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purchasing a rifle

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Charlie M

Well-known Member
I'm not too knowledgeable about rifles - only rifle I own is a 22 I got from my dad when he passed away. I have several shotguns from my dad also. I've always wanted something bigger than a 22 for shooting
wood chucks, target shooting and stuff like that out my garden. Its also possible to be shooting a fox, coyote or raccoon with rabies being around the area. I've had access to my bother-in-law's 30-30 for a
while but his son has reclaimed it so I'm back to my 22 for the moment. What would you guys that know more than me recommend. I don't think I want to buy a new one and bolt action is fine with me. My whole
theme in life these days is for older stuff. NY state has too much crap to go through for a semi or fully automatic anything and I don't really need that capability anyway. There is a good auction house
available that frequently sells guns of all types and sizes. What do you think?
 
It depends on how far you want to shoot, if you have close neighbors I would get a .30-30 lever gun. If your looking to reach out a ways a 22-250 bolt gun would be good. ammo is easier to find for those 2 calibers.
 
Good advice. It does depend on how far away you intend to shoot. Maybe consider a good bolt action 22 mag. or a 243 for more reach. A Marlin 336 in 30-30 is always nice. If in a restricted deer area the 350 Legend is kind of a modern 30-30.
 
What kind of range does a 30-30 have. I'm certainly not a good enough shot for real long range shooting and while I'm not in a high density house area there are houses not that far away. Most stuff I would shoot is behind my house where there are no neighbor houses. Most stuff would be around my garden area which is about 50 yards from my house.
 
30/30 is good for around 150 yards maybe a tad bit more most of the time. A 22mag is a good size for ground hogs I know I have taken them with one and it is good for 200 plus yards
 
A 223 bolt gun will do what you want to do and better than a 30-30. The chances of finding a used one are much better and probably cheaper than a lever action. Ammo is more available and cheaper than 30-30. If you think you might want to hunt deer, then look for a 243 bolt gun. Look for a Savage, there is nothing wrong with their Axis model. Mossberg and Marlin both build cheaper bolt guns in 223 or 243.
 
I'd second the 22 mag for what you are describing, in a nice lever action. But a 22-250 will reach out a whole lot farther if you need it. My personal favorite is the 243, followed closely by the 22-250. But I use both on antelope, so it gives you an idea that both are probably bigger than what you are asking for. And the 22-250 is obnoxiously loud. steve
 
With close neighbors, what you're shooting at, and how far away you'll be shooting, your .22LR is a good choice IMHO.

For a little more "oomph" look at a .17HMR or .22WMR. Both are very popular varmint calibers and you're looking to shoot varmints.
 
I'm a firm believer in Ruger 10-22's. I've had several in past years and have had super luck with them. It's a rifle that barks over here and bites over there. Simple concept. Cheap to shoot and although not flushed with stopping power. But you can unload a magazine as fast as you can pull the trigger. I've shot targets and had a great pattern every time. My present one is in beautiful shape, had my smith install a scope. Lasered it in and it shoots right on. The only other gun I have is a heavy Enfield Mark 4 from WWII . Those Brits are bad a** to tote one of those around day after day.
 
I have a couple Model 94s, several ARs, a Mini 14 but my favorite is my Ruger 10-22 scoped. Very accurate and cheap to shoot. I would like a .17HMR just because but have other priorities right now.
 
When I was on the farm; my go to varmit gun was a 592 remington 5M. Sold it when i left the farm. most people don't even know what it is. long or short range; good killing power. flat shooting, great gun! It was so good the government made them stop production in the early 70's. being a rimfire it was quiet and the government feared it'd be used as an assassination gun!
 
Just my opinion... you already have your gun, a .22. A .22 long rifle with high-speed hollow points will easy kill a woodchuck or fox at 50 yards. If you are just looking for something else fun to shoot that can reach out and touch something... .17HMR, bull barrel, with a BSA Sweet 17 scope. Fun, not too expensive to shoot and my longest shot so far took a pigeon at 265 yards. Poof! feathers.
I own high power rifles, shotguns, 30-30 lever, 9mm carbine but a scoped bolt action .22 is what sits by the door.
 
I have to agree with the different advise you have here, seems good to me. Depends on what you want. But a scoped 10-22 is hard to beat. Hollow points for 50 yard woodchucks.
 
Many good suggestions have been posted. I will try to answer the question Janicholson has asked. Janicholson what something bigger than a 22LR, does not want a semi or full auto and has experience with a 30-30. Therefore if Janicholson walked into my gun shop, I would lead him to a rifle that ammunition is easy to get. As has been suggested already lever 30-30, bolt 243 and bolt 223 which are all good choices. By far the 223 ammunition is easier to get than the others as of today but that may change. Historically 223/556 ammunition has been the most plentiful. At one time you could even buy an oil barrel full of 223/556 ammunition.
So my recommendation, if you walked into my gun store, would be either a bolt action 223 or a lever 30-30.
 
