M C248 sleeves

[runsred44]

Gentlemen,
I got new cylinder sleeves for my M C248. I can push the sleeves all the way down in the block, spin them and pull them out by hand.
What are your thoughts on using permatex 64000 or loctite 640 sleeve retainer to secure them in the block? they're supposed to be good up to 400 degrees. Thanks

 

[caterpillar guy]

Either the block has been opened up some or the sleeves are small. I would return them, and find a different set. Job is expensive enough without doing it a second time. Otherwise you need to use a telescoping gauge to measure the bore and a mic to measure the sleeves.

 

[fastfarmall]

Usually you have to put the sleeves in a freezer to get them to shrink,there's something wrong,and exhaust gas is about 800-1,000 degrees F.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

Exhaust gas may get to 1000F but if your engine block gets anywhere near that you're in serious serious trouble.

Most of the heat goes out the exhaust. The rest is taken care of by a WATER-based cooling system which ideally does not get above 190F.

Engine block is usually around 250F worst case if I'm not mistaken. HOWEVER I am not sure the compound would hold the sleeves.

You might be in trouble though. Most likely you will get more of the same if you send these sleeves back and order different ones. There aren't many suppliers left out there any more. I'm not even sure if there is more than one that actually makes the sleeves.

They're all made for "A" and/or "B" bores. If your block is a looser "C" and/or "D" bore the sleeves will be loose. The whole ABCD thing is how the cylinder bores measure out during manufacturing. A being closest to spec and D being furthest, but not out of tolerance. They had different sleeves to fit the different class bores.

Worst case you may need to find a set of 450 sleeves and pistons, and have the block machined. A machine shop will hold much closer tolerances boring the block than in a manufacturing situation.

 

[Janicholson]

Thermal conduction from the sleeve to the native bore is important. putting a glue in
there will not conduct heat well. I would get a different set from a different company
(maybe YT store here) if no other solution, LA Sleeve may be a source for made sleeves. Jim

 

[used red MN]

I have no real opinion about your scenario. It would be
nice to know where you purchased the sleeves unless
it throws YT under the bus. You would only know for
certain if it is the block or the sleeves if another set of
sleeves from a different source fit better. If I was faced
with this problem and could not find a solution short of
re-sleeving the parent bores or replacing the block I
might consider the follow recommendation. In a former
YT post on this subject ..see link.. a poster MN Scott
gave this approach.
..Coat the sleeve and block with strong iodine. It will
rust the sleeve in. You never have to worry about it
coming loose and you have the good heat transfer you
need..
I would probably try it on just a sleeve and see what
happens. I do agree it would certainly provide more
heat transfer then a plastic or epoxy locking type
adhesive.
2007 YT post on same subject

 

[pete 23]

Do you have one of the old sleeves still intact, not bead welded or such. How do they fit.

 

[Fritz Maurer]

One possible cure is a semi-finished sleeve or a
repair sleeve, honed to fit your pistons. Talk with a
machinist and see what your options are. Possibly
he may have listings for sleeves with oversize O.D.

 

[rustred]

they must fit properly, glue or loctite is not good. u need to transfer the heat outward.

 

[Fritz Maurer]

Thats not throwing YT under the bus. Any logical person can see that YT cannot control every shade tree operation that happens to an engine in 70 years, and should not be held liable. If someone orders a given size of main bearing, and it is too big for the journal because a previous owner put shims under the inserts, that would not be YTs problem, anyone would recognize that.

 

[derwen1959]

There's a firm in uk that makes sleeves with no
minimum order

 

[roy prins]

That brings back memories -- One of the old school mechanics I worked with would put brake fluid on the loose sleeve before putting it in-
and He would leave it set for a time before he fired it up . He said rust will keep it tight and it worked . Never seen one come back .
Roy

 

[used red MN]

Fritz, more so meaning that if the sleeves were from YT and for whatever reason were a badly sized set and he ordered sleeves from another supplier and they fit okay that would sort of shine a bad light on YT parts. Conversely, if the sleeves were brand X and he received a set from YT and those fit properly it would be a positive for YT parts. I realize if someone honed the bores out, that YT cannot take responsibility for any such actions.

 

[runsred44]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the comments.
I tried YT first, over a month ago, the kits were not available and still not available today. I ordered from a different supplier and got Reliance cylinder/piston kits. (sleeve, piston, rings and pin). Their website said the kit was for 4.125 parent bore, I measured 4.125 on top of my block since I only have a caliper, thought I was good.
My block is stamped "D". I took 1 of my new sleeves to a shop today and it measured 4.123 - 4.124. Should sleeves be smaller, same as or larger than parent bore?
I hear you on heat transfer, researching if something like JB Weld steel reinforced epoxy would work. (it's actually magnetic) and good to 550 degrees. The iodine treatment was interesting, scared me a little, my luck it would keep on corroding through sleeve.
My old sleeves are intact, they fit great, snug, tight fit, had to make a puller to remove them.
Thanks

 

[Jim Becker]

Loctite makes a product intended for this sort of situation. I've never used it, but would probably consider using it rather than a do-it-yourself concoction. You should check their recommendations as to "how loose" they say it can handle.

https://www.myautovaluestore.com/loctite/sleeve-retainer-640-lot-37424

 

[used red MN]

I am not saying you need to get a YT kit to solve your
problems, I just think it is interesting that you say they
do not have them. I tried several of the kits they have
and none of them showed as out of stock. There is one
in the link as an example. I have no idea if it fits your
tractor serial number range or if it has the right wrist
pin size. I did not check out to the point of entering my
card info but I would think it would tell you if they were
out of stock the second you put it in your cart. To bad
you had to run into this odd problem. You were
probably planning on having it back together by now.
YT example engine kit

 

[runsred44]

I thought the same thing when I looked at their website and it showed kits for flat and stepped head pistons. I probably never put it in my cart just called them to ask about sleeve O.D. and wrist pin size since I have the odd ball 1" wrist pins.

 

[earl h]

sounds like you bought 450 sleeves. 248 sleeves are 4 inch. sleeves should not be loose.there are lots of kits on yt for 248
engines.earl