Polorize generator.....

[banjoman09]

I know this is simple...lol...but has been awhile for me.. Utube videos say two different things; one says touch battery wire to
A terminal to polarize; other video says take off Field wire at generator and touch battery power to field terminal then hook
wire back up- so? Thanks

 

[dr sportster]

first one everything in place

 

[Janicholson]

Both are wrong if used on the wrong generator. Because we do not know what you are working on we can't tell you. Ford and several other companies use a generator that is called a B circuit design that supplies battery voltage through the regulator to the field terminal then through the windings to ground. Delco based generators are likely to be A circuit, these have voltage coming from the Arm terminal, or a third brush, going through the field windings then to the F terminal on the regulator to ground. Very different, and doing it wrong can ruin the regulator on either design. What are you working on? Jim

 

[Pete in MD]

With a jumper wire MOMENTARILY connect the Armature terminal on the generator to the Battery terminal on the regulator.

 

[Royse]

As Janicholson said, it depends on whether it's an A circuit or B circuit generator.
Ford used both at different times, so did other companies.
So, it depends on what you're working on.

 

[TGP]

This Should Help.

Tom

 

[banjoman09]

I know im not much help; this is a 12v generator I have put on my Oliver 88 with a Voltage regulator(not a cut out); positive ground.... so I will look in the morning but pretty sure its a D-R....thanks

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 23:11:47 04/11/21) I know im not much help; this is a 12v generator I have put on my Oliver 88 with a Voltage regulator(not a cut out); positive ground.... so I will look in the morning but pretty sure its a D-R....thanks

am betting an Indian head nickel that no one can tell me why both "A" & "B" type generators can't be polarized by BATT to ARM, just as in red, leaving all 3 wires connected . Just because, 'it has always been done that way' or 'all the books & manuals say differently' is not a valid answer!

 

[super99]

So, how can you tell if it's an A circuit or B circuit generator??

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 06:28:49 04/12/21) So, how can you tell if it's an A circuit or B circuit generator??

img]https://i.imgur.com/n7iKBzU.jpg[/img]

 

[JD Dave]

So correct me if I'm wrong, with either circuit, the generator could be safely polarized by removing the field wire from the generator.

 

[dsebens]

(quoted from post at 04:53:12 04/12/21)

(quoted from post at 23:11:47 04/11/21) I know im not much help; this is a 12v generator I have put on my Oliver 88 with a Voltage regulator(not a cut out); positive ground.... so I will look in the morning but pretty sure its a D-R....thanks

am betting an Indian head nickel that no one can tell me why both "A" & "B" type generators can't be polarized by BATT to ARM, just as in red, leaving all 3 wires connected . Just because, 'it has always been done that way' or 'all the books & manuals say differently' is not a valid answer!

Would it turn it into a motor instead of generator?

 

[John T]

Hay Banjoman, First, the way I (an Electrical Engineer) was taught and for many many years on many many different tractors (I was a used tractor dealer in the past and used or farmed with many different tractors over 40 years ) I ALWAYS SUCCESSFULLY polarized a generator depended on if it were a Class A (IHC, Deere, Oliver, others) or a Class B (some Fords and some Massey Harris and others) charging systems.

POLARIZATION imparts a degree of the correct residual North South magnetic field into the soft iron field poles by passing current THROUGH THE FIELD WINDINGS which circle the poles. THEREFORE ALL YOU DO IS PASS MOMENTARY CURRENT THROUGH THE FIELD WINDINGS which imparts a degree of residual North South magnetism.

1) That being said for a Class A I used a jumper wirer to momentarily flash/jump from BAT over to GEN/ARM which passed current through the field windings imparting a North South magnetic field.

2) That being said for a Class B I removed the FLD wire and momentarily jumped it over to BAT which passed current through the Field windings imparting a North South magnetic field.

