Heavyweight

[mshultz]

Here's a picture of our M about a month ago at the West End Fair in Laurelton PA weighted up to 12,000. Sorry it's a bit fuzzy. I think dad got 4th or 5th out of about 25 tractors in the 3mph pace class.

I know some were some people wondering where to put the weight about a month ago, so I took a picture. There is a belly bar back under the brakes that is filled with ford weights, the front belly bar where you can see some of the wheel weights hanging, and a bar inside the wheels that runs parallel with the wheels and is welded fast to the front of the wheelie bar axle bracket where we can fit about 5-6 weights/side. There's also a bar across the back with probably 10 weights on it and room to spare on this day.

We've had it up to 14,000 and done well too, but that's a whole lot of hassle and they've changed the rules at this pull to keep top cuts out above 12,000 - so we don't bother changing tires and adding the weight to jump up for just one class.

PS - I've never posted a picture before, so if this doesn’t work I'll have to try again another day....

 

[PretendFarmer]

Wow. Thats impressive. Makes me wonder if I can stack enough weight on my low geared H to get into 8000lbs class. Also 3mph.

 

[mshultz]

Our H is in the backround, and we pull it up to 9000 in some pulls in 3mph and a regular 1st gear with top cut 16.9x34's. Basically equipped just like the M as far a weight bars go. We can get to 9 without any wheel weights on the H, but the front belly is full of wheel weights. Still easier to handle than putting them on the wheels in our opinion.

 

[PretendFarmer]

Could you post up some more detailed pictures of that? I would like to see how you weight up your H.

 

[Bud Kaiser]

What kind of hp and cubic inces are you running?
Where I pull my stock 60 hp 450 in T/A low can only pull 8600 without powering out. Neever seen a SH make it past 6600 lbs and that was with a low gear.

 

[Bryant Garland]

How long is your chain?

 

[mshultz]

I honestly don't remember the CID of the H - somewhere close to an original stock M (w/ 3 7/8" bore) is all I remember. We had it on a dyno a few years ago and it peaked around 85 hp. It has had some major head work since then, but it hasn't been back on a dyno since. We know it runs better than it did before the head work.

 

[PretendFarmer]

(quoted from post at 19:28:24 09/12/13) How long is your chain?

You do know that longer chains make it harder to pull good right?

 

[MMZAck]

I would hate to arm wrestle you. It must take a pretty strong set of arms to steer with all that weight.

Zack

 

[mshultz]

This is the same sled we pull 9000 with. There are shorter, and there are longer I suppose.
Beaver Fair pull

 

[mark49]

Thanks for sharing a pic of a good central PA tractor Mike. Both of these tractors kicked my butt at West End. I'll see you at the Beaver Fair.

Mark G.

 

[north puller]

Short chains take power. Long chains give the low powered
tractors a chance.

The difference between a short chain and a long chain is prob a
gear lower.

With a short chain and a good track, most true stock tractors
run out of steam in low gear.

A short chain, a tight track, and a pile of front end weight, and
that low geared h of yours might really put on a show.

 

[DC-PA]

Nice looking M, They are made to haul heavy, Look at this M weighing about 25000, has been weighted to 35000 once

 

[PretendFarmer]

(quoted from post at 01:25:28 09/13/13) Short chains take power. Long chains give the low powered
tractors a chance.

The difference between a short chain and a long chain is prob a
gear lower.

With a short chain and a good track, most true stock tractors
run out of steam in low gear.

A short chain, a tight track, and a pile of front end weight, and
that low geared h of yours might really put on a show.

I will (respectfully) disagree with you all day. A short chain increases draft(downward force) on the tractor. This enables all tractors to pull better if they have enough weight on the front to keep it down.
A long chain puts less draft on the tractor. Weights need to be applied appropriately for this as well. More in the back, less in the front.
If a tractor powered out due to a shorter chain and more traction, then it didnt have the power to begin with and with the longer chain, probably spun out very easily.
Even in a low geared tractor, if I start spinning tires it is usually game over unless I catch it quick enough and apply brakes accordingly.
Bigger power is good for more track speed. A more powerful tractor can pull the sled faster. More momentum can get the sled to blow through things that at a slower speed you might not.
I've pulled with a 4ft (thats right, four foot) chain and I did not power out. Had the tractor up to 7000 ( seven thousand) pounds.

