JD 2640 hydraulics problem

[willyp]

On my 2640 tractor the hydraulics have almost quit,the steering and the pto work good but the 3 point is slow and the remotes will only pickup real slow,put a pressure gauge in it and it read 1500 lbs.Changed the filter and cleaned the screen,what and how do I check it further? Thanks

 

[RodinNS]

Sounds like a problem with the stroke control on the pump... That's where I'd start anyhow. If it was stroking correctly it should make system pressure without flow (high stand-by). Otherwise the system releif is opening prematurely or there is a major problem with the main pump or large leak in the system.
If there was a large leak you should notice steering problems and some real heat buildup in the hydraulic oil...

Rod

 

[Tx Jim]

willyp
Where did you take stand-by pressure reading?? If at breakaway coupler on the rear then the pressure control valve(photo) could be the problem especially since you stated power steering works. Faulty/stuck pressure control valve can stop/slow down oil flow to rockshaft & SCV.

 

[buickanddeere]

System relief valve? What system relief valve?

 

[buickanddeere]

. If operated until the screen or filter is plugged. There is a chance of breaking a line as the divert valve chatters. The relief or divert valves maybe stuck.

 

[Tx Jim]

(quoted from post at 10:46:54 06/25/12) System relief valve? What system relief valve?

Ah buickanddeere Rod's more familiar with the blue colored tractors. I think he has CCLS & closed center hyd systems confused.

 

[theoldtexasfarmer]

I had a similar problem with my 2440.It was a leaking hydraulic line under the transmission cover,going to the hydraulic pto clutch.I was told it i a common problem with these tractors as the line vibrates a hole in the line.

 

[RodinNS]

Ahhh. Another absurdity of the idiotic Deere system on those tractors.
I had assumed that there would be a system releif in addition to the stroke control as found in ~most~ other systems. Ofcourse I'd also assume the charge pump to supply 20% more than system flow but I'd also be wrong about that too...

I'd still look at the stroke control first and foremost.

Rod

 

[buickanddeere]

Considering the occasional problem some Dubuque "s have vs the problems of brands x, y and z such as torque amps in IH tractors. I"ll take the Deere, run the proper oil and ensure the filter is clean. Broken lines occur when some dolt never changes the filter until the point of failure.
As for the undersized trans charge pump. A larger pump would just waste HP churning oil. The front cooler and storage tank will supply implement sized cylinders through the scc"s. Deere sells the ported filter cover which ensures all the oil required for the front pump. If a loader, hydraulic motor, backhoe etc is used.
Don"t need a relief valve when the pump"s max Pressure is limited.

 

[Tx Jim]

(quoted from post at 12:32:46 06/25/12) Ahhh. Another absurdity of the idiotic Deere system on those tractors.
Rod

Just as b&d stated the stroke control valve in all reality is the pressure control valve. While you're bashing JD hyd system I think Ford/NH CCLS isn't the best system that was available. I know as I owned a Ford 5610 that the breakaway couplers were a PIA. They only operated correctly when they were in the mood.

 

[RodinNS]

Occaisonal problems???
Come on now.
If there was anything that 40 series Deere's were known for, and more specifically the Manheim's we had around this area.... they were well known for hydraulic misery. It was the biggest problem with an otherwise decent tractor.
I'm not knocking them any more than any other color. They all had their points and faults... I'm just saying... this was THEIR fault.

As far as a system releif is concerned.... every CCLS/PFC system I've seen has a main system releif set somewhat higher than the stroke control simply as a safety measure if the stroke control malfunctions.
I think you'll find the Deere TLB's also had this...

Rod

 

[Tx Jim]

(quoted from post at 17:34:20 06/25/12) Occaisonal problems???
Come on now.
If there was anything that 40 series Deere's were known for, and more specifically the Manheim's we had around this area.... they were well known for hydraulic misery. It was the biggest problem with an otherwise decent tractor.
I'm not knocking them any more than any other color. They all had their points and faults... I'm just saying... this was THEIR fault.
Rod

Rod
buickanddeere praised JD utility tractors hyd systems not me. I've stated to him numerous times that the Dubuque/Mannheim compared to Waterloo tractors hyd systems are as different as daylight & dark.

 

[willyp]

Found that the stroke control valve under the pump was stuck or stopped up because I backed it out some and ran engine for a minute and then screwed it back in and adjusted it and now it is working fine. Thanks for all the help

 

[buickanddeere]

Waterloo and Mannheim/Dubuque shared some of the
same front pumps and all used a trans charge pump.
Only real difference is the Waterloo's usually
ran the return from the scv's to the trans pump
outlet. Instead of dumping direct to sump.
Some of the Mannheim/Dubuque tractors should
have had some trans oil lines more resistant to
vibration and/or pressure spikes.

