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Premixed Fuel

Yesterday's Tractor Forums
J

John M

Well-known Member
OK, so I know for what you get, these cans of premixed fuel are expensive, like 8 bucks a quart around here.

I would like an honest opinion of them, good, bad, etc.
 
I use it in my ice auger with good luck. That little carb clogs easy. Being it only gets used a few times a year I don't mind the expense. I wouldn't use it on bigger stuff that gets more use because of the $. I have been using StarTron instead of Stabil for a while now, seems like it helps.
 
Since I have started using them. I have had less problems. They do cost money. But if you think about it. Buying the oil,price of gasoline. Then you have to mix it. Price comes out almost the same.
 
I am sold on it's ability to condition hard diaphragms and stay good all winter. I use it in the line trimmer because that little carb is so easy to clog. Of course I only use a can or two all summer. I also put it in the chain saw if I don't know when I'll use it next.
 
We use bottled pre-mix for the chainsaw on our fire department's brush truck. We feel it provides some added insurance over pump gas for an engine that doesn't get run much but is very important to have working when you need it. For the small amount of fuel the saw uses in an application like this the extra cost is a non-issue. For me personally I use enough fuel in my saw and string trimmer to just mix my own using pump gas and don't have any issues with it.
 
I can see it for fire dept or others where you don't know when you'll need the tool, but has to be ready to go when you need it. Otherwise, I just dump the extra out of the tool. Then spray some carburetor cleaner in the tank, start up the tool, and run it so it gets carb cleaner through the carb.

Guy on here several years ago had a "guaranteed" method of starting an engine which may have had old gas. Disconnect fuel line under the tank and drain gas. Spray carb cleaner (the aerosol hydrocarbon stuff, not the caustic dip) into the gas line to the carb, then some down the air horn of the carb, then hook up the fuel line and spray some into the bottom of the empty tank. He guaranteed it would start on the first pull. I've used it 3 times, and so far he's batting a thousand.
 
Star-Tron is good stuff. Breaks the molecular chain of the ethinol in gas. Those little cans as another posted about brush truck saws etc. The forest service here in SJ loves the stuff. They carry it on their trucks and just pour it into their saws. Always works. When they have finised they pour out the fuel into a truck gas tank and start up the saw and run the gas out of the carb. Next time just pour that stuff in again. Look at the cans lable. There are three types. Get the one with the most oil in it.
 
We can get it six bucks a can. Around here (IN) it is hard to tell if you are buying reg pump gas with ethanol in it or not. Canned fuel is made without ethanol, has synthetic oil mix and has a 92 octane rating. No question it is mixed in right proportion oil & gas. It always starts the weed eater and chain saws, tools that aren't used regularly, so we use it.
 
I am just more curious than anything about it. I have no problems mixing it myself, but I went today to get some 2 cycle, and they were out of my usual brand, and just thought about using this stuff.
 
at 8 dollars a quart that's 32 dollars a gal. I can mix years worth of non e-10 gas seams like a scam a ratio rite mixing cup is a couple dollars .
 
we use it in all engines that don't get run a lot for our Fire Dept saws,pumps,jaws,any thing that dose not get run very often and it is the best thing we ever did no more carbs being full of crap. ya it is expensive but worth it
 

I have to say that it is ridiculously expensive compared to mixing my own, but if I had had it ten years ago I would probably still be on the same string trimmer, and the original carburetor on my saw. So I plan to start using it, and I expect that the FD will as well.
 
Agreed...! it does not take many carburetor clean up overhauls to pay for an eight dollar can of gasoline mixture. Especially at the end of the season , using this mixture will save you a lot of headaches in the spring. And the engine will start so much easier , with less strain on the starting mechanism and the operator. I have a quit Mixing fuel. The extra cost of the mixed fuel is Nothing compared to the cost of overhauls headaches and no-start frustrations.
 
I don't know what the heck some of the other folk have been doing wrong that they think an over-priced can of premixed gas is going to fix. I have a lot of gas-powered equipment that sits in storage a lot. Weedeaters, chainsaws, lawn-mowers, garden tractors, water-pumps etc. Zero problems with the cheapest pump gas and some Stabil added.

I have over a dozen chain-saws that sit at three different locations. Again, no problems with gas. All these claims about somehow a premixed can of gas with a 500% markup is somehow superior? I'd like to see even one shred of verifiable evidence to support it. Again, I have to wonder what the heck some of you are doing to your equipment.

I WILL note that I had one machine that every Spring would not start (4-stroke-cycle engine). I had to use starter-fluid at first Spring start and after that it was fine all summer. A guy I know claimed he had the same problems until he started using non-ethanol gas. OK. I am open minded. I got it and tried it. Next Spring, same problem. NEVER will I fall for one of these "snake oil" stories again ( I hope). Hey, if someone feels better over-paying for something - no skin off my nose. But, come on! Claiming it saves you money in the long run?
 
Snake oil! I mix my own, and I don't have any trouble, we have 9 small 2-strokes, and they all run just fine. The oldest chainsaw is 46 years old, I use it every year.
 
