Remove rear axle hub

[JohnAndrew]

The rear axle seals have been leaking for years now I will attempt to change. Hub is stuck hard to the axle, I use port-a-power, banging on it, wheel puller and heat (400+F) nothing work so far. Would it be easier to pull the axle with hub out of the tractor?
1963 IH 404 tractor.

 

[Janicholson]

Well your tactics are on track, I would like to see a 3 hook puller with more heft. I also think giving it 40 whacks while rather warm from al directions on the place
where you were heating would stir it up. they can be a serious inconvenience. Jim

 

[caterpillar guy]

Be careful of hitting inward on the end of the axle. Like the bigger tractors use the case casting to hold the bearing on the inside from moving inward when in use. IF you crack that ledge the bearing goes in to it will be another problem to solve. I can't say if that is the case with this model just it is on some of them. IF there is a key can you drive it back in so it goes out from under the cast hub? IF so that would allow for a bit of loosening. Other wise tighten your puller up tight then with heat on the hub tighten some more and let set till cool may just move as it cools. otherwise you might try some candle wax trying to get it to soak in the crack between the hub and axle. Might need to have it pressed off from the hub with a big press. That would entail removing the whole axle housing for that. You will probably need more heat than just a few hundered degrees. more like red hot on the hub.

 

[the tractor vet]

well first off ya don't have enough puller , next ya aren't usen a rose bud . To remove one of them Puppy's ya need around 25 to 35 ton puller and a bearing splitter around the back side of the hub , you don't want to apply that much force on the flange or it will break off . Ya need fast HOT heat over a large area that you can only get from a rose bud tip . It is taking to long to for heat to build and this is also expanding the axle at the same time . At times we have had to sued two rose buds to heat both sides on some problem ones w3hile the pulling force is at max and when they break loose things go flying . Ya never lived till ya have to pull the sprockets off a big Cat dozer and your usen the 100 ton puller set up and ya have it maxed out and nothing is moving .

 

[fastfarmall]

Have heard of a Posi-Lock puller,it's a 3 jaw puller, they make all sizes and you can clamp the jaws on too the pulling surface,i got a Big Bertha L.P gas roadside ditch burner, that's what i would use, for a heat supply, its got about 2 1/2 muzzle where the flame comes out!

 

[the tractor vet]

Posiloc does not have a puller big enough and your road side weed burner will not put out the heat needed and like i aid putting that much force on the flag will not end well , ya need a large bearing spliter and someplace north of 25 ton pulling force . and not one but to BIG rose bud tips working both sides of the hub at once and not messing around with a large welding tip nor a cutting torch .Ya want the hub to expand faster then the axle . If you could heat that hub up to just 300 degrees Super fast before it starts soaking into the axle it would darn near fall off.

 

[JohnAndrew]

Update: Made a 1" plate with 4 -9/19 diameter grade 8 bolts. Broke the plate. How easy is it to pull the axle? Anyone have a diagram?

 

[JohnAndrew]

(quoted from post at 23:33:48 10/15/23) Posiloc does not have a puller big enough and your road side weed burner will not put out the heat needed and like i aid putting that much force on the flag will not end well , ya need a large bearing spliter and someplace north of 25 ton pulling force . and not one but to BIG rose bud tips working both sides of the hub at once and not messing around with a large welding tip nor a cutting torch .Ya want the hub to expand faster then the axle . If you could heat that hub up to just 300 degrees Super fast before it starts soaking into the axle it would darn near fall off.

A bearing spiltter needs another close surface to the hub to push against, which there is none. I need info on how to pull the axle.
Thanks for the input.

 

[JohnAndrew]

Thanks for the input. The hub has multiple splines not one big keyway. I've used candle wax before without much luck all it does is catch on fire. I will try heat one more time if no luck I will remove the axle.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

Not sure what you mean by "push against." You would PULL on the bearing splitter like this:

Instead of a puller, though, you'd use a 20+ ton bottle jack.

BTW that plate split because it's cast. Wrong material to use.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

Also, I don't think removing the axle is going to help. You can't disconnect it from the bull gear and just pull it out. Pretty sure the hub needs to come off, then the axle housing slides off the end of the axle.

 

[Chester5731]

posi loc makes a 12 inch puller that looks like it will fit that. I borrowed one to remove the cast flywheel on my IH haybine and it worked well.

 

[JohnAndrew]

(quoted from post at 13:13:35 10/17/23) Also, I don't think removing the axle is going to help. You can't disconnect it from the bull gear and just pull it out. Pretty sure the hub needs to come off, then the axle housing slides off the end of the axle.

Take a look at this 4 minute video on youtube. I believe this tractor is similar to mine and the axle should come out with a little effort once I remove the bolt that keeps it to the bull gear.
Video on youtube= "B275, B414, 276, 434,444, and 384 rear axle replacement"
Thank for the picture of the bearing splitter. Now I understand how it works. I will check out the cost of one or try to rent on somewhere.

 

[JohnAndrew]

(quoted from post at 13:10:52 10/17/23) Not sure what you mean by "push against." You would PULL on the bearing splitter like this:

Instead of a puller, though, you'd use a 20+ ton bottle jack.

BTW that plate split because it's cast. Wrong material to use.

What I meant about pushing against is a bearing splitter is designed with a sharp edge to wedge between the bearing and a housing. So the wedging effect will break loose the bearing from the shaft, See sketch. Then it is used as a puller to pull the bearing off the shaft. Of course the bearing splitter can be used as only as a puller.
Yes cast plate, I didn't realize that until it broke. It broke with quite a pop, knocked my glasses off.

 

[JohnAndrew]

(quoted from post at 13:13:35 10/17/23) Also, I don't think removing the axle is going to help. You can't disconnect it from the bull gear and just pull it out. Pretty sure the hub needs to come off, then the axle housing slides off the end of the axle.

You maybe correct that the hub has to be removed. I found a axle diagram on another post. The steps in the shaft indicates to me that the outside bearing will come off with the shaft. Which means I need to pull of the hub to get the new seal in place, what a pain.

 

[JohnAndrew]

(quoted from post at 18:43:41 10/14/23) The rear axle seals have been leaking for years now I will attempt to change. Hub is stuck hard to the axle, I use port-a-power, banging on it, wheel puller and heat (400+F) nothing work so far. Would it be easier to pull the axle with hub out of the tractor?
1963 IH 404 tractor.

Update:
I received a manual today from Binder Books. Is shows pressing the axle assy out (bolt spreader), pressing the Hub off. Change the seal. Then press the hub back on the axle then press axle assy back into the tractor. I will rethink this project, I may just keep putting in oil when need and forget about changing the seals.