Planter/Drill Help: JD 8250 not gonna work

[ChampagneNBeer]

Hola,

Getting to fall planting time & need your help. 😀

Looking at busting up roughly 10+ acres this fall to get use to running the equipment.

Planting some multi-acre sections on wheat, oats, clover, peas etc (not mixed, all seperate, except one mixed area for a deer plot)

As depths range from 1.5" to .5"/surface I know the John Deere 8250 can knock it out but at 14 feet, it is too big a planter for the small acerage per crop I am targeting this fall.

With that in mind - what planter do you recommend (vintage/inexpensive/easy to learn, use, fix etc)?

Goal:

A planter than can run rows, broadcast, run depths to say 3" and be used on seed sizes grom grasses to possibly even corn?

Also, needs to be mid-sized unit that is best for smaller sections but not so small that anything over 1 acre is alot of back and forth.

Thanks!

 

[paul]

Planter. Precisely spaces and depth rows of crop. Corn is unhappy unless all the plants are exactly the same depth so they emerge and come up the same 24 hours, and prefers a fairly even spacing with the lower seed rates.

Drill. Dumps out bulk seed to certain depths, not perfect on either amount or depth. Small grains and soybeans don’t mind some unevenness.

Broadcast spinner. Throws out a bunch of seed to the surface, handles tiny and winged and bigger seed if amount doesn’t need to be too accurate, needs harrowed in to depth more or less wanted. Clovers and alfalfa’s and cover crop and grasses type of stuff, try to put 10# per acre down.

Each has its place, and they don’t substitute one to the other well.

This is the problem you will run into trying to run multiple different crops of insignificant acreage.

I’d increase my plots to 14 feet wide! Gotta be flexible.


So if you have 10 acres of crops on 14 foot spacing, how you gonna harvest all those different little plots? Good conversation.

Paul

 

[Brendon-KS]

As Paul indicated a drill, a planter, and (especially)a broadcaster are fundamentally different machines that do particular jobs. While a drill and planter can be pressed into each other's roles the results are typically not as good as what the "real" machine would have done. Examples are planting row crops with a drill by blocking feeds or sowing small grains with a planter by making multiple trips across the field. In some situations a broadcaster can substitute for a drill but in no cases can it replicate the role of a planter.

The 8250 you have is a good drill for small grains, soybeans, and the like. If equipped with a small seed attachment it would also be good for grass and alfalfa. I've got an 8350 which is the same thing just with a larger box capacity and it does well.

Most people's definition of a "mid-sized" planter would be something like an 8-row, 30" model. However, if you're working in one acre plots this would be a huge machine (especially if the plots are irregular shaped) and a 2-row unit would be more suitable. If most of the plots you're planting are less than, say, 20 acres a 4- or 6-row machine might be the most practical.

With drills and planters having an operator's manual should be regarded as mandatory. Errors at planting time are sometimes difficult to see until it's too late and can be very costly so it pays to invest in the manual and know what it says before going to the field. I'd recommend having a manual for every piece of equipment on the farm but with planters and drills it's really important.

All that said keep in mind that small acreages of many different crops present challenges that you wouldn't have with fewer varieties but more of what you do have. In many ways it comes down to what your market is for what you're growing. If it's the local elevator than it would make sense to grow just a few crops but have enough volume of each to make it worthwhile hauling the grain to town. On the other hand, if you're looking at direct-to-consumer retail sale having a wide variety of crops might be important and worth the added complexity and expense. (Be aware that direct retail sale involves a huge amount of research and work that you don't have with wholesale dumping at the local elevator.) Bottom line is that a person needs to know where and how the crops they grow will be sold and base the rest of the operation around that. To get the cart in front of the horse by having the harvest in hand without a market identified isn't a position you want to be in. Worse yet would be to have the crop ripe in the field and no practical way to harvest it. So, think of the desired end result and plan accordingly rather than doing things on the fly without a clear goal in mind. To have a successful operation each decision made, whether it be what market to pursue, what crops to grow, what machines to purchase, or anything else, should be made to support the end goal and not made on an impulse.

 

[kneedeep]

You need three planters, one being a cone spreader for seed and fertilizers.

 

[ChampagneNBeer]

Hi Brendon,

Thanks for the reply.

I have the op manual, have gone through it a couple times - must say, for someone new to using a drill, definitely a lot to take in.

Question, for your JD drill, could you think of a way to close the left and right tubes and place a temp divider in the grain or seed bins to theoretically only be planting the middle couple of rows?

I know the discs won't lift, so this becomes problematic but have marker tires and can probably figure out the grid work when using but not sure if doing such a temp job to run only as a 2 or 3 row is prudent eventhough no mods would not be permanent.

 

[ChampagneNBeer]

Hi Paul,

I am okay with running 12ft wide runs, but when only pulling for a distance of say 200 ft, the idea of doing 17 runs each at 200 ft seems doable but the problem is the bin sizing - putting in 30lbs of seed into a 12ft hopper will barely make a dent 😀.

For harvest, wasn't planning on harvesting anything 🤤.

Was actually gonna plant the fall crops and mow before first frost for green manure, leave some as forage for deer and the wheat was gonna be left for spring.