 

[Tx Jim]

(quoted from post at 00:50:58 06/26/12) Only real difference is the Waterloo's usually
ran the return from the scv's to the trans pump
outlet. Instead of dumping direct to sump.

buickanddeere
If you believe that you have not diagnosed/repaired very many JD Dubuque/Mannheim utility & Waterloo tractors hyd's!! ALL the closed center hyd systems require a trans pump because the main pump "can't suck oil". Very small percentage of utility tractors left the factory with the 2.4 IN3 main pump,most had the 1.38 IN3 pump which wasn't installed in the Waterloo tractors. Hyd hi-lo's of utilities weren't near as durable/trouble free as the Quad-range hi-lo in Waterloo's. Rockshaft control valves gave less trouble on Waterloo tractors. To make a long story short Waterloo hyd system gave much less trouble than the utility tractors. Ask any good JD technician if you don't believe me.

 

[RodinNS]

I'd agree with you on that.... Waterloo's around here (not that there were many) gave virtually no trouble with hydraulics. Most were pretty reliable tractors overall.
I think every single Manheim around this area has developed a high pressure leak at one time or another... weak charge pumps... lead to destroyed main pumps... high/lo destroyed, heat takes the brakes out, etc.
The magnitude of the problems related to how quickly the original problem was caught/fixed.
They were a pretty nice tractor to work with when they worked.

Rod

 

[buickanddeere]

Don't know what kind of abuse that Dubuque/Mannheims
receive around your way. Around here more end up in the
shop with cavitated sleeves from old coolant. Than from
transmission lines.
Every single tractor Can not be a true statement. There are
10,000 + units around here , some still with the factory clutch.
And no trans hydraulic or engine sleeve problems. Depends if
the owner uses the proper oil and replaces filters as per the
book. Most common trans/hydraulic / drivetrain problem is
worn through brake pads and scored brake disks.

 

[Tx Jim]

(quoted from post at 12:02:56 06/26/12) Don't know what kind of abuse that Dubuque/Mannheims
receive around your way. Around here more end up in the
shop with cavitated sleeves from old coolant. Than from
transmission lines. There are 10,000 + units around here , some still with the factory clutch.Most common trans/hydraulic / drivetrain problem is worn through brake pads and scored brake disks.

buickanddeere
If you believe that you have not diagnosed/repaired very many JD Dubuque/Mannheim utility hyd's!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 10,000 hrs on original clutch REALLY. I suppose no rockshaft control valves leaked. No hyd hi-lo's quite working?

 

[buickanddeere]

I can think of 11 Dubuque/Mannheims around the
area. Even dad's loader tractor the 2355 has over
8000hrs on the factory clutch. Yet my Uncle's 1640
had the clutch smoked in less than 4000 hours. Did
the same work, different operator.
Of the 11 tractors one cavitated the sleeves and
another wore a brake pad through.
No failed high-low packs, no failed pto clutchs,
most did loose the pto brake when used on rotary
cutters or forage blowers. No failed transmission
oil lines.
Most of those tractors are wearing out the 2nd
set of rear tires and are near or over 10,000hrs.
According to the gospel of Deere TM7. The
40cc/2.4cu" pump common to or used as a
replacement for both the Dubuque/Mannheims and the
2510,3010,4010,501,2520 & 3020.
The 50cc/3.0cu" pump was common to the
300,400,401,300B,302A,401C,310,310A and 410B. And
to the
4000,4020,4320,4520,4620,5020,4230,4430,4630,6030,
4040,4240,4440,4640,4840,4050,4055,4255,4450,4455,
7020 & 7520.

 

[RodinNS]

2 sets of tires in 10K hours says a lot about the type of work they did...

2-3K hours was more normal for a set of tires here. Less on the cheap tires.

Rod

 

[Tx Jim]

buickanddeere
We were discussing agriculture tractors but you throw in industrial tractors that most especially those equipped with backhoes came from factory with a larger hyd pump to try a help your plea . nice smoke screen :roll: :lol: :wink:

 

[buickanddeere]

Are those Industrials Dubuque/Mannheim tractors or not? Do
the 3010,4010,5010,2510,2520,3020 share the same pumps
as Mannheims or not?

 

[Tx Jim]

(quoted from post at 10:46:23 06/27/12) Are those Industrials Dubuque/Mannheim tractors or not? Do
the 3010,4010,5010,2510,2520,3020 share the same pumps
as Mannheims or not?

A small amt of main hyd pumps put in Mannheim/Dubuque are utilized in Waterloo tractors BUT that's no indication of the VAST DIFFERENCES between the two factories tractors hyd design & reliably!!!!
But as I stated the this thread was started about a agriculture tractors not an INDUSTRIAL MODEL.

 

[buickanddeere]

There is no vast difference, it"s the same system
on two different lines of tractors. The same/similar
closed center pump supplied from a trans charge
pump.