When I went into our local PPG paint store and said I needed Allis Chalmers persian orange paint and gave them the code of 60080 he said it was a leaded paint code and they couldn't make it. He said they would have to try a prophet formula or he might be able to get close with their DCC line of paint. Does anyone have another code for the PPG paint I can use? Thanks in advance for your time. Gerard
If you check out my site that Hal linked to, you'll find there are two quite different persian oranges that were used by AC. The early version was used prior to about 1959/1960 and is a "pumpkin" shade of orange. The later version has much more red in it. If you are looking for the early version, then yes, PPG 60080 is the correct code. Can you check out another PPG source for availablity? I haven't had a problem in getting 60080 mixed in my area. You can also get 60080 mixed in DCC by PPG but your supplier may have to get the formula from PPG as it's not in the jobber's computer listing. I don't know about the presence of lead in the DCC mix. Here's a visual comparison of 60080 in MTK acrylic urethane and DCC acrylic urethane:
Be aware however that the DCC is a premium urethane and is about three times as expensive as the OMNI MTK. They both are urethanes and therefore the required hardener additives contain isocyanates. Such products should only be used with a supplied-air breathing system.
If you want to pursue the DCC 60080, here's the formula:
You should also be able to get PPG 60080 in acrylic enamel that can be used without the hardener and be safely used with only a charcoal mask. The correct designation for that is PPG MAE 60080.
If you want another potential source for a very close match to PPG 60080, check out DuPont YS074. That should be available in most DuPont chemistries.
Be aware however that the DCC is a premium urethane and is about three times as expensive as the OMNI MTK. They both are urethanes and therefore the required hardener additives contain isocyanates. Such products should only be used with a supplied-air breathing system.
If you want to pursue the DCC 60080, here's the formula:
You should also be able to get PPG 60080 in acrylic enamel that can be used without the hardener and be safely used with only a charcoal mask. The correct designation for that is PPG MAE 60080.
If you want another potential source for a very close match to PPG 60080, check out DuPont YS074. That should be available in most DuPont chemistries.
Rod, Thank you for your input, but I have a couple of questions. In the acrylic urethane you showed they show lead in the paint too, but my dealer said I couldn't get MAE because of the lead. So why is the lead tolerated in the DCC but not the MAE. I wanted the PPG MAE in 60080 because my Allis Chalmers is a 1948 model C. So I suppose I will try to get the MTK in 60080. And just out of curiosity why is there such a color difference in the same paint code from the same company? Thank you for your time. Gerard
Gerard,
I don't know about the lead issue in any of the chemistries for 60080. Just that I've not had a problem in the past concerning it. I haven't purchased any 60080 in the last couple of years so it may be something new regarding lead-free requirements. There is a slight difference between MTK and DCC for the same code because they use different mixing tints. In other words, the MTK uses MTK tints and the DCC uses DCC tints. The MTK is an economy line paint and the color matching precision is not up to par with a premium product. In any event, the 60080 is an old code and is not directly available in a premium product like DCC. If you look at the formula tag closely, you'll see the words "prophet formula". I believe that indicates that a computer match was made at some point to get a close approximation in DCC. That's probably also why my local PPG jobber didn't have that formula in his computer.
I don't think the difference between the MTK and the DCC is great. It's probably as good as you are likely to find anywhere. It's also similar to the small difference between MTK60080 and DuPont YS074 from what I've seen. Dupont YS074 happens to be a "generic" color from DuPont in their "Spectramaster" series of generic colors. But it's the closest I have seen in DuPont to the 60080. Other DuPont listings (old codes) for AC persian orange have too much red in them as far as I'm concerned.
"Getting close" is about the best one can expect in trying to match old tractor colors using modern paint formulations. Even the 60080 should be considered in the close category. I've seen several different shades of orange purporting to be "correct" for that AC early persian orange. From my own personal experience with my 1942 AC-B, and some remnants of original paint, I believe the 60080 comes as close as one can reasonably expect:
By the way, that 60080 dab of paint in the above photo is MAE acrylic enamel not MTK acrylic urethane. I scuffed the old paint between the 60080 and 60396 (the later persian orange) to get rid of years of crud and oxidation and get down to the best representation remaining of the original color. The part is the V-belt guard for my belly sickle mower. I haven't done a shade comparison of MAE vs. MTK in 60080 but doubt there is a significant difference. I suspect it would be closer that the slight difference between MTK and DCC. I chose MTK for my B because I have supplied-air and I wanted the advantages of a urethane paint.
Rod
I don't know about the lead issue in any of the chemistries for 60080. Just that I've not had a problem in the past concerning it. I haven't purchased any 60080 in the last couple of years so it may be something new regarding lead-free requirements. There is a slight difference between MTK and DCC for the same code because they use different mixing tints. In other words, the MTK uses MTK tints and the DCC uses DCC tints. The MTK is an economy line paint and the color matching precision is not up to par with a premium product. In any event, the 60080 is an old code and is not directly available in a premium product like DCC. If you look at the formula tag closely, you'll see the words "prophet formula". I believe that indicates that a computer match was made at some point to get a close approximation in DCC. That's probably also why my local PPG jobber didn't have that formula in his computer.
I don't think the difference between the MTK and the DCC is great. It's probably as good as you are likely to find anywhere. It's also similar to the small difference between MTK60080 and DuPont YS074 from what I've seen. Dupont YS074 happens to be a "generic" color from DuPont in their "Spectramaster" series of generic colors. But it's the closest I have seen in DuPont to the 60080. Other DuPont listings (old codes) for AC persian orange have too much red in them as far as I'm concerned.
"Getting close" is about the best one can expect in trying to match old tractor colors using modern paint formulations. Even the 60080 should be considered in the close category. I've seen several different shades of orange purporting to be "correct" for that AC early persian orange. From my own personal experience with my 1942 AC-B, and some remnants of original paint, I believe the 60080 comes as close as one can reasonably expect:
By the way, that 60080 dab of paint in the above photo is MAE acrylic enamel not MTK acrylic urethane. I scuffed the old paint between the 60080 and 60396 (the later persian orange) to get rid of years of crud and oxidation and get down to the best representation remaining of the original color. The part is the V-belt guard for my belly sickle mower. I haven't done a shade comparison of MAE vs. MTK in 60080 but doubt there is a significant difference. I suspect it would be closer that the slight difference between MTK and DCC. I chose MTK for my B because I have supplied-air and I wanted the advantages of a urethane paint.
Rod
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