front axle mangling lower radiator hose+

[Brian R B]

Hi-

I am an occasional poster and have a new crisis on a 1941 Ford 9N. It has an aftermarket radiator a year or so old. I kept losing coolant and finally determined that it was leaking from the lower radiator
hose/output "port" both of which were getting hit by and (the port) mangled by the left part of the front axle, due to excessive(?) vertical front axle movement when traveling over uneven ground, obstacles,
etc. The latest situation has a hairline crack in the hose itself, which will let the coolant leak out of the radiator overnight.

It seems to me that the bracket/housing in which the front axle resides (bolted to the front of the oil pan (I think, it's dark now and the tractor is outside where I left it) is the piece which restricts the travel
of the axle assy. I did bust the assembly a few years ago (cracked in two the center piece) when the tractor rolled and hit a tree(!!!) and had to order a new center piece but am pretty certain I reassembled it
as it should be. Also i think the bronze(?) axle pin which was sent was not the right size so I just reused the old one, with a new bushing, again I think... The only solution would seem to be putting spacers
at the bottom of the radiator and around its fastening bolts and raising the radiator about 3/4 inch to clear the left part of the axle in its highest upward travel.

Has anyone else encountered this situation?

Any thoughts appreciated. I have searched the archives with no luck about this.

Thanks,
Brian

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 20:42:29 09/15/19) Hi-

I am an occasional poster and have a new crisis on a 1941 Ford 9N. It has an aftermarket radiator a year or so old. I kept losing coolant and finally determined that it was leaking from the lower radiator
hose/output "port" both of which were getting hit by and (the port) mangled by the left part of the front axle, due to excessive(?) vertical front axle movement when traveling over uneven ground, obstacles,
etc. The latest situation has a hairline crack in the hose itself, which will let the coolant leak out of the radiator overnight.

It seems to me that the bracket/housing in which the front axle resides (bolted to the front of the oil pan (I think, it's dark now and the tractor is outside where I left it) is the piece which restricts the travel
of the axle assy. I did bust the assembly a few years ago (cracked in two the center piece) when the tractor rolled and hit a tree(!!!) and had to order a new center piece but am pretty certain I reassembled it
as it should be. Also i think the bronze(?) axle pin which was sent was not the right size so I just reused the old one, with a new bushing, again I think... The only solution would seem to be putting spacers
at the bottom of the radiator and around its fastening bolts and raising the radiator about 3/4 inch to clear the left part of the axle in its highest upward travel.

Has anyone else encountered this situation?

Any thoughts appreciated. I have searched the archives with no luck about this.

Thanks,
Brian

Too much going on in that description to even try and guess. Post a couple pictures of the axle and support.

TOH

 

[Den N Ms]

Brian ,If your axle pin and bushing are in good shape.You can get a short length of 1/4" or 3/8" key stock and tack weld it to the top of the axle just under the bracket so it limits the axle travel.

 

[showcrop]

There have been many posts here about after market N radiators ot fitting properly

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 08:02:12 09/16/19)
There have been many posts here about after market N radiators ot fitting properly

Poor fit is one thing. Something is very wrong here and the tractor has been rolled, axle castings broken, who knows what was bent, and repairs were made with suspect parts by someone that is "pretty sure" he did it correctly. My money is on a mangled front end, incorrect parts, and/or poorly executed repairs.

We need some pictures and then we can guess some more.

TOH

 

[DMartin9N-2N]

Good Morning:
I have a 9N with a later production "genuine Ford" radiator bought from local Ford dealer at the time (about 1999), said "made in Ireland" on box. The lower hose connection is very close to axle when the axle tilts when going over a bump. On mine, the radiator could be raised a little by using rubber washers under the radiator. HOWEVER, the top of radiator will hit the inside top of hood. I did not want to try raising the hood. Restricting axle movement is about all that is left. Last year I took things apart to install a brand new fan shroud, and spent a lot of time getting things set up again. When all put together again, if it looks simple that's great, but it often was hard to achieve. Farmerize it the best you can, I think most of them are that way. Good luck!

Dennis M. in W. Tenn.

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 09:43:31 09/16/19) Good Morning:
I have a 9N with a later production "genuine Ford" radiator bought from local Ford dealer at the time (about 1999), said "made in Ireland" on box. The lower hose connection is very close to axle when the axle tilts when going over a bump. On mine, the radiator could be raised a little by using rubber washers under the radiator. HOWEVER, the top of radiator will hit the inside top of hood. I did not want to try raising the hood. Restricting axle movement is about all that is left. Last year I took things apart to install a brand new fan shroud, and spent a lot of time getting things set up again. When all put together again, if it looks simple that's great, but it often was hard to achieve. Farmerize it the best you can, I think most of them are that way. Good luck!

Dennis M. in W. Tenn.

I have a 9N with a 20 year old aftermarket radiator. Just jacked it up to "refresh" my memory on the geometry and the center axle clears the lower neck on the radiator by an inch or so but there is nothing to limit travel and prevent it from hitting the hose. That said you are going to have to drive one wheel up on something pretty tall to get that to happen and it has never been a problem for me.

TOH

 

[Jim L WA]

Brian, like TOH, I also have an after market radiator on my 2N. The lower neck and hose are sitting 1 3/4 inches above the axle. I'm thinking that your radiator support is bent or twisted.

