Fuel experts?

[Bob Bancroft]

We got our first diesel tractor on the farm about 1970. We got our first diesel truck at my then job about 1980. I remember once with each after a cold spell it started and got out of the door and then quit. In both cases the filter was full of wax/paraffin/whatever which didn't re liquefy at room temperature. I haven't witnessed that for decades. After a couple of zero degree nights the neighbors compact track loader just did the same thing.
I suppose if the wax was heated enough it would melt. We never tried. But would it re solidify? My question is- is this poor quality fuel, or will wax separate from any fuel given the right circumstances.

 

[TerryfromSWIowa]

Any anti gel added to fuel? The low sulfur does gel easier. I use Howes in my pickup and tractor every tank all winter. Cheap insurance against fuel gelling. I know stations claim fuel is blended for winter use, but I want to be sure.

 

[showcrop]

Wax, as you are aware is totally different from ice. Ice can come from poor fuel or fuel that has been allowed to collect condensation, while wax is just because there has been no #1 blended in, and or no treatment such as Howes. I bet that your neighbor's track loader had unblended fuel in the tank.

 

[Jim.ME]

We got our first diesel tractor on the farm about 1970. We got our first diesel truck at my then job about 1980. I remember once with each after a cold spell it started and got out of the door and then quit. In both cases the filter was full of wax/paraffin/whatever which didn't re liquefy at room temperature. I haven't witnessed that for decades. After a couple of zero degree nights the neighbors compact track loader just did the same thing.
I suppose if the wax was heated enough it would melt. We never tried. But would it re solidify? My question is- is this poor quality fuel, or will wax separate from any fuel given the right circumstances.

Sounds like he has not added fuel, or is using fuel he has had on hand for a while, since this summer. Your area should have started supplying "winter blend" fuel sometime in November (about when the change occurs here). The fuel drop we got a couple weeks ago was blended for -35F according to the driver. Some summer blends can start wax crystals forming a bit below 32F. Ice crystals can start at 32F as well.

I took a cartridge type filter out of a waxed-up unit once and left it set in the heated shop, it had not fully cleared after two weeks, Don't mess with trying to heat the filters, change the filter(s). Fill the fuel filter(s) with straight K1. Add up to 50% K1 to the fuel tank and mix it some if possible. Add a double dose of Howes to the fuel tank.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

The fuel gelled, simple as that.

Diesel fuel contains paraffin wax. The amount of wax depends on the grade of fuel. When it gets down around 10-15F, the wax can crystallize unless the fuel is blended and/or treated to prevent it. Even treated fuel will gel if it gets cold enough.

The wax won't melt at room temperature. It's basically a candle, and candles don't melt at room temperature.

Here in NY state, fuel suppliers provide "winter blend" fuel that is cut with No 1 diesel, or kerosene, and/or anti-gel additives starting around October. You may not even know if you don't look at the fuel bill.

Most likely you were running untreated No 2 diesel fuel left over from the summer when the fuel gelled. Your neighbor was no doubt running summer blend fuel when his gelled up.

The fix is an emergency anti-gel product such as Power Service Diesel 9-1-1 or another similar product, and new filters. They're all good. Just pick the one with the prettiest bottle.

 

[Jim.ME]

Sounds like he has not added fuel, or is using fuel he has had on hand for a while, since this summer. Your area should have started supplying "winter blend" fuel sometime in November (about when the change occurs here). The fuel drop we got a couple weeks ago was blended for -35F according to the driver. Some summer blends can start wax crystals forming a bit below 32F. Ice crystals can start at 32F as well.

I took a cartridge type filter out of a waxed-up unit once and left it set in the heated shop, it had not fully cleared after two weeks, Don't mess with trying to heat the filters, change the filter(s). Fill the fuel filter(s) with straight K1. Add up to 50% K1 to the fuel tank and mix it some if possible. Add a double dose of Howes to the fuel tank.