Depends on what you want to spend and what you like.

You want to shoot Varmints coyotes, skunks, fox, etc - basically things a little bit big for a .22 - but still in a size that many would consider taking with a .22 or a 22 magnum. One of the best rounds out there for that is .223 and the then put it in an AR15 (DPMS) with a collapsible stock. That way the stock can be adjust to fit you or your wife without issue. The recoil is next to nothing and it easy to use and clean. Get it with a scope, open sights or both.

Next rifle I would look at is a CZ 600 Trail. Its a bolt action rifle in .223 or 7.62 X 39 - again it has a collapsible stock so it can be adjust to any size of shooter. My brother just bought that rifle - a very sweet easy to shoot rifle with sights that just seem to line up with minimal effort. I shot it and in 5 seconds adjusted the stock so my 12 year old could shoot.


After that the traditional Savage Axis with a accutrigger in .243 or a Ruger American in .243 with the adjustable trigger if going new. If going for a used rifle look for a Marlin XS-7 or X-7 in .243 or .223 and the profire adjustable trigger - these guns were $300-$350 range when new and seem to sell right at that and a little higher than new price after they've been out for 10 years. They will have black plastic stock (part of the reason they were cheap) but are very high quality shooters very similar to the Savage 110 rifle. I have on in stainless steel XS-7 and Boyd laminated stock that makes it look like a million bucks.


I recently picked up a cheap Savage 340 in 30-30 just because. 20 years ago this rifle sold for $90-$120 all day long at any gun shop. Today even though its 20 years older (production from the 1950s to the early 1980s) the cheapest it can be had is in the $250 range if in good condition. A good solid bolt action single lug rifle shooting a solid round like the 30-30. I keep the magazine loaded and in my night stand so I can pop it in the rifle in the dark and check out what the dogs are in a frenzy over if I don't pick up the old Savage 311 side by side 12 gauge.
 
Agreed on the ammo statement. For almost a year I couldn't find 30-30 or 30-06, .308 and .243 seemed to be available most of the time but .223 was always available. Price is another issue - .223 got as high was $2 a round but is now back to .60 to .80 per round. .308 and .243 average $1.20 - $1.50 a round now and were much much higher a year ago.
 
While you have many choices and great suggestions below, narrow it down by researching and deciding what is best for the tasks you need it for, hunting/varmint's, target/recreation etc. Include the cost effectiveness of the calibers you are looking at.
Right now, there were a lot of people trading in for ones like AR's and similar, + other semi's because of the insanity this inept governor is putting law abiding citizens through. I have seen a lot of great deals on well taken care of trade-ins, many were older models of various makes and models. Those used racks were changing a lot over this summer in this area, lots of opportunities and I'll bet even still as those with the credentials, this governor cannot prohibit. (existing NYS pistol permit/semi auto rifle amendment)
 
I would suggest one of the fine varmit loads available.
For long range shooting I use the 22-250 which are very exciting , I have never had a rifle that offers so much pleasure target or varmit
No experience with the 22 swift ,but like the 22-250
243 for up to deer for all around work horse in hunting varmit and target.
For economic pleasure for varmit target I enjoy the 22 magnum to relax and see what limits it will push out to 150 yards with crow for example .,just a joy to shoot .and shoot
Avoid heavy barrel unless you employ tripod in most cases where you want relax and wait for you to be ready to fire. Nothing against heavy barrel but it learns to the precise rifle use .
 
I would suggest one of the fine varmit loads available.
For long range shooting I use the 22-250 which are very exciting , I have never had a rifle that offers so much pleasure target or varmit
No experience with the 22 swift ,but like the 22-250
243 for up to deer for all around work horse in hunting varmit and target.
For economic pleasure for varmit target I enjoy the 22 magnum to relax and see what limits it will push out to 150 yards with crow for example .,just a joy to shoot .and shoot
Avoid heavy barrel unless you employ tripod in most cases where you want relax and wait for you to be ready to fire. Nothing against heavy barrel but it learns to the precise rifle use .
 
One thing nobody has mentioned is if you shoot left handed, and yes there are some of them out there. A bolt will be a bit cumbersome if you are a died in the wool left handed. Now a lever will help with some of that. And you can get high and low mounts for them the high you could still use the open sights if you want and have more clearance for the ejection of spent cases. A Winchester lever is not as well adapted to scope use in a lever. They eject out the top where as the Marlin ejects out the side thus easier to mount a scope on without some of the cumbersomeness of the Winchester. Yes all of them eject to the right side so again if left handed it can be a bit of a nuisance. For most of what you want to do you already have it a 22. I tend to have a different idea of cartridges so not a fan of some listed. they are very capable of the job abd over kill for some of it. I just don't care for them. The shoguns will also work fine and can get various loads and shot size for what you are going to use it for. Fewer pellets would be better for the garden so it is not all shot up from the spread pattern. They also have rifled barrels for shotguns with slugs of various types could be used too.
 
