"m not on the AC site too often so pardon me if its been discussed. Which tractor would give the least amount of problems? Not going to do any hard work....a bit of bush hoggin, grass cuttin, move wagons around, etc. I have a chance to get a gasser in either one at an auction and both are in good shape. I think the HP is comparable. I don"t want to get into tearing it down for hydraulic or clutch problems. Just want a reliable tractor with some power when I need it. Thanks.

 

[M Nut]

My opinion (having a 170 Gas and had a D-17 gas), either one will meet your needs fine. I actually expect the D-17 series 4, because of some collectability factors, will bring more money on the sale than the 180.

 

[hd6gtom]

Brian the 180 is a higher hp tractor. Both will do you a good job.

 

[Skyhighballoon(MO)]

I have both a D17 Series IV and and One-Eighty gas and love both. The Series IV with the side mount hydraulic pump losses is maybe a 50-52 PTO HP tractor in stock form. The 180 gas is a 65 PTO HP tractor and uses the same basic engine block & torque tube as a 190/190XT tractor with an almost identical transmission & rear end as the Series IV.

The One-Eighty feels like a much bigger tractor than a D17 IV and it is. It's a platform tractor and you sit up higher and have a much bigger hood in front of you. Which is better depends on how you use it. My One-Eighty works good and is reasonably fuel efficient (considering it's a gas tractor) when doing field work like plowing, discing or field cultivating when I'm using all the available HP. When I put it on a 7 foot mounted brush hog it's a real gas hog for that task when it's full HP is not needed unless I'm trying to mow down some mess that's over my head. I bought a 6 foot pull type brush hog for my D17's and probably use half the gas for routine cutting of grass and weeds around my farm. The D17 is much handier as a utility tractor than the 180. From what you say you are going to use the tractor for, I'd say the D17 would be a better fit.

Either tractor is going to be fairly reliable. IF you can, check the brakes on both, check if either pops out of 3rd gear going down a hill. Also check the mechanical PD lever on the D17 to see if it snaps over center good with no slop, esp. on the high side. Parts availability are similar for both tractors - a combination of new OEM or aftermarket parts and some things you'll have to hunt down out of a salvage yard. Mike

 

[Bob Bancroft]

These things are a lot older than when I worked on them, so maybe it's changed.
Through the 70's and early 80's I worked at an AC dealer. We were already spending way too much time on 180's and bigger jumping out of gear. At that point in time we were not having the same issue with D17's and smaller, and of course most of the D17's were a lot older.
I also never found the hyd. operated power director clutch to be nearly as useful as it was back when you could control it with the "big stick".
There was only one 180 gas around here, and I never heard about its' fuel consumption.
The few D19's that were around here on the other hand were mostly all gas, and were legendary for how much gas they demanded, working or not.
So- obviously, I'd choose the D17, since it's a series IV, assuming it's got the full 3 point and outlet package.
But if you can determine which one is in better shape, that may be the best way to go.

 

[Skyhighballoon(MO)]

Biggest reasons I'm told 180/185/190 had issues with jumping out of gear vs a D17 were:
1. Long shift levers on the 180/185/190 let you put much more leverage in grinding off the sliding collar teeth vs a D17 if you grind them into gear. If you don't grind gears, not so much a problem.
2. Factory didn't take the time to set up/shim/fit the transmission gear sets & shafts on the 180/185/190 etc. vs the earlier D17's.

Mike

 

[Bob Bancroft]

I don't recall hearing any good reasons or excuses. I was tasked with altering the shift rails in problem tractors by "moving the detent"(weld in one side and grinding out the other)deepening the groove, and installing double springs. As you can imagine, it was delicate work. Just a little too much- and it was start over!
At the time we had a 180 at home. It got traded for a 185 because it was a rough runner, and drove Dad nuts. It wasn't around long enough to develop trans. issues. The 185 started popping out of 2nd gear quite soon, and it didn't get ground into gear.
That was really too bad. It seemed like it was a downward spiral after that. Then AC just died.

 

[Eldon (WA)]

I agree with everything that has been said....and if it were me I would take the D17. Easier to get on and off, handles better, better tranny, power director can be slipped all day brush hogging, lower profile to get in smaller sheds and under trees, less chance of hydraulic/tranny seal going out, cheaper engine to overhaul if you have to, and less complicated hydraulics.

 

[WEL]

The D17 series 4 is a much more desirable tractor to the collector therefore would hold its value more than the 180. If it will do the work you require (with a little less HP) I personally would choose it although either would fit in my barn.

 

[massey 333]

The D17 will be a safer bet as far as Maint.,BUT the 180 is a far better and nicer tractor to operate and more comfortable to run.The D seris was the downfall for A-C as far as sales because of the poor seating and ease of getting off and on.Look them over and maybe try to drive each before the sale,the 180 would be my choice but IF the trans is bad then there are a lot of parts not aval.any more.A 170-175 would be the best of both worlds.

 

[Eldon (WA)]

I sure don't understand how the D series was hard to get on and off of?????

 

[Ryan Renko]

Massey 333, I"m trying to figure out your comment about the D series being the downfall of allis chalmers.Please tell me more. Ryan

 

[Skyhighballoon(MO)]

(quoted from post at 03:33:29 03/11/11) I sure don't understand how the D series was hard to get on and off of?????

Eldon - I'd much rather crawl up on my 180 with the step hanging down from the battery box than my D17. I plan to make some kind of step to put on both my D17's. Mike

 

[massey 333]

To keep it simple,NO good Hyd.system(one way-Hi Presure,not compatable with other Makes,)poor poor operator station(45s weren't great but you could get off and on with boots and winter clothing on.)People that were 100% A-C from 1935 on may have bought 1(one) and never bought another A-C until the Hundred Seris came out.Other then the Seris iv with 3 point,a good clean WD45 will bring half again to twice what a D Seris will.