So in summary, a long chain makes it harder to pull good because you have less draft on the tractor which in turn makes it harder to grab the track.

 

[Massey farmer]

The second best way to loose crowds and interest in antique tractor pulling is to not limit hooks and let the same tractors put on more weight, then come back time after time and have a 8 hour pull or more. The best way to loose interest in antique tractor pulling is letting ultra low geared tractors hook time and time again without a hook limit.

 

[Massey farmer]

25,000? That would be almost 200 100lb weights hanging on it? What class would you weigh that heavy for? Weighed up to 35,000 once?? My front end loader with a round bale on it makes my narrow front tires squat, yours must be flat. Don't tell me you pulled in with a half ton pickup and a 7000lb trailer lol.

 

[mshultz]

I'd agree at an antique pull - hook limits help keep anyone from running away with the show, and our local clubs mostly have hook limits. The pulls we pull heavy are not antique pulls - they are pulls at some local fairs. The H has won 9000 several times against IH 666's, Case 870's, JD 4020's, etc. The M has won the 12,000 once, and the 14,000 once, and is almost always in the top 5 (not bragging - just saying). The M competes very well with IH 1066's and similar tractors of other makes. For a stretch of probably 15 years, I'd say that an M won the 14,000 (several different ones) 3mph class at the West End fair 70-80% of the time before the top-cut rule above 14,000 knocked us all out (not complaining - just saying). The stands were packed for the 14,000 pace class to see the M's pull against the bigger tractorss, and then the croud would thin out for 16,000 & 18,000 pace classes when the M's bowed out. A lot of people hang around to watch the H pull against the bigger stuff. It definitely doesn't turn spectarors away.

 

[DAVE Thompson jr]

To pull that heavy of a class you must be pulling on one heck of a long chain and a very loose track. In the 7500 class I have to run third gear with my M and on a very good track like Wauseon Ohio have to drop down to 2nd gear. That is a lot of weight you must really have some gear reduction going on.

 

[mshultz]

Mark,

Dad will probably be at Beaver - the Thursday night deal kills me. We have an FFA meeting thursday night, and I'm afraid I'll fall asleep in my own classes on Friday if I stayed out that late!

It's not really worth the time to argue with some of these guys is it? We went to Tallmadge 2 years ago and placed 2nd in the 4500 Div III, and 5th in the 5,000 (less than a foot from 1st) and beat all but 1 M in the class. Every track at home pulls harder than that track did at most pulls - even the "bad" ones. I've heard it is one of the weaker NATPA tracks - ok - that's nice. But we could easily turn 18.4 x 34's with the H there in 2nd gear in 5500. We had the only H there with 18.4's on that I noticed, and there's not many guys that take their M's much above 5500 at those pulls. I proably wouldn't haul all over the country hauling an extra ton or more along either so I understand that too. It's just funny to see how people react to things just because they don't see it in their neck of the woods.

 

[D-Day]

Exactly. That's why years ago the semis pulled a much longer chain, so the sleds could stop them. Longer chain = less draft and harder to pull. It doesn't take as much power to turn the tires with a longer chain, but it does make it more into a driver's class in some cases when a tough spot takes some finesse to get through. With the short chain, you can "carry" more of the weight, which gives better draft. You can also carry more of the weight with a shorter hitch, since it pulls down more directly on the rear end and less leverage on the front end. The one thing to watch for with the short hitch length is, of course, your front end will come up much more quickly and at that point, wheelie bars are mandatory in my book.

We also pull 4 foot chain around here (SW Penn.) all the time. The local antique club runs a 6 ft. chain and it really messes you up if you're used to the 4 footer. The front ends seem glued to the ground with the 6 ft. chain, at least until you compensate.

 

[NOS88]

What is the point and for what reason would anyone want to throw that much weight??!!

 

[Buckeye Oliver collector]

Looks like a good way to break a rim off. Think I'd rather have an 806 or larger for a 12,000 class if I had to pull something red.