And If biodiesel it can be worse, I have heard, luckily none around here, that I know of.

 

[Blackhole49]

The fuel gelled, simple as that.

Diesel fuel contains paraffin wax. The amount of wax depends on the grade of fuel. When it gets down around 10-15F, the wax can crystallize unless the fuel is blended and/or treated to prevent it. Even treated fuel will gel if it gets cold enough.

The wax won't melt at room temperature. It's basically a candle, and candles don't melt at room temperature.

Here in NY state, fuel suppliers provide "winter blend" fuel that is cut with No 1 diesel, or kerosene, and/or anti-gel additives starting around October. You may not even know if you don't look at the fuel bill.

Most likely you were running untreated No 2 diesel fuel left over from the summer when the fuel gelled. Your neighbor was no doubt running summer blend fuel when his gelled up.

The fix is an emergency anti-gel product such as Power Service Diesel 9-1-1 or another similar product, and new filters. They're all good. Just pick the one with the prettiest bottle.

I run 4 compact diesels. From the Youtube channels I watch (different thread), I've heard people who go through thousands of gallons a year state that winter fuel isn't as efficient as summer (I don't burn enough in the winter to matter). I used to fill from 5 gallon cans, but got tired (to old) of holding them up and keeping track of which was winter or not. Now I buy all summer fuel and pump my cans into a 55 gallon drum using the same electric pump and nozzle that is mounted on the drum to fill the tractors. I ad Howes to all my fuel year round and don't have any gelling problems. BTW: When I only had one compact, I never added Howes and never paid attention to what was in the cans. Only had one gel up once and replacing the filter got me going again. I've never had fuel in the can gel up (thankfully). I also use block heaters in the winter which on 3 of the 4 puts heat to the fuel tank also.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

I run 4 compact diesels. From the Youtube channels I watch (different thread), I've heard people who go through thousands of gallons a year state that winter fuel isn't as efficient as summer (I don't burn enough in the winter to matter). I used to fill from 5 gallon cans, but got tired (to old) of holding them up and keeping track of which was winter or not. Now I buy all summer fuel and pump my cans into a 55 gallon drum using the same electric pump and nozzle that is mounted on the drum to fill the tractors. I ad Howes to all my fuel year round and don't have any gelling problems. BTW: When I only had one compact, I never added Howes and never paid attention to what was in the cans. Only had one gel up once and replacing the filter got me going again. I've never had fuel in the can gel up (thankfully). I also use block heaters in the winter which on 3 of the 4 puts heat to the fuel tank also.

Winter fuel isn't as efficient, but not significantly so. Certainly not worth running the inconvenience of losing a day of work due to gelled fuel.

 

[Jim.ME]

I run 4 compact diesels. From the Youtube channels I watch (different thread), I've heard people who go through thousands of gallons a year state that winter fuel isn't as efficient as summer (I don't burn enough in the winter to matter). I used to fill from 5 gallon cans, but got tired (to old) of holding them up and keeping track of which was winter or not. Now I buy all summer fuel and pump my cans into a 55 gallon drum using the same electric pump and nozzle that is mounted on the drum to fill the tractors. I ad Howes to all my fuel year round and don't have any gelling problems. BTW: When I only had one compact, I never added Howes and never paid attention to what was in the cans. Only had one gel up once and replacing the filter got me going again. I've never had fuel in the can gel up (thankfully). I also use block heaters in the winter which on 3 of the 4 puts heat to the fuel tank also.

It is not as efficient, but as BarnyardEngineering posted trying to run summer blend year-round is not worth the inconvenience of having gelled fuel.

That works for you. If your use is right in your dooryard, taking a chance is one thing. If you were out depending on them for a living, you might see it differently. It is no fun having a dead unit on the road, on a construction site, or out in the fields/woods at 0F or below and trying to revive it. My dozer will get a dose of K1 and Howes, next time it runs, as I haven't fueled it since its last use this summer. If I don't dose it, knowing the fuel it has in it, that is a me problem, not a fuel problem. And, as per Murphy's law, it would be as far away from the shop as possible when it acts up.