 

[Paul in MN]

Brian,

I have seen similar problems on many 8Ns. Usually the kingpin and bushings are worn enough to allow the axle to sloppily pivot further than it should. The hole in the axle center section may be worn through the bushing, making the hole egg shaped so a new bushing does not solve the problem. A simple solution is to weld a 1/4" or 3/8" thick pad to the engine mounted front axle support. If the axle is moving too far up on the left side, then the weld pad needs to be located on the bottom of the axle groove on the right side of the tractor. I'm sorry that I can't explain it any better. But to try again, when the left side of the axle goes UP, then the right side goes DOWN. Just locate the weld pad to limit how far the right side of the axle can go DOWN.

Usually with this much motion of the axle, the right side will come up high enough to hit the front mount distributor cap, breaking the #2 (??) (lower right) terminal off.

Paul in MN

 

[Brian R B]

Thanks for the responses. And my apologies for the wordiness of the first post. I just wanted to get out there that the axle assembly is not upside down or backwards. I think the culprit might be me/the
operator. The radiator is newish and about the time I installed it I cleared 100 yards of fence line along our road which means as we know that to keep it clear you got to weed eat and bushhog. So, by the
mailbox is a little section of fenceline which is in a ditch that VDOT (Virginia Department of Transportation) put in about 25 years ago. Rather than weedeat, why not bushhog? Which I have been doing but
the drop in and climb out of the ditch is pretty pronounced. Meaning the front axle is going up and down and up and down big time. And I wonder if I should not do this again.

"That said you are going to have to drive one wheel up on something pretty tall to get that to happen and it has never been a problem for me..."

I like the ideas of blocking by adding to the axle or the axle housing to limit play. Might explore that, but welding is not part of my limited skill set. Or raising the radiator a bit. The hood would have to go
up too of course.

What I was kind of hoping to hear was that yes, the Freedonian or Irish or Czech aftermarket radiators (mine is Czech, I dink) are notorious for this problem, but it seems that maybe these radiators only
offer challenges to those with fan shrouds, according to one responder and to something in an ad for the radiators which I came across (...will need fitting to accommodate fan shroud...).

Below are pics of the dimpled radiator outlet and the front axle on the right side. It is the second time dimpling has happened. And, yes the tractor has seen some use/abuse at my hands. But Mother
Nature has helped too. Also below is a pic from late June 1995 when a rainstorm stopped over Madison VA and unleashed a lot of rain resulting in what I learned are called debris flows off of mountain
sides. The 9N was literally right in the path of a very very large debris flow which obliterated a block shed next to which the tractor was parked. The 9N went SIDEWAYS 20 feet pushed by sludge which got
corruption into the crankcase. I cleaned it out and flushed and ran it for a while and then did a long overdue engine rebuild with sleeves and new crank bearings etc.

Thanks to all who responded.

Brian

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 21:20:35 09/16/19) Thanks for the responses. And my apologies for the wordiness of the first post. I just wanted to get out there that the axle assembly is not upside down or backwards. I think the culprit might be me/the
operator. The radiator is newish and about the time I installed it I cleared 100 yards of fence line along our road which means as we know that to keep it clear you got to weed eat and bushhog. So, by the
mailbox is a little section of fenceline which is in a ditch that VDOT (Virginia Department of Transportation) put in about 25 years ago. Rather than weedeat, why not bushhog? Which I have been doing but
the drop in and climb out of the ditch is pretty pronounced. Meaning the front axle is going up and down and up and down big time. And I wonder if I should not do this again.

"That said you are going to have to drive one wheel up on something pretty tall to get that to happen and it has never been a problem for me..."

I like the ideas of blocking by adding to the axle or the axle housing to limit play. Might explore that, but welding is not part of my limited skill set. Or raising the radiator a bit. The hood would have to go
up too of course.

What I was kind of hoping to hear was that yes, the Freedonian or Irish or Czech aftermarket radiators (mine is Czech, I dink) are notorious for this problem, but it seems that maybe these radiators only
offer challenges to those with fan shrouds, according to one responder and to something in an ad for the radiators which I came across (...will need fitting to accommodate fan shroud...).

Below are pics of the dimpled radiator outlet and the front axle on the right side. It is the second time dimpling has happened. And, yes the tractor has seen some use/abuse at my hands. But Mother
Nature has helped too. Also below is a pic from late June 1995 when a rainstorm stopped over Madison VA and unleashed a lot of rain resulting in what I learned are called debris flows off of mountain
sides. The 9N was literally right in the path of a very very large debris flow which obliterated a block shed next to which the tractor was parked. The 9N went SIDEWAYS 20 feet pushed by sludge which got
corruption into the crankcase. I cleaned it out and flushed and ran it for a while and then did a long overdue engine rebuild with sleeves and new crank bearings etc.

Thanks to all who responded.

Brian
<img src="https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cvphotos/cvphoto36671.jpg">

<img src="https://www.yesterdaystractors.com/cvphotos/cvphoto36672.jpg">

That radiator has the wrong outlet on it. Should be an elbow that comes out 2-3 inches higher. You can also move the outer axles out to get more clearance.

TOH

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 23:23:31 09/16/19)

That radiator has the wrong outlet on it. Should be an elbow that comes out 2-3 inches higher. You can also move the outer axles out to get more clearance.

TOH

I may have jumped the gun on my comment about the outlet. Hard to tell from the angle in the picture but that may be the correct elbow. But I do suggest you move the axles out enough to get the inner ends away from the radiator outlet.

TOH

 

[PopsH]

Brian - A previous owner of my 2N apparently had a similar problem, and solved it by cutting off the end of the adjustable axle.