There are three things to decide, probably in this order: Cartridge, action and the particular make and model.

The choice in cartridges ranges from rimfire all the way up to .458 Winchester Magnum and beyond, but for varmints you'll probably want something no bigger than 6mm/.243 caliber. On the low end you have the various rimfires, such as .22 mag and .17 HMR; I am not a fan of rimfire cartridges because they can't be reloaded and tend to be on the light side for larger varmints.

Is noise an issue for you? If so, that pretty much rules out the most powerful varmint rounds such as .243 Winchester and .22-250. .223 Remington is also pretty loud. Likewise with .204 Ruger and .17 Remington. But if you don't care how loud your gun is, any of those will be an excellent choice. .243 can be used to take larger game as well. For something quieter, consider .22 Hornet or .22 Remington Fireball, which aren't much louder than a rimfire but effective against woodchucks. My preferred woodchuck rifle is in .17 Remington Fireball, an excellent round that never became popular. But it looks like the new .17 Hornady Hornet will be a bit more successful.

As for action, the bolt action is the preference of most varmint hunters, due to its accuracy, strength and reliability. There are a few single shot actions available as well, such as the Ruger No. 1, and the Thompson-Center Contender, which I'll get to in a bit. There's little need for a semi-auto varmint rifle, since if you miss a woodchuck on your first shot you're not going to get a second.

Once you have picked out the cartridge and action, you'll probably have a bewildering choice of candidate rifles. You're pretty much limited by whatever your budget is. In general, you get what you pay for.

Coming back to the T-C Contender, this is a single-shot rifle (originally pistol) that uses interchangeable barrels. So a single action can be quickly converted from one caliber to another. The Contender is good for cartridges up to .30-30 Winchester, while its big brother the T-C Encore can handle much more powerful cartridges. Here's my woodchuck gun: A T-C Contender rifle with a custom .17 Remington Fireball barrel from Match Grade Machine. It's a tack driver and takes several woodchucks every year. I handload my ammo, making it dirt cheap to shoot.
cvphoto135532.jpg
 
I was walking around a gun show in Topeka Kansas last Saturday and saw several models of firearms I used to own - some I thought I sold for outrageous prices - now these prices are all higher. I bought M38 Turkish Mauser with all numbers matching back in the early 90s for $42. I sold it in the early 2000s because I never used it and saw I could get $150 for it. Now that rifle is in the $500+ range. I had several versions of the Russian M91 Mosin Nagant rifles that I bought for less than $100 each that I thought my sons would shoot. After a little use in they were left behind for real hunting rifles. I sold all of them but one M38 and one M44 carbine - made a few dollars on them but still sold them for less than $150. Those same cheap POS rifles are now in the $500-$600 range. The carbines that I was smart enough to keep are in the $800+ range.... Don't even get me started on the unissued SKS rifles that I bought for $84 back in the 1990s that are now in the $500-$800 range.

The one that really hurts is the Garand with a VAR barrel that I paid a whopping $200 for from the CMP. Had it a couple years - realized it really wasn't that great of a hunting rifle and sold it to my BIL for $400 on the condition he would sell it back to me if he ever sold it. Same rifle is now well over $1000 and some places have it in the $2000 range. My BIL being smarter than me - isn't selling.

Then I think back to the Ruger Redhawk in 44 Mag that I bought for $350 - had it a while and thought the recoil was too harsh and I was picking up some bad habits by shooting it. Sold it for what I paid for a year later and never thought anything about it. Same gun today (if you can find it) is in the $800 to $1000 range. My first handgun was a cheap H&R 504 revolver in 32 Mag. I paid $50 for it - nice little gun that sat in my night stand through college and I eventually traded for Ruger Blackhawk. I can't even find one like it now, different versions that are somewhat close are in the $300 range.


I have resolved that anything I own I am keeping - nothing gets sold.
 
Ruger 77/17. .17hmr. It is based on the .22 magnum rimfire. I've shot a lot of woodchucks etc. With mine. It is very accurate, lethal, quiet and cheap to shoot. Ammunition is readily available. I had a lot more success with it than a 222 because the mild report didn't scare everything underground.
 


As others are saying if you want accuracy at a little distance you want something that takes a bigger load than just a 30-30. Go to a store and ask to see the cartridges. You will see that one for a 300 holds a lot more powder than the little 30 cal. to fire the same sized projectile.
 