 

[NoDakInMN]

Diesel fuel, or more properly, fuel oil, comes in different grades, #1, #2 and so on. The higher the number, the "thicker" the fuel oil and the warmer it has to be in order to atomize it to burn properly. As you have found out, there are components in the oil that can come out of suspension if a certain grade gets cold enough. The higher numbered grades also are rated at more BTUs per gallon, so there is more energy in them. I've worked on boilers that ran #6 fuel oil and even though stored at 75 degrees, it needed additional heating to get it to atomize and burn properly.

It used to be everyone switched to #1 in the winter, but now 50/50 blends of #1 and #2 have become common. Adding anti gel is good insurance because working on a gelled up engine in sub zero temps is not a lot of fun.

 

[jon f mn]

I use Howes diesel teat in my stuff and don't have any issues with gelling. The first tank gets double the ladle amount, then the label rate for the rest f the year. In all my years driving and buying fuel all over, some winterized and some not, I've never had an issue as long as I had the Howes in the tank. My 30 series cases have to run at all Temps in the winter to do chores and they will gel easily with just gravity feed fuel systems, but with that treatment I don't have issues even tho the fuel in the tank is summer fuel.

 

[john in la]

#2 diesel is #2 diesel is #2 diesel.
Unlike gasoline that has a different evaporation rate in summer and winter the diesel is the same. Only difference is winter diesel has a non gel agent added or it is mixed with #1 diesel and or kerosene.
While a farm store or home heating supplier may mix their fuel in November for January conditions this is usually not the case for a truck stop especially one that moves large quantities of fuel as it sells before it gets cold enough to gel.
So mixing fuel for an occasional use tractor you buy in November at a truck stop is good advice as you will not use it up before it gets cold.
All the anti gel agents in a bottle are about the same. Pick one and mix it per the directions on the bottle. Change the filter as the gel will never come out of it.

Where I work the fuel is blended in the storage tanks up north based on the time of the year. Down south we provide 2 gallon jugs next to the pump of anti gel as we only get summer fuel all year long. It is up to the driver to mix his own tanks if he is heading up north and needs added protection.

I do believe refineries cut back on bio diesel in the winter even down south as it can be a problem in the winter.

 

[Phil T]

I called 2 different large suppliers of diesel in Maine and the both told me they don't start delivering winter fuel until December 1 . So I wait until Jan before I buy any local to be reasonably sure it is cut. I also use Howes or Diesel 911, whichever is on sale when I stock up

 

[Texasmark]

We got our first diesel tractor on the farm about 1970. We got our first diesel truck at my then job about 1980. I remember once with each after a cold spell it started and got out of the door and then quit. In both cases the filter was full of wax/paraffin/whatever which didn't re liquefy at room temperature. I haven't witnessed that for decades. After a couple of zero degree nights the neighbors compact track loader just did the same thing.
I suppose if the wax was heated enough it would melt. We never tried. But would it re solidify? My question is- is this poor quality fuel, or will wax separate from any fuel given the right circumstances.

I use Power Services diesel treatment in the white container...directions on container; widely available and reliable. Yes, regardless if the fuel has treatment or not, when the temp rises above fuel freezing temp, the ice will go back to water and unclog the fuel line.

 

[Russ from MN]

I grew up in N MN, most of the logging up there is done in the winter, and back when I was involved no one used any additives, they just switched to no 1 fuel in October and used it through the winter. The energy in no 1 is a little less, but it's not worth the downtime caused by gelled fuel. I drain the summer fuel out of our JD4600 in October and put in 5 gallons of no 1, even though I don't plan on using it in cold weather, I want it to be ready, it can get -20F in early November! Anyone that heats with oil and has an outside tank buys nothing but no1.

