Ford 5000 injection pump problems

[Kimandre]

Hi folks, im trying to solve a
problem on my ford 5000 with a simms
minimec p4666 pump.

When i get it started it can run all
from 2 minutes to 15 minutes, no
difference if its on idle or in high
rpm. Its acting likes it cuts the
fuel, then i can wait 5 minutes and
it will start up again and do the
same.. i have cleaned the diesel
tank, changed the shut off valve in
the tank, changed all the lines from
tank to and from te filter with new
rubber hoses, the filter housing is
new, new filter and checked the
square o-rings, the injectors are
pressure tested, lift pump is new,
open to check the stop mechanism on
the side of the pump, everything
looked fine. I have changed the oil
in the pump and change all of the
copper sealrings i can see. Anyone
have a clue what i can do next? The
tractor have not been used in 3
years and im trying to wake it up.

(sorry if its some write failures in
there, im from norway).

 

[SkipperII]

When it dies, do you get any air bubbles at the bleeder fitting?

 

[Bern]

In spite of everything you have done and replaced, it sure sounds like fuel starvation to me. Remove the bleed screw on the pump and insert a 0-10 or 0-30 PSI pressure gauge. Make sure you have at least 2 PSI minimum at all times.

 

[Dieseltech]

I agree with Bern, sounds like a fuel supply problem to the element block. There's a chance the supply pump internal lever is not moving the diaphragm as needed due to worn pin and/or linkage. Had an 8000 act like that once, it would work using the hand primer lever, but did not work otherwise due to worn levers and pin. A new feed pump was all it needed.

 

[Kimandre]

Dieseltech: I have tried 2 diffrent and new feed pumps.. yet these 2 are aftermrket parts i dont know how the qquality is. Is it possible to mount it on wrong?

Bern: ill hear with some buddies, maybe they have that i can borrow.

Skipper: Yes, its air in the 2 prime screws on the pump.

1 more thing, i looked at the new filter housing. The arrows on the top, does the feed pump need arrow towards the housing or against the dieselpump? Ill take some pictures and share with u on this forum.

 

[counterclockwise]

Is the return line to the tank plugged? That?s the only thing that I can think of that is not mentioned in your post.

 

[Bern]

There is no fuel return line with this pump.

 

[Kimandre]

Here is some photos.

 

[showcrop]

It is not likely but I beleive that it is possible to get the drive arm of the lift pump on the wrong side of the cam lobe when you insert it. If that were the case it would pump by the primer lever but not on its own.

 

[sotxbill]

(quoted from post at 18:42:10 07/10/19)

Here is some photos.

Why can I NOT see the ""output line"" from the fuel pump... Only an input line?? The angle of the pictures does not help.

 

[Destroked 450]

I was wondering the same thing.

Couldn't get the other photo to stay rotated the correct way.

 

[Sean in PA]

(quoted from post at 17:53:10 07/10/19) There is no fuel return line with this pump.

There is a return line from the injectors to the tank though. Won't that cause issues if it is clogged?

 

[Kimandre]

(quoted from post at 12:19:06 07/11/19)

(quoted from post at 17:53:10 07/10/19) There is no fuel return line with this pump.

There is a return line from the injectors to the tank though. Won't that cause issues if it is clogged?

Its open, blew thru it with air nozzle.

 

[M-MAN]

It can be done. Had that happen ages ago.
Pulled it back off, bumped the engine
over and re installed. Worked fine then.

 

[Destroked 450]

(quoted from post at 05:48:35 07/11/19)

(quoted from post at 12:19:06 07/11/19)

(quoted from post at 17:53:10 07/10/19) There is no fuel return line with this pump.

There is a return line from the injectors to the tank though. Won't that cause issues if it is clogged?

Its open, blew thru it with air nozzle.

We see one line coming out of the top of the lift pump, where's the one that connects to the bottom of the lift pump?

 

[Bern]

It won't affect the way the engine runs. If the injector return was plugged, pressure would build up inside
until the line blew.

 

[Kimandre]

(quoted from post at 12:56:56 07/11/19)

(quoted from post at 05:48:35 07/11/19)

(quoted from post at 12:19:06 07/11/19)

(quoted from post at 17:53:10 07/10/19) There is no fuel return line with this pump.

There is a return line from the injectors to the tank though. Won't that cause issues if it is clogged?

Its open, blew thru it with air nozzle.

We see one line coming out of the top of the lift pump, where's the one that connects to the bottom of the lift pump?

Hmm, it wasnt a line from the bottom of the feed pump on this one when i got it :?:
Where should it go?

 

[sotxbill]

(quoted from post at 08:22:15 07/11/19)

(quoted from post at 12:56:56 07/11/19)

(quoted from post at 05:48:35 07/11/19)

(quoted from post at 12:19:06 07/11/19)

(quoted from post at 17:53:10 07/10/19) There is no fuel return line with this pump.

There is a return line from the injectors to the tank though. Won't that cause issues if it is clogged?

Its open, blew thru it with air nozzle.

We see one line coming out of the top of the lift pump, where's the one that connects to the bottom of the lift pump?

Hmm, it wasnt a line from the bottom of the feed pump on this one when i got it :?:
Where should it go?

OKAY... there lies the problem.... I dont currently have a 5000 on the place this week... but...

but iirc... the fuel tank feeds the lift pump which then feeds the filter.... which then feeds the ip.... which has a bleeder line back to the filter.... but again, its been a couple of days and I dont take long to forget stuff anymore.


so your lift pump is simply pumping air....into the filter and making it loose prime??

Dont remember exactly how the lines run so check this, but you do have to have a line into the lift pump and a line out of the lift pump... and I dont see the bottom line. So I think we have found your problem...

 

[Bern]

Line #16 comes from the bottom of the tank to the BOTTOM of the lift (feed) pump. That is fuel in to the
system. Line #19A comes out of the TOP of the lift pump and sends fuel to the filter. Line 36A runs from the
filter to the back of the injection pump.
Fuel lines

 

[Kimandre]

(quoted from post at 16:26:19 07/11/19) Line #16 comes from the bottom of the tank to the BOTTOM of the lift (feed) pump. That is fuel in to the
system. Line #19A comes out of the TOP of the lift pump and sends fuel to the filter. Line 36A runs from the
filter to the back of the injection pump.
Fuel lines

Do you have a picture of this?

 

[Bern]

No I do not. Does the parts book link not work for you?

 

[Kimandre]

(quoted from post at 17:20:18 07/11/19) No I do not. Does the parts book link not work for you?

Didnt see the link

 

[Destroked 450]

My 5000 is a couple miles away in a hay field but here's a photo of a 3000 3 cylinder engine with a similar setup

The fuel line in the upper left corner of the photo comes from the tank and routes to the bottom of the lift pump.

The line coming out of the top of the lift pump routes around to the inlet on the fuel tank side of the filter base.

The rubber line coming from the filter bases outlet routes to the injection pump inlet.

 

[Bern]

Wow, that's about as crusty of an engine as I've seen in a long time.

 

[Destroked 450]

Yea the whole tractor looked like that, had a loader on it and both had had a rough life.
Local repair shop/wrecker service had it in their salvage yard, bought it has a parts donor for a decent price.
Pulled all of the power steering assembly and good front axle parts to use on BIL's manual steering 3000.

Fuel tank, dash shrould, fly wheel and two stage clutch will be used on a frankenstein tractor we have in the works.
Engine has water in the cylinders but the fuel system is complete, brother needs that for a 3000 project he has.

Loader is twisted and going to scrap.

We have a 8 spd trans with live pto we don't need, email should be open if anyone is interested.