Frozen Transmission

[DrLarryE]

I have a 9N/2N mutt that every couple years I have to change the transmission fluid as it get water in it. I've been lax and when I went out to use it I couldn't get the power take off engaged and it wouldn't shift in to gear. It's a little warmer today and after letting it run for a while I could shift it in to gear but I did release the clutch for fear of damaging something, The tractor is too far out to easily warm it unless I get something that works off the tractor. My question is since it seemed to go in to gear easily would it be safe to drive it without engaging the power take off?
Thanks

 

[Dave G9N]

Engaging the PTO could be a problem because the pump is low enough in the sump to have a problem with ice or have sucked up some water that could have frozen inside of it. I think everything else is high enough above the bottom to be clear of the ice. JMOR posted some cutaway views here that show where everything is.

If the rear wheels aren't frozen or in a hole, you could put it in 3rd, try to turn the rear wheel and see if the fan moves. (Pushing the top of the wheel gives you more torque than trying to push the tractor.) If that moves the fan, the gears are free to move. I can just rock the tractor enough in 3rd on a flat surface to wiggle the fan blades. If anything in the drive train is iced up enough to cause damage you won't be able to break it free by hand. I think the reason that you couldn't move the shift lever might be the gear oil. Straight SAE 80 can get pretty stiff when really cold.

 

[Greg NE]

As far as the PTO goes I agree that the pump may be frozen and trying to run it with the engine could have disastrous results! I repaired an 8N for an acquaintance of mine a few years ago, complaint was 3 pt didn't work. Tractor had been his dad's and had been sitting for a long time and they had just got it running again. I pulled the right side inspection cover off and all I saw were broken pcs! Pump had been frozen and they literally blew it up. I would leave the tractor off and in neutral, then try and rotate the shaft in back by hand. If it turns all the way around easily you should be good. The best would be to drain it completely first and get fresh oil in it.

 

[Kirk-NJ]

Pull the side cover to see what you're up against. This one would go into gear on a warm day but on a cold day wouldn't go into gear and rear wheels were locked up. Maybe jack it up and see if the wheels move. Best to Slowly heat it up.

 

[Jim L WA]

Good advice for now. However, later in the year when the weather is warmer, why not seal up where water is getting in? Shift boot cover for one and cut up an old inner tube to wrap around the draft control spring to keep water from running down through there.

 

[R Geiger]

Mine

Good advice for now. However, later in the year when the weather is warmer, why not seal up where water is getting in? Shift boot cover for one and cut up an old inner tube to wrap around the draft control spring to keep water from running down through there.

Mine never set out in the rain but they sure do get a lot of condensation in them and I don't run them long enough to cook the moisture out.

 

[DrLarryE]

So with a little sun and letting it run I was able to get it into gear and into a heated area and it all works fine now. When running the fluid looks white but not foamy as it has in the past when it was contaminated by water. From a discussion here years ago I suspect the water is from condensation. I have an almost new shift boot and I had to replace the draft spring (and I think I did a good job) but I will cover it.
My question is... If the issue is thick oil (I think it's 80/90 oil) with some water contamination (but not full of water) causing my difficulties then the transmission won't "freeze solid", will it? I know I don't want to force it into gear and pop the clutch out but if I can get it into gear and am careful is it safe to use as it is until spring when I can service it better?

 

[Jim.ME]

White tells me it has water in the oil, foamy or not. Until you get rid of the contamination there is the chance of freeze up.

 

[DrLarryE]

That's what I thought. I used the 80/90 oil (even though I knew it would be troublesome in the cold but I wasn't expecting 14 below) because it was suggested that if I drained the fluid and let it sit the water would separate out (unlike UTF) and I could use the fluid again. Yes/No Theoretical? Yes/No Practical?
When I change the fluid, what is best to clean the rear end out to eliminate any residual water. The sump should be pretty clean of sludge as I cleaned it out when I had to replace the draft spring assembly. I am not all that mechanically able and it took me many hours to get the top cover back on correctly and working so I want to avoid removing it again.

 

[Jim L WA]

First of all, I wouldn't try to salvage the oil. Just replace it. As for worrying about residual water in the rear end, if your tractor is collecting that much water through condensation, then just change oil more frequently I guess. Of course, short runs don't help, putting it to work for longer periods helps to cook the water out of it.