 

[mark49]

At the local club pulls in central PA 6ft chains are fairly common. At the fair pulls, 4ft is the norm. I've been to a few NATPA pulls in Ohio and haven't noticed any difference in weight placement compared to what we run. The M in the picture and the H behind it are strong runners.

 

[Bob 7337]

I have to hand it too you guys on the pulling stories. I have been laughing reading this set of post.The sled you are pulling must be pushing the tractor. Sled cant weigh much. A m farmall m outpulling a 4020 or a 1066. Funny.
I farm and pull local too. Take those tractors and hook on a sled with a short chain and 20 inch hitch and see if you can do something.
Arround here a 5000 antique that dont have a 100 horse is lucky not to make a fool out of himself.
Maybe someone would be will to bring that high powered supper H over and hook to my plow and give my 10 a butt whopping.

 

[Bob 7337]

its a wonder the whole tractor dont break in half

 

[DC-PA]

Was dead weight pull called King of Mountain, was no rules just for fun, JD's dominated at 25000 till I came with the M with 35000, then they made lot of rules,. was no weight classes just last pull who went the farthest won. Front tires had 70lb air and was half flat, had 20 wheel weights on each back wheel too, plus lot suitcase weights to get to 35000, tractor was about 8000 with no weights, was fun for while. Here is pic of rear for 25000 time.

 

[KCfromPA]

Don"t sweat it Mike. Haters are going to hate. I think I may have some pics of John pulling his M up in the 16000lb. class. Also most of these classes there is a total of 30 to 40 tractors in the heavier classes and 40 to 50 in the lighter classes. My opinion the sled at West End fair is a harder pulling sled in our area. I think they do run about a 4 foot chain as well. They also groom the track so you get good bite. With running a 20 inch drawbar you need more wieght in areas that you normally wouldn"t run anywhere else. The Shult"s H and M are not slouches. They are both are very competitive. If you get close enough or get lucky to beat them you had a good day.

 

[PretendFarmer]

Just got done with a transfer sled pull yesterday. Pulled 4500lbs, 5000lbs, 5500lbs, 6500lbs and 8000lbs. Powered out in the 8000lbs class. It isn't running right though. I think the valve lash is out of adjustment. It would've powered out anyways but I wouldve gone farther. 233' 10". The winning pull was about 260'. I pulled farther than John Deere 60's.

Behind the gray weights are two 80lbs weights. She weighed in at 7960lbs. If it wasn't an X1A H, never would've happened.

 

[mshultz]

Pictures of our weight brackets on the H for you, but it looks like you've already put some together. The 1st picture is of the two belly bars. The 2nd is of how the rear bar attaches to the drawbar assembly for easy removal for light classes, and the 3rd is a close up of that same rear bar as it attaches to the drawbar. (if they all load....)

 

[mshultz]

Here's another M. This one was weighted up to 14,000 for this picture I'm pretty sure. This tractor won this class over 50% of the the for a period of about 15 years I'd guess.
Shively M 14,000

 

[Brian Feeser]

I have also seen Dan Shook pull his M in 14000 before at the Grange Fair and do very well. Some of these guys need to come to Central PA and pull with some of these "little" tractors. I agree you can consider your night pretty dang good if you get past Shultz's H. I've seen allot of M's that don't compare.

 

[PretendFarmer]

(quoted from post at 04:59:03 09/17/13) I have also seen Dan Shook pull his M in 14000 before at the Grange Fair and do very well. Some of these guys need to come to Central PA and pull with some of these "little" tractors. I agree you can consider your night pretty dang good if you get past Shultz's H. I've seen allot of M's that don't compare.

The M's that I competed with all lost to me.

 

[DJBoop]

My M always pulls against the Shultz in central PA and I helped with this hook. The length of the chain is a little longer but the track is a complete power track. Everyone knows that when they come to the West End Fair. In this picture I"m only weighted up for the 10,000 pound class but I was in the top 5 with Shultz out of 15 tractors. We beat a lot of strong running diesel tractors in the pace class. My dad did pull the M in 12,000 but ran light because I was running my 1066 in that class also (which I won ) so we didn"t have enough weights. But I will have to say that central PA does have some very competitive tractors that can run against anyone anywhere.

 

[PretendFarmer]

Is that M stock? Low gear option?

 

[DJBoop]

stock M gears in mine