 

[DoubleR]

We got our first diesel tractor on the farm about 1970. We got our first diesel truck at my then job about 1980. I remember once with each after a cold spell it started and got out of the door and then quit. In both cases the filter was full of wax/paraffin/whatever which didn't re liquefy at room temperature. I haven't witnessed that for decades. After a couple of zero degree nights the neighbors compact track loader just did the same thing.
I suppose if the wax was heated enough it would melt. We never tried. But would it re solidify? My question is- is this poor quality fuel, or will wax separate from any fuel given the right circumstances.

I don't trust a supplier to put additive or give me a winter blend. I use a additive, House or API, in the winter and have a filter on the bulk tank I that supply three Diesel tractors in the winter with fuel. Change the filters on bulk tank and tractors on a regular bases. Knock on wood I haven't had a fuel problem that I can recall since I've adopted the mentioned policy's.

 

[farmersamm]

Worked for a guy back in the late 80's, out in Colorado, that had us put unleaded gasoline in the tank when it was below 0. It did keep it from gelling, but if the weather warmed up before we ran those tanks out, the motor would rattle a bit. IIRC.........we'd put about 5 gallons of gas in per side, on a 200gal diesel fill up. So.......that would have been about 5% per 100gal tank..............

I was hauling container loads of Miller beer out of the Burlington Northern RR ramp at the time. Started around 4:00AM so I could get to the distributor in C. Springs by their opening time. Cold starts, lots of idling time at the ramp, and at the warehouse in The Springs. Never gelled.

Whether it was good for the engine..................I have absolutely no friggin' idea. It was his truck, his orders. Never could tell if there was any damage in the time I worked for the guy(shrug). That particular truck had a 9spd..........mostly a flat lander truck.

Used to run Coca Cola from the bottler on York St. up over the mountains to Glenwood Springs during the Winter. Never had gelling problems, but it was hard pulls, mixed with long downhills against the Jake. The fuel would remain warm enough on the downhills, even though the heads were cool. Motor didn't like firing up when you came off the Jake, but it was just a momentary thing. Like to froze to death coming down those passes, even with a Winter front. Coolant got too cool for the heater to run right. 12mph uphill.........12mph downhill. Those were the days.... 90% of the trip was in 4th gear. 350 Cummins, 13spd Road Ranger. And it was a race car compared to the old 290's.

I'd get guys comin' around me going downhill running at around 20-25mph. And sometimes you'd see those idiots off in one of the runaway ramps. Once you break traction, it's a matter of free wheeling to keep it from going over the side when it went into a skid. The older guys used to give me crap for running so conservative.........but I'm still here to talk about it.

You got the front drivers chained up. Coming downhill against the Jake you'd keep an eye on the drivers. If it looked like the drivers were starting to run in reverse, it meant that they'd broken loose, and were skidding. Hit the throttle, and the Johnson Bar at the same time, and the trailer brakes would straighten you out. I got paid by the load, so it was my call on how fast I wanted to make the trip. But I got home every night I ran that damn load. During ski season I'd run up to 3 times a week. The bars did a roaring trade during ski season...........lotta mixed drinks I guess. Coming back empty was where the pucker factor came into play.

About a month after I left that job, the next guy ran the truck into the back of a snowplow out around Limon.

 

[flying belgian]

The only tractor I have to run in the Mn winter is my CX-100 with front end loader and that stays in a 50 degree shop with 40 gallon tank of #2 fuel. No additives, No blended fuel.

 

[Scott 730]

I also use Howes or Diesel 911, whichever is on sale when I stock up

911 is intended to be an emergency treatment only. It is not for regular use. Our local pump guy says people that misuse 911 do a good job of keeping his family fed. IE: it is hard on pumps if overused.

 

[jhwis]

Any anti gel added to fuel? The low sulfur does gel easier. I use Howes in my pickup and tractor every tank all winter. Cheap insurance against fuel gelling. I know stations claim fuel is blended for winter use, but I want to be sure.

Just start running #1 fuel in the fall.