The other land areas for next spring was gonna do soil corrections.

Kinda a phased approach to farming I know but there is soo much to learn so this year was baby plots, next year was see how winter killed wheat grew in spring and run spring crops for potential summer/fall harvest.

Next year on the plan is a mix of things like soybeans, corn, sugar beets, wheat, oats, sweet potats, rutabaga and hay crops - in 10+ acre sections.

 

[Brendon-KS]

There are a number of ways to block off un-needed feeds. Deere made for-the-purpose plugs but I've simply used duct tape. To plant small quantities of seed through just a few feeds I'd look at getting short sections of ABS pipe maybe 6" diameter and securing them over the desired feeds with tape. Just fill the sections of pipe with seed and you're ready to go.

 

[kneedeep]

What I do in a IH End wheel drill. Gorilla tape holds better than duct tape. I cut out some dividers out of thick flashing and gorilla taped to create separate bins. It will not no till but if the dead cover is thin enough, it will put seed in contact with dirt.
I no till corn, soy, sunflower, millet with a 4 row JD 7200. Requires pre burndown for weed control.

 

[ChampagneNBeer]

That is what I was thinking too, except the
outside discs will still furrowing except
no seed will be dropping - didn't know if
that was a bad thing or not...

 

[ChampagneNBeer]

Very clever! Thanks.

I was thinking of ways to block feeds and reduce bin size but didn't occur to me to simply make smaller bins inside my bins to feed smaller quantity of seed.

Any challenge with having the unused double discs still creating furrows but no seed?

That was the other thing I couldn't figure out.

Say I block the left half of the bins, but those are still cutting furrows without seed. So when I run a row, turn around and come back the pattern for planting would have to be loops, no?

Outside, inside, then round and round - all to avoid the non-seeding cuttters from digging through already planted ground...

Or, I run all 12ft but after 100 feet, turn around and do it again - lots of fiddling for 1/2 acre, no?

Maybe instead I will run strips, 12ft by 3500ft 😆.

 

[ChampagneNBeer]

Great info y'all, thank you.

One last question - what do you do when turning around with a older drill like this?

It is just me running it - how do I avoid from planting my turns over and over again - considering it is wheel driven?

 

[Tx Jim]

(quoted from post at 16:42:08 07/21/20) Great info y'all, thank you.

One last question - what do you do when turning around with a older drill like this?

It is just me running it - how do I avoid from planting my turns over and over again - considering it is wheel driven?

Most pull type grain drills have either lever,mechanical(pull rope while drill wheels are turning) or hyd cyl lift

 

[paul]

Certainly the long strips would be the way to go. I would strongly look into that, seriously, if your field allows.

If you are planting small grains or soybeans or the like, you can run the empty slots over the already planted crop the same day. These crops are not precision planted, you don’t need to be perfect. The openers won’t do much to the planted seed.

I would not want to run over corn tho, corn is more fussy (if you want to do it right) as to seed placement.

Typically you plant end rows, then plant back and forth lifting the drill on each end, turning around, drop the drill, and plant back again, making rounds until the field is done. Your field plots here are so small I’m not sure how to do that different tho, you have kind of an odd situation there trying to plant many 1/2 acre squares or whatever little plots you have going.

Paul

 

[ChampagneNBeer]

Haha, yeah, the tiny plots makes this year interesting.

I agree, strips is the best bet - gonna go with that - create smaller hopper bins to slide into the drill and run 'em dry 😀

Next year we are thinking 20-40 acre fields of each. Since I have multiple seperate fields of 40, the thought was a 40 of corn, 40 of oats, 40 of wheat, so then the grain drill and row cultivator will get some usage.

 

[Brendon-KS]

Keep in mind that if you plant row crops with a grain drill the spacings have to match precisely with the cultivator that follows. Common row spacings for the 8000 series Deere drills are 6, 7, 8, and 10 inches. We don't know the row spacing of the cultivator you're planning to use but it is likely 30" - this is the most common row crop spacing in many areas. If your drill is a 7 or 8" spacing there's no way to plant 30" rows. Just something to be aware of.

Also, you can never "bridge" between two passes of a planter with a cultivator or you'll tear out rows. For example, if you plant 6 rows at a time you can never use an 8-row cultivator since it is impossible to drive accurately enough to have rows from two passes of the planter be precisely 30" apart (or whatever row spacing you're planting). Going the other way is possible but unless the planter is an even multiple of the cultivator you'll need to double back and cultivate some rows twice. For example, if you plant 8 rows at a time you can run a 4-row cultivator without problems. However, if you plant 8 rows and have a 6-row cultivator you'd need to take the first 6 rows of each planter pass, shift over two rows, then take rows 3 through 8. This means that rows 3 through 6 get cultivated twice. In this case it would be better to simply remove the outer row from each side of the cultivator and make it a 4-row machine.

In general planting row crops with a grain drill is doable but not ideal. Only with certain combinations of drill configuration and desired row spacing will the resulting rows be centered on the drill and tractor. If they're not it is more difficult to keep even row spacings between passes since where you need to drive relative to the previous pass differs depending on which direction you're going. It's a bit hard to explain in words but I hope it makes sense . . .