Harbor Freight (Predator) engines

[buzz saw]

What's the good, bad, and ugly on Predator engines, specifically the 22 HP verticle V-Twin. Thinking about putting one on my lawn tractor, the reviews on line talk about installation and such, but no info as far as longevity, parts availability, etc. Evidently they are a Honda clone, made in China.

 

[Steve@Advance]

Haven't heard anything bad about them.

Parts will be limited to the very basic tune up/consumable items, unless something has changed in the last few years.

I worked on one last week, it had a clogged carb from sitting outside unused for a couple years. The carb was very simple, easy to clean, no hidden passages. It cleaned up, started and ran like a champ, no parts needed.

 

[ivan in michigan]

I have a smaller one on my tiller and it is going on 3 years with no problems. It is the easiest starting engine I have ever had

 

[jeffcat]

The smaller engines are almost direct Honda knock off copies. You can
go shopping on Ebay for almost anything you need. Don't know about the
big engines. Do know the small ones are like a rock. I wouldn't
hesitate.

 

[marloweg]

they are as good as Honda if not better have 6 of all sizes .parts ? never needed any. have to say did get a bad on last week bought a 8750 watt generator engine ran fine just would not produce any electric took it back got new one works fine

 

[tractorguy2]

I have cleaned the carb on a few for other people. I sure would like to know where one could get carb gaskets or a kit for one? Sooner or later I will need gaskets.

 

[ptfarmer]

Some go kart racers use Predator engines, they even have high performance, hi rpm racing parts for some of those engines.

 

[Gambles]

Got a Toro zero-turn mower for next to nothing because it had a Kohler Courage engine in it that decided to blow a hole through the side. (The Kohler Courage does NOT have a good reputation, BTW) Got a Predator 22-HP vertical for $549. I needed a coupon to get it for that price. Good luck finding that coupon, as they are now about $200 higher.
I have no complaints with that engine.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

The Courage has given Kohler a bad reputation.

I have a 20 hp Kohler Command approaching 2000 hours and it doesn't use oil.

When my Kohler command needs replaced, I'll replace it with another Kohler command. Too much hassle adapting a different engine.

If you are looking at saving money the predator is the way to go.

Good chance everything today in made in CHINA.

 

[Mutt and Jeff]

cheap Chinese garbage
buy american
put the tariffs where they count
into the pockets of shrewd american nationalists

 

[buzz saw]

Thanks for the info guys, it is very helpful.

 

[Gambles]

I'll advocate buying American or at least North American before Chinese any day, but the price of a Kohler Courage SHORT BLOCK was much higher than the Harbor Freight engine.I'm just saying my engine slipped right in and the only thing I had to buy was a longer throttle cable. There was a question about the 22 HP Harbor Freight engine and I answered it. BTW, most of your Kohler and BS engines have a plethora of Chinese parts.

 

[Texasmark1]

Don't know about the V twins but put a Predator side by side with an American made engine and you'll quickly see the differences. Sorry but facts
don't lie. That's my take on the oriental mind. They play with a design till it's perfect. We don't do that. Case in point is look at what Toyota and
Datsun did to the American automobile market and why. Pay attention to what comes/came as standard equipment and look at US production standard
equipment at the time! Facts don't lie.

Most current mainframes are stamped in a 10" bolt circle with mounting holes for singles and V twins. On conversion, like I did on my Husqvarna with
the OEM Courage single, is that the throttle and choke cable is the only thing that I had to change since the carb is on the left side on a single and in
front on a V twin.

 

[JGayman]

> I'll advocate buying American or at least North American before Chinese any day, but the price of a Kohler Courage SHORT BLOCK was much higher than the Harbor Freight engine.I'm just saying my engine slipped right in and the only thing I had to buy was a longer throttle cable. There was a question about the 22 HP Harbor Freight engine and I answered it. BTW, most of your Kohler and BS engines have a plethora of Chinese parts.

The Predator engines can NOT be any worse than the 17.5HP B&S engine in my Ariens riding mower. It has already cost me $100 to fix because of the cheap pot metal construction of the cam shaft compression release mechanism which didn't last more than 25 hrs. That combined with plastic bushings, a wristwatch sized spring and a plastic governor gear pretty much limits the life on these things.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

I wouldn't spend a dime on a Kohler courage. Kohler command or Kohler command pro only.

I have a Kohler command single cylinder on a 30+ old Craftsman lawn mower. The mower deck has long fell apart. Motor is like new. I use it to pull my home made brush hog.

 

[Russ from MN]

If you buy clean fuel and keep it clean like the old fuel caps used to say you should never have to take a carburetor apart. I just got done changing oil on our Husqvarna with a Kawasaki, its 17 years old and the carb has never been touched, and it has cut a lot of grass in those 17 years. I adjusted the valves last year, they were off just a little, didn't need any new gaskets for that either. And, I run E10 gas in all our 4-stroke engines!

 

[Joe W.]

