tlak

Well-known Member
Regardless of whether it helps with the fuel prices, I don't think we (the tax payers) owe the oil companies anything. Didn't all this big tax reliefs come in under Bush and the Repugs?



Senate GOP blocks windfall taxes on Big Oil By H. JOSEF HEBERT, Associated Press Writer
58 minutes ago



WASHINGTON - Saved by Senate nnalert, big oil companies dodged an attempt Tuesday to slap them with a windfall profits tax and take away billions of dollars in tax breaks in response to the record gasoline prices that have the nation fuming.



GOP senators shoved aside the Democratic proposal, arguing that punishing Big Oil won't do a thing to lower the $4-a-gallon-price of gasoline that is sending economic waves across the country. High prices at the pump are threatening everything from summer vacations to Meals on Wheels deliveries to the elderly.

The Democratic energy package would have imposed a 25 percent tax on any "unreasonable" profits of the five largest U.S. oil companies, which together made $36 billion during the first three months of the year. It also would have given the government more power to address oil market speculation, opened the way for antitrust actions against countries belonging to the OPEC oil cartel, and made energy price gouging a federal crime.

"Americans are furious about what's going on," declared Sen. Byron Dorgan, D-N.D. He said they want Congress to do something about oil company profits and the "orgy of speculation" on oil markets.

But nnalert leaders said the nnalert' plan would do harm rather than good — and they kept the legislation from being brought up for debate and amendments.

On world markets, oil prices retreated a bit Tuesday but remained above $131 a barrel. Gasoline prices edged even higher to a nationwide record average of $4.04 a gallon.

At the Capitol, Democratic leaders needed 60 votes and they got only 51 senators' support, including seven nnalert who bucked their party leaders. Sen. Mary Landrieu of Louisiana, a state tied closely to the oil industry, was the only nnalert opposing the bill.

"We are hurting as a country. We're hurting individually as Americans ... and the other side says, `Do nothing. Don't even debate the issue,'" complained Sen. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y.

"Average citizens are scratching their heads and saying, what's wrong with Washington," said Schumer.

GOP opponents argued that little was to be gained by imposing new taxes on the five U.S. oil giants: Exxon Mobil Corp., Chevron Corp., Shell Oil Co., BP America Inc. and ConocoPhilips Co.

While these companies may be huge, they don't set world oil prices and raising their taxes would discourage domestic oil production, the nnalert said of the nnalert' plan.

"In the middle of what some are calling the biggest energy shock in a generation ... they proposed as a solution, of all things, a windfall profits tax," nnalert leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky chided the nnalert. He called their proposal "a gimmick" that would not lower gasoline prices and only hold back domestic oil production.

"The American people are clamoring for relief at the pump," agreed Sen. Pete Domenici, R-N.M., but "they will get exactly what they don't want" under the nnalert' plan — higher prices and an increase in oil imports.

The bill's supporters argued that their proposal was different from the windfall profits taxes of the early 1980s that thwarted domestic production and led to a rise in imports. The oil companies could avoid the tax by using their "windfall" to push alternative energy programs or refinery expansions, they said.

Shortly after the oil tax vote, nnalert blocked a second proposal that would extend tax breaks that have either expired or are scheduled to end this year for wind, solar and other alternative energy development, and for the promotion of energy efficiency and conservation. Again nnalert couldn't get the 60 votes to overcome a GOP filibuster.

Neither nnalert presidential candidate John McCain nor his Democratic rival, Barack external_link, were in Washington to cast votes on the energy issue on Tuesday.

external_link, in a statement, said nnalert had "turned a blind eye to the plight of America's working families" by refusing to take up the energy legislation. external_link has supported additional taxes on the oil companies. McCain is opposed to such taxes and has proposed across-the-aboard tax reductions for industry as a way to help the economy.

Election-year politics hung over the debate. nnalert know their energy package has no chance of becoming law. Even it were to overcome a Senate GOP filibuster — a longshot at best — and the House acted, President Bush has made clear he would veto it.

But there was nothing to lose by taking on Big Oil when people are paying $60 to $100 to fill up their gas tanks.

