Intermittent spark

[Twisted_Steel]

1950 Ferguson TO20 Z-120 Continental engine that was converted to 12 volts a couple owners back.
I've put on new coil, points and condenser. I get a good blue spark at the #1 plug but with regularity.
It won't fire to start up.
I've read on here and other forums/websites as to the problems that cause this. All say the usual culprits I've already replaced.
This thing is driving me nuts.

 

[used red MN]

1950 Ferguson TO20 Z-120 Continental engine that was converted to 12 volts a couple owners back.
I've put on new coil, points and condenser. I get a good blue spark at the #1 plug but with regularity.
It won't fire to start up.
I've read on here and other forums/websites as to the problems that cause this. All say the usual culprits I've already replaced.
This thing is driving me nuts.

Was it a running tractor before? Asking because it needs gas to run has this side of the equation been checked out?? You have 10 plus threads about your ignition but the only thing I see about the fuel is that you dumped a can of Sea Foam in the tank. You had driven it around prior to this and it died on you, then you thought you smelled burnt wires and installed some looms to prevent the wires from shorting. Could very well be that this drive you went on was one of the first times the tractor had been driven much. This sloshed the fuel around stirring up crud in the tank, now that crud has blocked the fuel flow to the carb. Pull the drain plug out of the bottom of the carb and see if gas comes out, and continues to flow in at least a pencil lead sized stream after the plug has been out for 5 seconds. Do this and report back.
Editing to add: I’m saying you have good spark and you are just not seeing it consistently even though it is there. You can continue to blame the ignition but if no fuel is getting into the engine it will not run.

 

[old]

1950 Ferguson TO20 Z-120 Continental engine that was converted to 12 volts a couple owners back.
I've put on new coil, points and condenser. I get a good blue spark at the #1 plug but with regularity.
It won't fire to start up.
I've read on here and other forums/websites as to the problems that cause this. All say the usual culprits I've already replaced.
This thing is driving me nuts.

Learn to trouble shoot before parts. New parts only cover up problems. Run a hot wire from the ignition side of the battery to the coil ignition/distributor side and see if that makes it run. If it does the problem is from the coil back to the battery things like bad wire or ignition switch that is bad

 

[Twisted_Steel]

Was it a running tractor before? Asking because it needs gas to run has this side of the equation been checked out?? You have 10 plus threads about your ignition but the only thing I see about the fuel is that you dumped a can of Sea Foam in the tank. You had driven it around prior to this and it died on you, then you thought you smelled burnt wires and installed some looms to prevent the wires from shorting. Could very well be that this drive you went on was one of the first times the tractor had been driven much. This sloshed the fuel around stirring up crud in the tank, now that crud has blocked the fuel flow to the carb. Pull the drain plug out of the bottom of the carb and see if gas comes out, and continues to flow in at least a pencil lead sized stream after the plug has been out for 5 seconds. Do this and report back.
Editing to add: I’m saying you have good spark and you are just not seeing it consistently even though it is there. You can continue to blame the ignition but if no fuel is getting into the engine it will not run.

Yes, it has fuel. To make sure that wasn't the problem I even shot some ether into the intake tube at the carb to make sure it wasn't a fuel issue. Still nothing.

 

[Twisted_Steel]

Was it a running tractor before? Asking because it needs gas to run has this side of the equation been checked out?? You have 10 plus threads about your ignition but the only thing I see about the fuel is that you dumped a can of Sea Foam in the tank. You had driven it around prior to this and it died on you, then you thought you smelled burnt wires and installed some looms to prevent the wires from shorting. Could very well be that this drive you went on was one of the first times the tractor had been driven much. This sloshed the fuel around stirring up crud in the tank, now that crud has blocked the fuel flow to the carb. Pull the drain plug out of the bottom of the carb and see if gas comes out, and continues to flow in at least a pencil lead sized stream after the plug has been out for 5 seconds. Do this and report back.
Editing to add: I’m saying you have good spark and you are just not seeing it consistently even though it is there. You can continue to blame the ignition but if no fuel is getting into the engine it will not run.

Yes, tractor was running when I bought it. It has about 5 gallons in the tank. I drove it around before buying it and maybe a mile and a half after I got it home. It quit in the yard. I smelled burning wires and found the ballast resistor was cooked. I took an emory board and gently cleaned the points after inspecting them because of the carbon buildup. It ran for about 15-20 minutes and just quit again. I put in a new set gapped at .022
I bench tested the coil against a new one and it showed good. I retested it again a couple days later and the ohms were way off. Evidently the heat cycles were making it show good then bad.
I'll go in a bit to get some new plug wires. I don't know the age of the ones on it.

