Frost on the carb

[SLWagner73]

So, it's 16 degrees out, and when trying to start my 2n, it cranks just fine, I have good spark, but it smells like I flooded it, and there is frost on the top of the carb, after ten-fifteen minutes of going at it, it will finally fire up, however, it will blow black smoke for a minute, then it runs just fine.
Would it be okay to hit the carb with a heat gun to warm the carb while I'm trying to start it?

 

[Royse]

Frost on the outside is not uncommon. Especially when running.
Warming the carb and/or the engine will help with starting.
Be careful how you do it though. It's gasoline after all.

I've heard of guys hooking a trouble light to the carb studs and
leaving the light on for a while. Never tried it myself though.

Currently 13* in my part of Michigan. Balmy!

 

[SLWagner73]

In stead of a trouble light, I was thinking a heat gun, just to warm the carb, I have a block heater on the oil pan. (One of the magnet style), so it turns over nice and quick.
I just have never seen the frost before, and did not know if it was related to it being an updraft style carb.

 

[Bruce (VA)]

The frost is a function of air temperature,
humidity and the high velocity of the air
flow in the venturi.

A trouble light on the manifold will help it
start better, but won't be much help with
the ice. But a homemade carb heater made out
of tinfoil will.
75 Tips

 

[4play]

Most carbs and sometimes throttle bodies on EFI can frost up under certain conditions, usually needing high humidity and temps lower than 50-60*, its caused by a temperature drop near the venturi or throttle plate. Most of the time its a non issue since its on the outside, but certain conditions can cause frost on the inside restricting flow, fuel atomization or metering jets etc.

Hair drier or heat gun on low will defrost quick for temporary conditions or before warm up, building a little heat shroud might help too.

 

[Den N Ms]

SLWagner,Yes a heat gun to heat up the carb and also intake manifold will greatly improve cold weather starts.Try it get it good and warm first then see how it helps you get it started.I have used a propane torch to warm the intake manifold many times on a N when it is very cold out,just make sure you have no gas drips or leaks. A heat gun would be somewhat safer.

 

[R Geiger]

The ice is why aircraft have a carb heat function. I seee it all the time in my balmy Oregon winters, does not have to be that cold for frost to form on the outside of the carb.

 

[Skip Burney]

Carb ice is a function of temp,dew point and humidity it is actually easier to get on a warm humid day than a bitter cold one. It forms due to high humidity air flowing across the carb venturi and the associated pressure, temp drop drop

 

[Dell (WA)]

SLWagner........back in the early 50's, some boys were makin' the Juarez run from Durango, Colo to El Paso, Tex and after being on the road about 2-hrs, this brand NEW Studebaker Hawk, quit runnin' and they coasted over to the side of the road somewharr in middle of New Mexico. Popped the hood and the CARBIE was WHITE with FROST. After about 1/2-hr, the frost melted and the boys were on their way again. They all had brand NEW cowboy boots and experienced the tender mercys of the Mexican "girls" across the border. There was some talk about "penicillin" too. dunno, I didn't go........the inexperinced Dell

 

[steve19438]

wife's hair dryer has worked for me many times.

 

[Jim WI]

It is amazing how quickly ice can form in a carb with the right (wrong?) weather conditions. My old Chevy LUV didn't like cool humid weather as the carb would frost up badly. One time the throat of the carb was completely plugged with ice. I had to clean it out as best I could and then wait for the rest to melt.

 

[David G]

A gasoline engine should start fine at 16 degrees if things are in good working order.

The smell of gasoline means you are flooding it, you need to learn how to get the choke set right.

 

[Flatheadpete]

I keep a small electri heater on hand that I plug in 10-15 min before I need it. Doesn't take much to knock the cold off of it. It sits on the floor under the engine. Works well.

 

[Bob Harvey]

The English would say 'Barmy' - just for living there ! ;^)

 

[Royse]

(quoted from post at 12:37:30 12/15/16) I keep a small electri heater on hand that I plug in 10-15 min before I need it. Doesn't take much to knock the cold off of it. It sits on the floor under the engine. Works well.

Flatheadpete, your post says you edited it. Did you really?
If so I'd love to know how! I've missed that function since it
was disabled a while back.

 

[Abbby]

I have really good luck with a lower radiator hose heater. -20 and plug it in for 45 minutes and it starts like it is +45.

 

[Beatles65]

Where can I get one of these heaters!?

 

[ASEguy]

I purchased mine at O'Rielley's.

 

[Flatheadpete]

(quoted from post at 20:50:28 12/15/16)

(quoted from post at 12:37:30 12/15/16) I keep a small electri heater on hand that I plug in 10-15 min before I need it. Doesn't take much to knock the cold off of it. It sits on the floor under the engine. Works well.