WHY THE FIFFERENCE On a Class B the other end of the fields are grounded so if you apply voltage (such as present on the VR's BAT) to the FLD post you pass current through the field windings to polarize..............On a Class A if you apply hot battery voltage (such as on the BAT) to the GEN/ARM terminal you pass current through the field windings to polarize. On a Class A the fields get their eventual final ground via the VR's connection (via its control relay action) to ground........On a Class B the fields are internally grounded......THATS WHY AND HOW YOU POLARIZE DIFFERENTLY

NOTICE this is how I learned and how I did it SUCCESSFULLY Im NOTTTTTTT saying there may or may not be other methods that work. This is ONLY how I do it and I tried to explain why and how it works so each are free to DO IT HOWEVER THEY PLEASE is fine by me

John T

 

[John T]

A Class B has the other end of the Field windings internally grounded.....On a Class A the fields get their ground via the VR's field current control relay then to ground....... You regulate a Class B by regulating the voltage on the VR's FLD terminal,,On a Class A you regulate by regulating the ground on the FLD terminal. SEE MY POST ABOVE for more info...

John T

 

[Hdonly]

(quoted from post at 02:53:12 04/12/21)

(quoted from post at 23:11:47 04/11/21) I know im not much help; this is a 12v generator I have put on my Oliver 88 with a Voltage regulator(not a cut out); positive ground.... so I will look in the morning but pretty sure its a D-R....thanks

am betting an Indian head nickel that no one can tell me why both "A" & "B" type generators can't be polarized by BATT to ARM, just as in red, leaving all 3 wires connected . Just because, 'it has always been done that way' or 'all the books & manuals say differently' is not a valid answer!

To make sure I am understanding you correctly, are you saying that both "A" and "B" types can be polarized the same way?

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 09:06:25 04/12/21)

(quoted from post at 02:53:12 04/12/21)

(quoted from post at 23:11:47 04/11/21) I know im not much help; this is a 12v generator I have put on my Oliver 88 with a Voltage regulator(not a cut out); positive ground.... so I will look in the morning but pretty sure its a D-R....thanks

am betting an Indian head nickel that no one can tell me why both "A" & "B" type generators can't be polarized by BATT to ARM, just as in red, leaving all 3 wires connected . Just because, 'it has always been done that way' or 'all the books & manuals say differently' is not a valid answer!

To make sure I am understanding you correctly, are you saying that both "A" and "B" types can be polarized the same way?

xactly! No wires removed. Just momentarily connect BATT to ARM. NOTE: tihs is convenient on type "A", because BATT & ARM terminals are next to each other. NOT so on type "B", where BATT terminal is at far right & ARM terminal is at far left, with FIELD terminal in the middle. If a person accustomed to using a screwdriver or wrench were to simply short BATT to FIELD because they are next to one another, on a "B" circuit, they will most likely destroy the field contacts of the regulator, since this will result in armature current passing thru field contacts. Field contacts typically carry ~ 2 amperes & armature current will be well in excess of 30 amperes!!!

 

[buickanddeere]

(quoted from post at 21:28:48 04/11/21) I know this is simple...lol...but has been awhile for me.. Utube videos say two different things; one says touch battery wire to
A terminal to polarize; other video says take off Field wire at generator and touch battery power to field terminal then hook
wire back up- so? Thanks

Loosen the fan belt to allow the pulley to spin freely .
Use a wooden popsicle stick to press the cutout contacts together . The generator should test spin as a motor to verify operation and polarize at the same time .

 

[Janicholson]

No. Do not do that. Jim

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 12:50:30 04/12/21) No. Do not do that. Jim

o not do what and why?

 

[John T]

As I posted below that's NOT the way I was taught nor the way Ive done it for 40 years and NEVER had a problem. I'm NOT
saying there may or may not be other ways to polarize, Im ONLY saying how Ive done it........Take YOUR pick

John T

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 14:24:42 04/12/21) As I posted below that's NOT the way I was taught nor the way Ive done it for 40 years and NEVER had a problem. I'm NOT
saying there may or may not be other ways to polarize, Im ONLY saying how Ive done it........Take YOUR pick

John T

think JANICHOLSON was speaking to me, but didn't explain & I was simply asking why.

 

[banjoman09]

thanks for this- just been very busy but will get to this again in the morning.....

 

[banjoman09]

I do believe this is an A circuit so will do as you say....thanks for all the information guys....

 

[buickanddeere]

Why is everyone afraid to motor the generator ?

 

[JMOR]

(quoted from post at 16:48:03 04/13/21)
Why is everyone afraid to motor the generator ?

ot me! BTDT many times.,and as you said, when it has been motored, it has been polarized.