Something I have not seen mentioned, will it be more compatible with the Tygon fuel line?

That seems to be the common area of failure, I assume it is the ethanol that attacks it.
 
For a casual owner/user of couple of two cycle machines that don't get a lot of use like me, it's the "cat's meow".

No worries, no issues, a quart or two gets me by for a couple of years.

Probably not so economical for you "high volume users".

On the other hand, if you have machines that use a lot of two cycle mix and "turn it over" frequently it would be an unnecessary expense, vs. pump gas and some 2-cycle oil.
 
I can see buying a can of premix if you are do not have a gas-can and need some gas to run something. Otherwise? Come on!

Same goes for buying "premixed antifreeze" at the same price as full strength. Just in case you are somewhere where you have no access to water to dilute it - it might make sense. Otherwise - just laziness as I see it.

There is nothing in a can of "premix" that is superior to what you buy at the pump, and oil at the store of your choice.
There IS something INFERIOR. Only one choice of mix ratio. I run 20 to 1 in everything I own. No matter if it is a 2-stoke-cycle built in 1948 or in 2018. More oil is always better as far as wear goes. Low oil mixes are for emissions purposes - not engine longevity.

One exception. Using more oil makes the engine run leaner. No problem as long as you have an adjustable main-jet. If not - you'll need to stick with the OEM mix-ratio.
 
A big difference between pump gas and premix is vapor pressure. Reid Vapor Pressure for premix is around 7 psi, which makes it comparable to avgas. Winter-grade pump gas, depending on your locality, can be over 9 psi RVP. That means premix, once it's opened, will evaporate much slower than pump gas.
 
(quoted from post at 08:37:24 03/31/18) I can see buying a can of premix if you are do not have a gas-can and need some gas to run something. Otherwise? Come on!

Same goes for buying "premixed antifreeze" at the same price as full strength. Just in case you are somewhere where you have no access to water to dilute it - it might make sense. Otherwise - just laziness as I see it.

There is nothing in a can of "premix" that is superior to what you buy at the pump, and oil at the store of your choice.
There IS something INFERIOR. Only one choice of mix ratio. I run 20 to 1 in everything I own. No matter if it is a 2-stoke-cycle built in 1948 or in 2018. More oil is always better as far as wear goes. Low oil mixes are for emissions purposes - not engine longevity.

One exception. Using more oil makes the engine run leaner. No problem as long as you have an adjustable main-jet. If not - you'll need to stick with the OEM mix-ratio.
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Also more oil will build heat especially in tighter toleranced high rpm engines ie. Husky, Jonsered, etc. Which causes premature piston/cyl. as well bearing damage. I was trained by husky in the eighties when some of those saws were being developed and they showed the effects of heavy mixes. They didn't sell their own oils yet so had nothing to gain and wanted techs to educate the consumers to the factors of premature failures.
I actually have a prototype Husky 262 built several years before production (33 yrs old) and have always used their ratio. It's on it's second plug, 3rd fuel filter. And now that it's available to me use nothing but e free gas. It has cut 2 triaxle log loads this season. Nothing against premixes they work good but to expensive for heavy usage.
 

To me best thing about the pre-mixed fuel, is it comes in a metal container with a cap that keeps the contents sealed. In warm weather the lighter components of the fuel do not escape as vapor. These lighter components are important for engine starting. In cooler weather the container does not allow humid air to enter and condense as water.

For me the fuel is much too expensive. I keep my fuel containers sealed. I find metal containers are best since, they are better able to withstand the pressure changes as the weather (temperature) changes.

Certainly there are applications where the cost could be justified. For example, use in fire dept. equipment, as has been posted.
 
If these young whippersnappers that think modern gas is so bad had to deal with that old crap that had lead in it they would think differently.
 
I buy the premix anti freeze for a couple of reasons, first I get the correct mix and I don't have to have a lot of items such as multiple containers to pour the full strength antifreeze in and then something to measure the correct amount of water to put in and then I do not have to think about getting the mix all over me as I try to get it mixed. And I had 2 vehicals that could never find a reason they were using anti freeze so I used a lot. One after the engine went bad mechanic was laying under car checking crank when a drop hip him in face and that is when we were finaly to find a leaking water pump. By truck I had to add anti freeze every 150 mile and could not find where it was going (garage and me) finally figured it out when it started leaking bad enough it was making fan belt slip so it was not charging. Carried multiple jugs in bothvehicals and the agrivation of mixing was more than the aditional cost of the premix. Laziness not a factor. Ability to have what was needed in correct mixture was. And I no longer have a gas powered chain saw but the amount I ever used it would have made sence, only used to clean up storm fallen trees where they would make problems like in yard. Have elerctric saw now for that.
 
Premixed fuel is like Yeti coolers. I really admire people who figured out how to convince people to pay 8X the price to buy something that they used to be perfectly happy buying at 1/8 the price.