 

[Twisted_Steel]

Learn to trouble shoot before parts. New parts only cover up problems. Run a hot wire from the ignition side of the battery to the coil ignition/distributor side and see if that makes it run. If it does the problem is from the coil back to the battery things like bad wire or ignition switch that is bad

Ran the jumper wire...nothing. Gave it a shot of ether and hit it again...nothing. I'm betting the problem is downstream of the points. Maybe the new wires I'm heading out to pick up will help.
I took out all the plugs, grounded them and hit the starter. 2 are firing blue and regular. The #1 and #3 plugs are more orange and misfiring bad. Pulled the plugs out and fire from the end of the plug wire to the block is good at 2 and 4 and bad at 1 and 3.

 

[used red MN]

Yes, it has fuel.

HOW WAS THIS DETERMINED? A spritz of starting fluid into the carb on an engine that has not just been running does not tell ME that fuel is not the problem.
What took us from this on May 7 “I used my wife's old emory board and cleaned the points, reinserted them, set them to .020 and she fired right up.” to a not running situation?
What do the spark plugs look like?

 

[used red MN]

In my opinion for us all to get on the same page get yourself a gap type spark tester many auto parts stores carry them. Example adjustable spark tester Set that to a 1/4” and test your spark and report back. FYI, a spark requires a higher voltage to jump a gap under compression thus the 1/4” setting assures that the smaller gap on the plug will be fired across. Points type ignitions when all is good easily fire an 1/4” open air gap.
Just one other question, you have not removed and replaced the distributor since it last run is this correct?

 

[Twisted_Steel]

In my opinion for us all to get on the same page get yourself a gap type spark tester many auto parts stores carry them. Example adjustable spark tester Set that to a 1/4” and test your spark and report back. FYI, a spark requires a higher voltage to jump a gap under compression thus the 1/4” setting assures that the smaller gap on the plug will be fired across. Points type ignitions when all is good easily fire an 1/4” open air gap.
Just one other question, you have not removed and replaced the distributor since it last run is this correct?

No. Never pulled out the distributor. It only turned with little to no effort.I've since replaced the nut and bolt and it doesn't move without loosening the nut. I have an in-line spark checker...non adjustable. I'll check for the adjustable one at a local Napa after supper.

 

[Twisted_Steel]

HOW WAS THIS DETERMINED? A spritz of starting fluid into the carb on an engine that has not just been running does not tell ME that fuel is not the problem.
What took us from this on May 7 “I used my wife's old emory board and cleaned the points, reinserted them, set them to .020 and she fired right up.” to a not running situation?
What do the spark plugs look like?

Plugs look good. Since May 7 we've gone on a vacation and went to a few Dr's appointments.
It fired up and ran for about 15-20 minutes after cleaning the points and died again. And this is where we are.
Opened the bowl plug and got a good stream of gas. No trash or water whatsoever.

 

[old]

Ran the jumper wire...nothing. Gave it a shot of ether and hit it again...nothing. I'm betting the problem is downstream of the points. Maybe the new wires I'm heading out to pick up will help.
I took out all the plugs, grounded them and hit the starter. 2 are firing blue and regular. The #1 and #3 plugs are more orange and misfiring bad. Pulled the plugs out and fire from the end of the plug wire to the block is good at 2 and 4 and bad at 1 and 3.

Put the old condenser back in and try it common now days to have a new condenser to be bad right out of the box

 

[Twisted_Steel]

Will do. I got the points and condenser at a local Kubota dealer. Don't know if that is a good or bad thing..lol

 

[Steve in VA]

1950 Ferguson TO20 Z-120 Continental engine that was converted to 12 volts a couple owners back.
I've put on new coil, points and condenser. I get a good blue spark at the #1 plug but with regularity.
It won't fire to start up.
I've read on here and other forums/websites as to the problems that cause this. All say the usual culprits I've already replaced.
This thing is driving me nuts.

This is a long shot but old Land Rovers would wear the bushing in the distributor allowing the cam to move around enough to affect the point gap producing similar results to your description. A quick test would be to simply pull the cap and see if the rotor has slop. Could be. Cheap and easy check.

 

[wh]

IF you have gas flow to cylinders and fire thru the plug and it is in time it will run. Are the plugs wet from gas? Is your plugs actually firing in the cylinders? Have had plugs go bad and not fire in cylinder.

 

[RobCons]

I have a JD 400 Industrial gasser that had a similar problem once. Chased it for a while. Turns out the 12v primary wire from the distributor to the coil had a break in it. It would make contact then loose it depending on the bump I hit. Replaced that wire and solved the problem. Point is to check your 12v wires and ignition switch.

 

[miner09]

Check the battery ground where it’s bolted to tractor. Ground is very important. Some people over look this. You can take jumper cables make sure it makes good contact to tractor and go to battery ground. See what happens.