The oil companies have been frequent targets of Congress. Twice this year, top executives of the largest U.S. oil producers have been brought before congressional committees to explain their huge profits. And each time the executives urged lawmakers to resist punitive tax measures, blaming high costs on global supply and demand.

In addition to the proposed windfall profits tax, the nnalert' bill also would have rescinded tax breaks that are expected to save the oil companies $17 billion over the next 10 years. The money would have been used to provide tax incentives for producers of wind, solar and other alternative energy sources as well as for energy conservation.

In an attempt to dampen oil market speculation, the legislation would require traders to put up more collateral in the energy futures markets and would provide authority to regulate U.S.-based trading in foreign markets. And it would make oil and gas price gouging a federal crime, with stiff penalties of up to $5 million during a presidentially declared energy emergency.

After Tuesday's defeat, nnalert did not rule out pushing the issue again.

"This was politics at its worst," complained Sen. Claire McCaskill, D-Mo. "This was a refusal to debate the biggest problem confronting the American people. ... That takes nerve."
 
The nnalert are all wet on this tax of winfall profits. Figure it out. What are ther , 200 million people in the US? I'm not sure , but if you divide that into 36 billion you come up with about $180 profit from each person in the US. Compared to what the average person spends for fuel, that is not much. Also, if the tax them, the companies are only going to up the prices to pay the tax! These dummies in Washington don't seem to understand plain economics or business at all. They are so removed from common life they have no idea of what is really going on.
 
How about a state embargo of refined gas for states that refuse builing refineries capable of making special gas blends as required by the state? But allowing import of crude oil for them to refine-Tranlation: California not allowed to import refined gasoline while L.A. rfinery remains idle waiting 10 years for L.A. city council to aproval building permits needed before they can install new clean refining equipment. Alaskan crude shipped to the S. California refinery and they can refine it with existing equipment or bicycle for next 10 years. Texas and Mexico refined gasoline and ultra low sulfur diesel can go to midwest markets. California pumps about 60 to 75% of their needed crude -depending on whose figures - and Northern California refineries can refine enough for their area. The Sourthern refineries that used to provide enough refined fuels for their areas are basicly acting as tank farms and recycling centers. Couple other states on east coast might also be affected. California has 55 electrial votes(?)- but if they are already written off the political point could be made with minimal political cost. RN
 
Did I miss something? I thought the nnalert controlled the congress. So why couldn't they muster 60 votes? Could it be that this is just more pre-election posturing that looks good on the outside, but is rotten in the middle?
 
If, due to rain, drought, whatever, corn goes to $10.00 per bushel, should farmers pay a "windfall tax" of 25% too? It's not the government's place to dictate the profits business can make. We tried this "tax" before and it neither lowered prices nor increased production. Tax, tax, tax are the three words nnalert live buy.

Larry in Michigan
 
windfall taxes will set a horrible precedent. it's true that high gas prices are hurting everybody, but windfall taxes will be just like any other expense and be passed on to the consumer.
 
One of the big things to look at is 2008 ELECTION YEAR, lots of propaganda value in "tax reform" just before an election and before people have time to realize that they were screwed again.
 
the tax situation in the US now makes the taxes on tea, paper, and cloth look pretty appealing. I don't know how to do it, but we have got to rein our government's spending habits in somehow. the politicians in Washington now are no better than the ones in London 250 years ago.
 
When are those washington air heads going to realize supply here needs to be increased! I think oil companies would like to drill here an spend some of profits. Would make work for lot of people here in USA who would than have money to spend on stuff creating work for other folks .Gov might even get more tax money from emploved folks an all other company profits.
 
Well it seems no one or at least certain folks just don't want oil wells in their back yard. Well, I would like to have one in my back yard. If I was one of those folks I would be ashamed of my self. They want the gas, electricity or whatever but want someone else to do it for them. T'ed me off a few years back when California nnalert were fussing about Texas's pollution, especially around Houston. If I had my way we would quit making gas for them and then we could pass epa with flying colors. Bet they would sing a different song then.
 
I have to say nnalert are right that this tax wont do anything.However thats not an excuse for not doing something about the high prices.Thats being caused by the speculators.Maybe they should nail the doors shut until the nnalert do something.The nnalert are so disgusting they should be thrown so far into jail they have to pipe sunlight in to them.They should serve the nnalert some mud cakes for lunch like they are eating in Haiti and thats it until they stop this thieving stock market from doing this.
 