Texasmark1 - I don't mean to sound dense although in this case I may be. I don't know your conclusion. Which engine is best? Twice you said that "facts don't lie" but I don't know your facts. It appears that most responses sided with the Harbor Freight engine but what was your conclusion? I'm considering replacing a 14 HP Briggs & Stratton engine on a lawn mower but don't know if the Harbor Freight engine is "best".

 

[T.R.K.]

They will work as well as any until you need to repair something. So far, I have a straight row of failures trying to source parts for any
Chinese engine. Wrong parts: High Priced carburetor ($125+shipping) (Carburetor Didn't work either-starved for gas.) Wrong cylinder head.
etc.

I guess you could call the H.F. toll free number and talk to someone who barely understands English. I did that once.

One thing: Most of those engines don't use as good an air filter system as the Honda, either. Not meant to last.

 

[jeffcat]

Nothing like leftovers from a Snapper Hy- Vac machine. By the way does it have those little air wing things that bolt to the blade. Wow do they ever make it snort and really throw those clippings.

 

[Texasmark1]

"They will work as well as any until you need to repair something." Better........... and if it breaks and you can buy a new 6.5 hp for a hundred bucks and walk into a HF store and pick it up with no shipping and no tax if used in an ag. application......why replace something costing what the whole machine costs when the rest of the machine is worn out and you may miss on your guess as to why the machine failed requiring more parts to buy while waiting for something else to fail.

With that said, I have a dozen BS engines and one Predator mounted on the last piece of small equipment I purchased. The rest of the BS engines are running as they were designed...just fine. However, should one need a replacement, I'm not above going with a Predator for replacement.....would probably be the direction.

 

[Texasmark1]

Facts are what you see with the engines sitting side by side and running and working. What you experience are facts and they don't lie like might be the case in a spec sheet or something somebody (like me) says about an experience they once may have had.

 

[Butch(OH)]

They are not the full equal of a Honda but plenty close enough for most uses. The vast bulk of what I heave seen cause them to fail to run will cause any engine to fail in same manner, left sitting for long periods with old fuel, left outside, mouse damage etc.
Every part for the HF engines is available for very cheap money if one knows where to look. One very good source is Ebay. I just redid a 6.5 HP Preator that had been sitting forever outside and had a mouse nest in it. Carburetor, fuel lines, wiring harness and oil sensor sold as a kit, $12.99 shipped to the house. Coil, $9.98 shipped to the house. Complete starter assembly $10.99 shipped.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

Show me an "American Made" small engine.

 

[Texasmark1]

BS! As I recall BS is the largest seller of small engines in the world.

 

[buzz saw]

Update to my original post and question. Found an old Briggs opposed twin, like what i'm replacing, at a mower shop locally. Bought the whole mower for $25, pulled engine, removed heads, cylinder walls look OK, removed, lapped valves and set clearance. Gaskets on the way. Should be an OK runner to get by with for a few years. The engine I'm replacing dropped a valve seat last year upon which I staked it back in place...lasted a year and failed again. This replacement engine has good tight seats. Beats spending several hundred on a new engine, we shall see.

 

[digruprguy]

I went into Harbor Freight to buy a 22 hp V-Twin for my dead lawn tractor with an opposed Briggs twin and there was one on the shelf so I got the manager and said I wanted it. He looked out back and said he didn't have one. I said "there's one right there" he said it's a display model and I can't sell that one. I said "A display model of what? What you don't have in stock? Sell it to me then you really won't have it in stock" There are no engines in that class and price range in the USA and Harbor Freight has at least one in every store just sitting on the shelf and because it is a display model of what they don't have they won't sell them. Now is that the American Way? Bunch of Hoarders!

 

[thdrduck]

I can the 6.5 is a peach of a motor (I've had 3). I have never had any issue other than the old gas thing. If it won't start, you probably forgot to flip the switch on. One I have now was on a long tail boat motor and now does duty powering a pressure washer. It's had a hard life and still runs perfect.

Reliable, sip gas, don't break down. Screw Kohler and Briggs. Last 2 of those I had were junk. I buy American when it makes sense. When it comes to small engines... Honda first, Predator second, and it's close to a tie.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

(quoted from post at 12:22:42 06/23/21) I went into Harbor Freight to buy a 22 hp V-Twin for my dead lawn tractor with an opposed Briggs twin and there was one on the shelf so I got the manager and said I wanted it. He looked out back and said he didn't have one. I said "there's one right there" he said it's a display model and I can't sell that one. I said "A display model of what? What you don't have in stock? Sell it to me then you really won't have it in stock" There are no engines in that class and price range in the USA and Harbor Freight has at least one in every store just sitting on the shelf and because it is a display model of what they don't have they won't sell them. Now is that the American Way? Bunch of Hoarders!

Nope, the American Way is selling you the display model that has been picked and poked and fiddled with by God knows how many people, is missing God knows what (and HF doesn't stock parts), has been turned over God knows how many times WITHOUT OIL. Then you can come back in FULL-KAREN mode demanding to speak to the manager about the no-good, piece of junk engine that they sold you, only because you DEMANDED they sell it to you.