Like Yeti coolers, there ARE people who genuinely benefit from them. It's about 1 in 1000, I figure. The rest are just spending $400 for "benefits" that aren't real. Yes, for emergency service use where fuel has to sit for long periods of time and must work when needed.

For the average user, buy 1 gallon of non-ox at a time. Use top quality synthetic oil mixed exactly to the engine's stated requirement. Put a piece of tape on the can and write the date. If older than a year, pour it in a tractor or car. Repeat. Man, that's complicated, isn't it?

If you like small bottles that seal tightly, get is SIG camping fuel bottle for $10 and put your gas in that. I do that for areas where we have to hike in to cut. Works great.

Overmixing is a major cause of engine issues and like everything else these days, guys blame their mistakes on ethanol.

I have to find one of these products that I can reinvent and get guys to pay 10x the price for the "new" version. Anyone have any ideas?

Grouse
 
From Goose,
"I have to find one of these products that I can reinvent and get guys to pay 10x the price for the "new" version. Anyone have any ideas?"

Gotta hand it to the person who rebranded rocks for pets!!
 
(quoted from post at 08:37:09 03/31/18) I buy the premix anti freeze for a couple of reasons, first I get the correct mix and I don't have to have a lot of items such as multiple containers to pour the full strength antifreeze in and then something to measure the correct amount of water to put in and then I do not have to think about getting the mix all over me as I try to get it mixed. And I had 2 vehicals that could never find a reason they were using anti freeze so I used a lot. One after the engine went bad mechanic was laying under car checking crank when a drop hip him in face and that is when we were finaly to find a leaking water pump. By truck I had to add anti freeze every 150 mile and could not find where it was going (garage and me) finally figured it out when it started leaking bad enough it was making fan belt slip so it was not charging. Carried multiple jugs in bothvehicals and the agrivation of mixing was more than the aditional cost of the premix. Laziness not a factor. Ability to have what was needed in correct mixture was. And I no longer have a gas powered chain saw but the amount I ever used it would have made sence, only used to clean up storm fallen trees where they would make problems like in yard. Have elerctric saw now for that.
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Mixing anti freeze is no big deal. Pour in a jug of anti freeze, take the same jug and fill it with water and pour it in-- BINGO! a 50/50 mix. Unless it's an engine without a water pump, it will mix itself as soon as you start it up. If you need to top it off, just use straight anti freeze. It won't hurt anything--in fact it will just increase the protection, which is not a bad thing.
 
(quoted from post at 09:47:35 03/31/18) That non-ox means without ethenal, correct? That is not available.
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It's available at almost every gas station here. Look at the stickers on the pump, they say non-oxygenated fuel for classic and off-road vehicles and equipment. Non-ox = no ethanol.

Even if you can't get it in the wilds of Ohio, it's not that big of a deal. Even gas with ethanol is fine for a year. The problems come in when people buy and mix 5 gallons for their weed eater because that's the size can they have. Then 5 years later they are still burning the same gas and wonder why they have problems and blame it on ethanol.

Grose
 
(quoted from post at 09:41:58 03/31/18) From Goose,
"I have to find one of these products that I can reinvent and get guys to pay 10x the price for the "new" version. Anyone have any ideas?"

Gotta hand it to the person who rebranded rocks for pets!!
Click to expand...

Kind of, but the price point has to be higher.

I got it. Diesel pickup trucks! Perfect example. I love going shopping in the burbs and seeing strip development cowboys driving their shiny half ton diesel pickups. Most of them have never had anything other than groceries in the box and have never seen a trailer hitch.

Need more ideas like this.

Grouse
 
You keep adding a full strength quart a week and not long before the strength reading will not be the 35 but 40 or 45. And if you could actually see level in a jug when it is half full to add water it would not be so bad but when you cannot see thru the plastic to tell level in jug how do you know you are getting a 50-50 mix or a 35-63 mix ot a 65-35 mix. Need to have a clear mixing container with levels acruatly marked to hold a gallon jug of antifreeze and then a gallon jug of water and to use the jug you just poored out of the antifreeze you do not know how full to fill the jug because you do not know what the level was with the antifreeze in it, could be you get 5 quarts of water in and think you are getting a 50-50 mix. And the time and agrivation to mix is worth bore than the bit of cost difference. I ysed to do the trying to mix and found way too many problems trying to do that. You think radiator is supposed to hold 2 gallon so you put in 1 gallon of antifreeze and go to put in the gallon of water and radiator is overflowing with a half gallon of water, you do not have the mix you want. Now if you are in an area that requires a 50 below mix and only a 35 below is avaible then yes it is worth the hastle of doing the mixing but not if you are in the area that 35 below like all premixes are made for and that includes the areas that never get below 50 above it does not pay to do the mixing yourself. You mix what the book calles for and you are either short or have too much and still need to store the extra you have mixed and then someone elso comes along and sees your home mixed thinking it is still full strength and they do the mixing and it is not strong enough and you have a frozen up radiator how does that gain you anything. And for the time to do the mix as against the premix if you figure any time to do the mixing the full strength is actually costing you more.
 
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