help

[jesse to30]

i have a to 30 and im having problems woth a lot of things, it is surgeing and i just replaced the starter it ran good for about 30 mins then the distributor starting coming out but everything was tight. now i had to remove the distributor to get the starter off could i have messed up the timing need some help please

 

[Jerry/MT]

Slow down and lets figure out your problem. You say that your distributor is "comming out". Are you sure that you put the distributor all the way down into the drive gear on the cam when you reinstalled the distributor? Check that first.

Sometimes the cam gear loosens and that causes the cam, which drives the distributor, to want to pop out but it won"t be able to do that if it"s bolted down. So there is upward pressure on the distributor shaft. Does that sound like your condition? If it does, you"ll have to take the timing cover off and tighten down the cam nut that holds the gear on. You"ll need to fix that before you worry about the timing.

 

[jesse to30]

yes it does sond like it but im pretty sure that it was seated right and im sure it was bolted down the dist. sits in a bracket wich tightens around it and then to the block when it was cranking over the dist. was moving but i couldnt tighten it anymore. could it have anything to do with a 12 volt battery on a 6 volt system thanks soo much not very familiar with this motor

 

[jesse to30]

also when i ake the dist. out i cant spin it by hand anymore guess i fried it????

 

[Jerry/MT]

It sounds like you cam is moving and that"s pushing up on the distributor shaft. this has nothing to do with 6V or 12V. It has to do with either wear on the thrust plate or a loose thrust plate.I initially said that the cam gear night be loose but that"s not the case. You"ll have to remove the timing cover to get at the plate that holds the camshaft in. There is a thrust surface on it that must be really worn or the thrust plate is loose. You"ll need to take the radiator off, get a puller to remove the crankshaft pulley and the disconnect the governor linkage and remove the timing cover.

I think you have to pull the cam gear to get access to the thrust plate, but maybe not since there are two holes in the gear that may allow you to get at the bolts that hold the thrust plate in. If it"s loose then you"ll just have to tighten it down. If it"s not loose, then you"ll have to remove the cam gear and replace the thrust plate.

I gather you don"t have shop manual or a parts manual. I"d strongly advise you to get one before you attempt this repair. It"s not a tough one but it"ll be easier if you have a shop manual instead of running to the PC to ask a question. You can get a shop manual for about $20.

 

[Jim in OH]

(quoted from post at 20:21:00 12/13/07) also when i ake the dist. out i cant spin it by hand anymore guess i fried it????

Jesse... I wouldn't be too quick to conclude it was a "cam nut"/camshaft problem... Your clue above suggests to me that it may be as simple as a seized bushings in the distributor... if the distrubutor turns too hard, it can be forced out...

Remove the distributor and with penetration oil, try to get the distribitor rotating again.. it may be as simple as getting it lubricated.. And you didn't "fry" the distributor... applied voltage (6 or 12 volt) will not cause a seized bearing.....

YOu must now get it back in at the correct timing.. but since you have had it out, I'll assume that is not a problem...

 

[jesse to30]

thank you soo much

 

[jesse to30]

thanks a lot

 

[ron8n9n]

it is very common for ferg distributors to sieze up due to broken parts, and ruin the camshaft.
The dist must be rebuilt to new specs. Do not delay. need help?? contact me

 

[Stan/TX]

Having just dealt with this situation on my TO20 I will jump in with my 2 cents. I destroyed 2 distributors in like manner before I ran across the problem and started on the fix. If you take the distributor apart you will probably find that the weights on the advance mechanism have broken and seized your distributor shaft. It is then a very short trip for the camshaft to literally push the distributor out of the engine block regardless of how tight you have it bolted down. There is just too much energy and power for it to stay put. You have probably also chipped or damaged your camshaft gears that run the distributor. If you install another distributor before checking all this out and fixing any problems you will void any warranty you have on any distributor you buy.

And I quote from the standard warranty on distributors:

[b:92f5105e1f]"Installation instructions for 182852M91-TP replacement distributor for Massey Ferguson

Before installing this NEW replacement distributor, the camshaft must be checked for the following:

1. The end play of the camshaft must be within OEM specifications of (0.003"-0.007") end play.
2. The backlash of the camshaft timing gears must not be greater than OEM specifications of (0.002").
3. The distributor drive gear on the camshaft must be in good condition.

Any of the above conditions that are out of OEM specification will cause excessive distributor shaft vibration. The excessive vibration will cause early failure of the internal parts of the distributor. (Early failure can occur within less than ten minutes of running time.)

WARNING!!

Installing this distributor in an engine with the camshaft and time gears not to OEM specification will void the warranty of this distributor."[/b:92f5105e1f]

They are serious when they say it only takes 10 minutes of running time to destroy the distributor - I speak from experience - and at $150-$200 per you can go through some money very fast.

What happens is any movement - endplay, backlash, etc - between/in the timing gears and/or camshaft translates to a hammer effect on the distributor shaft and the component parts attached and turning with it. The weights/advance mechanism WILL come apart under these hammer type forces and seize the distributor shaft.

I share this not because I am infinitely wise about my TO20, but because some very experienced people from this forum shared with me - some of them have posted to this message. The older - I mean OLDER - tractor mechanics I talked with immediately knew what my problem was.

It is best to drop the oil pan and all those oil system parts so you can get a good look at the camshaft. If the distributor drive gears are chipped, grooved, etc. in any way you are looking at a camshaft replacement. It is not as hard as you may think and yes it can be done without removing the engine and turning it upside down - I have just completed doing it. It is not easy, but with someone helping you it is doable.

As you diagnose this problem you will learn a lot about your Fergie. I found that the governor on mine was not working at all. You will learn a lot - get a good set of manuals - you will need them. Read them, read them, read them and then ask tons of questions. The people here will help you any way they can.

And oh, how can I say this about your TO30 when I have a TO20 - they use the same engine and shop manuals.

Good luck - contact me - I'll be glad to share what information I can.