Flatheadpete, your post says you edited it. Did you really?
If so I'd love to know how! I've missed that function since it
was disabled a while back.

Yes. Up in the RH top corner of my post there's an 'edit' button.

 

[Royse]

(quoted from post at 11:00:41 12/16/16)

(quoted from post at 20:50:28 12/15/16)

(quoted from post at 12:37:30 12/15/16) I keep a small electri heater on hand that I plug in 10-15 min before I need it. Doesn't take much to knock the cold off of it. It sits on the floor under the engine. Works well.

Flatheadpete, your post says you edited it. Did you really?
If so I'd love to know how! I've missed that function since it
was disabled a while back.

Yes. Up in the RH top corner of my post there's an 'edit' button.

I have the button too, but it takes me to a page that says the feature is disabled.

 

[HFJ]

ahh, a mystery. in the words of shakespeare... the game is afoot.

 

[steve19438]

no button for me. classic or modern.

 

[HFJ]

i've got the button in modern view, steve, but it's a cruel ruse. i think it's from the same people who brought us the reserve gas pickup :idea:

 

[Mr. T. Minnesota]

SL 73,
Three suggestions. One is to remove the air intake tube in cold weather. Did this on a "47 8N and it does not seem to flood so easily. You said the spark it good. Is it a blue spark?
I have replaced the bushings in the distributor and it has made a day and night difference. Of course a hose heater is essential in lower temps. Just a few things that have worked
for me in central Minnesota.
Mr. T. Minnesota

 

[Thomasthetankengine]

Never had icing on the N. But, winter
prep for my IH B414 was to wrap the
carb and as much of the manifold as I
could with aluminum foil. Kept the
wind from the fan off it and retained a
little warmth from the manifold.

 

[davpal]

It's a simple fix really. Every winter I put a piece of cardboard over the radiator grill with two tarp straps and leave about a two inch opening for airflow. It if gets really cold I block off the entire radiator opening so it can run at operating temperature. Works great and keeps the fan from blowing cold air back on the carb and on me! Been doing it for 30 years with this tractor. I also bolt a ten foot two by twelve of yellow pine on the blade to go from six foot of snow pushing to ten. It works great and does the ditches like a gallion grader. I've since only allow three feet on the right side and put about a foot on the left side to help cover the left side tracks. The three feet of over hang is perfect and the tractor can really move a lot of snow and leaves a very smooth surface.

 

[SLWagner73]

Well gentlemen, it is starting to warm up around here, almost in the low thirties!
When I checked my spark, I use an old plug that I have gapped at .060. And the spark jumps that just fine, and once I have it started, she runs like a dream.
I used a heat gun on it last weekend, got the intake nice and warm, and wow, what a difference.
I am going to get a inline heater though, as the magnetic one just seems to warm a small area, where as, the water should warm the whole block.
As for the flooding, I use the choke very sparingly, and I don't ever seem to find a flooded condition. I am pretty sure i know how to operate a choke knob. This isn't my first rodeo, but hey, thanks for trying to throw a barb in there.

 

[oldtanker]

(quoted from post at 17:01:32 12/21/16) Well gentlemen, it is starting to warm up around here, almost in the low thirties!
When I checked my spark, I use an old plug that I have gapped at .060. And the spark jumps that just fine, and once I have it started, she runs like a dream.
I used a heat gun on it last weekend, got the intake nice and warm, and wow, what a difference.
I am going to get a inline heater though, as the magnetic one just seems to warm a small area, where as, the water should warm the whole block.
As for the flooding, I use the choke very sparingly, and I don't ever seem to find a flooded condition. I am pretty sure i know how to operate a choke knob. This isn't my first rodeo, but hey, thanks for trying to throw a barb in there.

Actually depending on the condition of the carb the choke setting will vary engine to engine. I have 2 8Ns, both 12 volt. Both run good one with just a couple hundred hours on a complete rebuild. That one got a new clutch, EI and a carb rebuild while it was apart. That one you start to crank pull the choke out and push it right back in and it's running without pre heating at 0 F. The other I haven't messed with the carb at all because it runs well. That one you have to crank a couple of revolutions with full choke to get it to start. When it's cold like 0 to about -10F the Farmall M, good runner, 12 volt and EI conversion requires full choke for about 3 seconds. The 706 Farmall gasser pops right off, full choke, just about as soon as you hit the starter button. Then it has to stay at 1/2 choke till it warms up. I haven't touched the carb on that one yet as I just got it on Thanksgiving weekend. Violate any of those procedures on any of those tractors and they either flood or just won't start.

Rick