John Deere M timing question

[a49deere]

Yup, coil has sparkles. Does the flywheel have a "spark" mark for the exhaust and compression stroke or does it only show on number one compression?

only #1 cylinder, TDC and spark!

I have a very strong feeling my 47 JD M had been negative grounded. I now have it positive grounded and it is draining my battery. Didn't I hear on here that their is a way to do something to the cut-out relay to change the polarity back? Does anyone know where I can get a cut-out relay?

So, have you gotten your timing issue figured out?

 

[bday121058]

Yes, I had it right all along I think. I hope the polarity problem was draining the battery so it wouldn't crank. I jumped the starter with 12v and she cranked and ran great until I took the jump off, then she would slowly die.

 

[bday121058]

With a jumper wire, quickly touch the BAT and ARM terminal on the generator. There should be a spark when you touch the ARM terminal. Then it’s polarized.

I have A and F on my generator I made the assumption that F was BAT and A was ARM I didn't see a spark but the whole electric seems dead now.

 

[Jim.ME]

I have A and F on my generator I made the assumption that F was BAT and A was ARM I didn't see a spark but the whole electric seems dead now.

The generator gets polarized, not the cut out or a regulator. Polarity won't drain the battery. The points in the cut out stuck closed will drain the battery into the generator if the generator is not charging above battery voltage. It is likely the points in your cutout stuck closed.

F would be field. You say you have a cut out, so the Battery power comes from the battery side terminal of the cut out. You just swipe the jumper on the generator A terminal, you should just see a quick spark as the jumper hits the terminal.

 

[bday121058]

The generator gets polarized, not the cut out or a regulator. Polarity won't drain the battery. The points in the cut out stuck closed will drain the battery into the generator if the generator is not charging above battery voltage. It is likely the points in your cutout stuck closed.

F would be field. You say you have a cut out, so the Battery power comes from the battery side terminal of the cut out. You just swipe the jumper on the generator A terminal, you should just see a quick spark as the jumper hits the terminal.

Sorry to be such a dummy but 1) you can open and sand (file) points in the cut-out like a distributor? 2) when swiping the A terminal what is the other end of the jumper attached to? 3) No electric anymore could I have blown a fuse in my first attempt at jumping F to A? Sorry, but I am learning and appreciate knowledge!

 

[Jim.ME]

Sorry to be such a dummy but 1) you can open and sand (file) points in the cut-out like a distributor? 2) when swiping the A terminal what is the other end of the jumper attached to? 3) No electric anymore could I have blown a fuse in my first attempt at jumping F to A? Sorry, but I am learning and appreciate knowledge!

1. you can and it may work.

2. The wire that comes to the cutout (not the one to the generator) should have battery power.

3. I don't think so, but I can't say as I can't see your tractor. Unhook the battery and charge it up first. If the cutout points stuck closed it will drain the battery. Before hooking the battery backup, unhook the wire from the battery side of the cutout, make sure the unhooked wire does not hit a ground point.

Post a picture of your cutout so we can see what is on it.

 

[bday121058]

Can we become friends on Facebook so we can actually talk on messenger? Phillip Cason
Icon is an

 

[bday121058]

Can we become friends on Facebook so we can actually talk on messenger? Phillip Cason
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The above was meant for him.ME. Any others may be rejected.

 

[Jim.ME]

Can we become friends on Facebook so we can actually talk on messenger? Phillip Cason
Icon is an

Sorry but no. The only Facebook I do is Marketplace.

There are others here who can help you along with me and check/correct mistakes I might make. You came here for help, not Facebook, this can stay on the forum as far as my help goes so it is available to others who visit here in the future. JMHO

 

[bday121058]

Sorry but no. The only Facebook I do is Marketplace.

There are others here who can help you along with me and check/correct mistakes I might make. You came here for help, not Facebook, this can stay on the forum as far as my help goes so it is available to others who visit here in the future. JMHO

Understood, and will stay here. No harm intended, only wanted verbal/video help. Visual learner!

 

[used red MN]

No electric anymore could I have blown a fuse in my first attempt at jumping F to A? Sorry, but I am learning and appreciate knowledge!