It's amazing what the models you mentioned are going for now. I recall those Mosin/Nagants new out of the crate for like $100 if I recall. Garands and M1 carbines are ridiculous, and you can't find .30 carbine ammo right now, if you do, expensive. I cannot believe what well used M1 Carbines bring for nostalgia, say if original Inland Div. of GM or similar WWII era.

I've dealt with Gun Parts in West Hurley NY for over 30 years and they used to re-barrel and re-furb both these models of rifles, had racks of them for sale, all good shooters. Not original by any means and well worn before they worked em over again. It was great, they had a nice retail counter and display with lots of things they were selling, the catalog was always a good buy given the parts diagrams for so many firearms.

You can get a brand new better than mil spec M1 Carbine from Fulton Armory for about a 1/3rd more than these originals bring right now and they have a nice line up of them. New is the key word here. Inland, a modern company, not the GM division, offers a very nice new M1 Carbine right now too, neither are in-expensive though. Such a shame that ammo is hard to find for these, great little rifles. DCM/CMP was a great resource for both the Garand and M1 Carbine, the later of which sold for $20 back in the 60's, $200-$300 early mid 80's and now they are $1-$2K used !

With the rush to beat the semi-auto deadline, it was worth trekking around to the local shops, lot of decent deals, when compared to new prices, saw a like new CZ semi 12ga, trap shooter, no camo, $400, price one new. Same with handguns, people went nuts to get NY compliant AR's, parted with some nice keepers to fund the deals, at least that is how I saw it, never saw so much used gun action as of late.
 
I think the 22LR the OP already owns is sufficient to do the job he needs it to do, and safely at that. I am unclear just how far his back yard extends until some unseen, unaware human is going about their business. Is it 500 feet to the next road over, or five miles over a hill?

Encroaching sprawl has meant I can no longer just go out back target shooting like we once did. The woodchucks love the ditch bank 100 yards from our house, but when I look through the scope, I see that new house in the backdrop a quarter mile away. I certainly don't want to bounce 22LR bullets off their siding, when I miss, and I do miss.

For that reason, I bought a 17HMR. The available ballistic tip bullies fragment on impact, both becoming more lethal to a struck varmint and less likely to ricochet off a great distance.

I bought the Ruger Rimfire, because I like the way it looks, and I wanted it. With a decent scope, I am five kills in six shots, only missed the baby skunk I did not want to hit in the backside.

I also added another, special attachment. It makes the weapon quite a bit less intrusive, if not quite more expensive.

The 22MAG also features the ballistic tip rounds available- I balanced cost of ammo when I made my purchase.

This post was edited by K Effective on 09/13/2022 at 06:58 pm.
 
Guns are a good place to "park" some money. I have never bought a gun that is worth less now then what I paid for it. My $69 Mosin has probably gone up the most.
 
(quoted from post at 11:05:09 09/14/22) If that is a 98/31 they now sell for around $600 plus
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f you value your privacy,.....don't purchase a gun with a VISA card!
 
I'd look for an older model 340 Savage in either .22 Hornet, or .222 Remington. I have shot woodchucks in my back yard with the Hornet, and my neighbors never knew it.
 
(quoted from post at 16:05:09 09/14/22) If that is a 98/31 they now sell for around $600 plus
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Yes it's a 98. Has a scope kit and a Timmney trigger installed. It was "new old stock" a real mess to get clean but about as good a shooting Mosin as there is. I really got lucky.
 
You state that 50 yards is the range at which you will do most of your shooting and you have not mentioned anything about hunting deer or such.The .22 rimfire magnum and the 17 rimfire magnum would fill the bill. If you prefer a centerfire, reloadable cartridge, the .223/5.56 would be a good choice. Considering the current political climate, a bolt action would be a good choice. In your situation, a .22 hornet or .222 would possibly be a better choice. However, the .22 hornet has not been popular for decades, and the .222 has so thoroughly been shaded by the .223, that it's popularity has declined by a large factor in the last 30 years. Due in large part to the above mentioned situation, ammo shortages are becoming more frequent and longer in duration. In those situations less popular calibers become next to impossible to purchase. Stick with the more popular calibers and keep a three year supply on hand. A lever rifle in .45 colt, 38 special/.357 magnum, or .44 special/.44 magnum would be a good choice also. Of the three, the .45 colt would be the least versatile and my last choice. All of them are short range numbers (100 yards or so) They will handle any varmint that ever lived and are adequate to 100 yards or a tad more for medium sized edible gritters. The 30/30 would be good out to 150 yards or so and certainly handle any varmint that ever lived. If you have any intention of harvesting edible critters,then the .243 would be a good compromise between a varmint gun and a deer sized game gun. As you can tell from the replies below, there are a gazillion good choices to fill your needs. Whatever you decide to go with, make sure you can lay your hands on a supply of ammo for the thing. Good luck.
 
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