I own some oil stock and the profits are the dividends that go into my IRA. If the goverment is going to grab off the profits I mighy as well get rid of the oil stocks.
 
Congress needs to be voting on something to bring the price of oil down like drilling ANYWHERE in the US there is oil,not doing something stupid like taxing those people more that sell us the oil so our at the pump price goes up more.Oil companies ain't the problem Congress that is controlled by the Radial Enviromental Lobby is the problem
 
People NEED to realize that corporations do not pay any taxes ! The consumers do ! Corporations can just pass it along in the form of higher prices to us.
 
Oil companies need to do 3 things....

1: Drill....

2: Drill some more

3: When they are tired of drilling...drill another hole.

I am from the right, have not agreed with everything the nnalert and Bush has done, but they have this one right. We need to drill in ANWAR, Coasts, Colorado, whereever......

I do think we need to find alternatives as sending our money to the Arabs that don't like us put our National Security in jeopordy.....
 
Yes, they have 50+ and according to the news article I read, there were at least 7 nnalert who voted for the measure. The question still remains, if this was the good deal the nnalert said it was, why couldn"t they muster the 60 votes necessary to move it on?
 
When the nnalert siezed control of the House and Senate in 2006 they promised to do something about the price of fuel which was at $2.46 a gallon. Who knew that their plan was to raise it to $4.00+ a gallon?
 
Everyone knows higher taxes will make fuel cheaper. Look at Europe, they tax the **** out of oil companies and thier fuel prices are double......


Just what is the goal of higher taxes?
 
DEMOCRAPS are the majority in BOTH houses. Rebublicans are the minority. They don't have the power to get what they want, done. Just last month the Rebubs. tried to get in a bill to allow drilling in the U.S. But, it was shot down in flames by the beholden to the socialists, or enviromentalists, whatever you want to call the green lobby. Demonizing the oil companies is demonstrating ignorance to the extreme. The oil companies want to drill here, but due to totally asinine goverment restrictions, they can't. We have MASSIVE oil reserves of shale oil in CO. We have a Sh**load of oil of BOTH coasts. But we can't touch a drop of it. You want to throw some blame at somebody, call your local DEMOCRAP politician, and blast them. They are to blame for all the high prices we are paying right now. Who the hell are they, and why would ANY American agree with them, on taking profits from an American company, that they, with their great wisdom, conciders too much. What the hell happened to this country. We are in serious trouble, we have a pure MARXIST,and a RINO, running for Pres. Both, talk the same crap, about company profits, Both, are believers in this global warming nonsense, and want to tax/cap/trade us into the 19th century. Both, want to open our borders up to every ASSHAT that wants to come here. I see and hear some peoples ignorance, on whats happening today, and it makes me sick to think what this country is in for. PLEASE, everybody, WAKEUP. Jack
 
I was always under the impression that we were jerked around by the super rich. This may be another jerk job to get drilling passed in the USA. By the opinions on here it looks like the majority are for it. So what was the meeting about between Cheney and big oil?
 
Sorry, dry holes don't yield oil. Converting coal to diesel will provide fuel at lower cost than current crude prices.
 
How about quit drilling and quit taking out oil. That stuff's in there for a reason. I thinkwe should be exploring more alternative sources. Oils can be extracted from almost any plant matter so why not raise a bunch of cannabis and make oil from the seeds and stems and send the rest to me! Seriously though,we need to be exploring other options and not just the ones that make the gov rich.
 
Well, the oil companies are drilling for your information!!!! They are drilling holes in the backsides of Americans from sea to shining sea!!!
Har Har Har.
 
They are all in on this conspiracy, nnalert & nnalert just want us to think there is a difference between them, but there isn"t. They are all for making our standard of living just like other third world countries, so it will be easier for them to take our money.
NO FAITH IN OUR GOVERNMENT, so many died to provide a future to a great nation, and it"s people, only for the sacrifice to wasted by traitors elected to our governments" highest offices. See y"all.
 
So does the amount you receive in your IRA offset the increases in fuel and related expenses?
Reality is, you're invested at a loss.
 
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