Hello Phillip, welcome to YT! I occasionally collaborate with Jim to troubleshoot peoples issues on here. You say you “have no electric anymore” where is it stopping? This is a thread on an electrical problem yet no mention of a test light or multimeter, do you have either of these? The guy I learned from about VWs set engine timing with a test light. Suddenly losing power is quite often a battery cable end that is not clean enough or tight enough. Prove your terminals and connections are good with your test light or meter.

 

[Jim.ME]

I will add unhook the wire from the cutout for now, get it starting and running reliably before messing with the charging.

Do as used red mentioned. Check/Test the battery cables. Both ends must be clean and bright as well as what they connect to. Where does the tractor end of the ground cable attach? To sheet metal or solid chassis metal? Right now, positive or negative ground will not matter.

It is possible your tractor has a fuse in the power wire between the ammeter and the switch. Often there was a fuse holder in the dash with a cap you push in on ad turn CCW to remove the cap and access the fuse.

 

[bday121058]

I will add unhook the wire from the cutout for now, get it starting and running reliably before messing with the charging.

Do as used red mentioned. Check/Test the battery cables. Both ends must be clean and bright as well as what they connect to. Where does the tractor end of the ground cable attach? To sheet metal or solid chassis metal? Right now, positive or negative ground will not matter.

It is possible your tractor has a fuse in the power wire between the ammeter and the switch. Often there was a fuse holder in the dash with a cap you push in on ad turn CCW to remove the cap and access the fuse.

Do you mean to disconnect one wire from the cut-out or disconnect it completely? New battery, new cables, grounded the the sheet metal by the battery box. Thanks for chiming in! All help is appreciated!

 

[Jim.ME]

Do you mean to disconnect one wire from the cut-out or disconnect it completely? New battery, new cables, grounded the the sheet metal by the battery box. Thanks for chiming in! All help is appreciated!

Disconnect the wire coming from the ammeter to the cutout. If the points are welded shut that will prevent the cut out from discharging the battery for now while you get it back to starting and running again.

Many times it has been seen that even with a good clean contact spot for the ground cable connection to the sheet metal, there is rust and other resistance causes where the sheet metal connects to the chassis. Move the ground to the chassis, ideally connected to one of the starter's mounting bolts. Yes, a longer cable will be needed. If it is still a 6-volt system 1/0 is a good size for the battery cables. The common 4-gauge cables, for autos, is too light for good performance with 6-volts.

 

[bday121058]

Alright, you've given me some work to do, thank you and after Easter I'll let you know where I am at it.

 

[used red MN]

Yes, I had it right all along I think. I hope the polarity problem was draining the battery so it wouldn't crank. I jumped the starter with 12v and she cranked and ran great until I took the jump off, then she would slowly die.

A couple of things that need clarification in my mind. Do you for certain have a 6 volt battery, a 6 volt battery has 3 electrolyte fill caps on it.

Yup, coil has sparkles. Does the flywheel have a "spark" mark for the exhaust and compression stroke or does it only show on number one compression?

Not real important since you got is runnIng but just for future reference. The flywheel is on the crankshaft and the pistons are connected to the crankshaft throws by the connecting rods. The flywheel mark for “Spark” follows the piston on the crank throw to TDC or whatever degrees Deere chose to fire it at. In the 4 cycles the piston comes to TDC twice, once at the end of the compression stroke and again at the end of the exhaust stroke. Not a Deere guy but I hope this is right in terms of your M. The distributor turns at crankshaft speed so at the top of the exhaust stroke the distributor also fires a “wasted spark” at this point the “Spark” timing mark would also be aligned to the pointer.
I know you replied you would work on it over the weekend but curious of your reply on ownership of a test light and multimeter?

 

[bday121058]

I have a multimeter, and can build a test light. Used to static time VWs with one I built

 

[used red MN]

Do you for certain have a 6 volt battery, a 6 volt battery has 3 electrolyte fill caps on it.

And for certain a 6 volt battery?

 

[bday121058]

And for certain a 6 volt battery?

Certain

 

[Watthour]

It is possible your tractor has a fuse in the power wire between the ammeter and the switch. Often there was a fuse holder in the dash with a cap you push in on ad turn CCW to remove the cap and access the fuse.

The '48 version has the fuse in the console, in a metal in-line holder.