Salt damaged concrete

[Old weldor]

I have lived in my rural home since 1977. I have a concrete septic tank. Im on my third water softener. I have my tank pumped out when
needed and have never noticed any damage to the concrete. You must have a lot of salt going into your septic system.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

Mark
Put your tools with durable in them in water and let them sit over night.
See if the durabond falls off.
It will harden like concrete.

 

[Scott 730]

(quoted from post at 15:14:22 09/23/23) Mark
Put your tools with durable in them in water and let them sit over night.
See if the durabond falls off.
It will harden like concrete.

............... which still does not make it a suitable patch material for a septic tank, which is the subject of this thread.

 

[showcrop]

(quoted from post at 04:05:18 09/23/23)

(quoted from post at 06:59:51 09/23/23)

Put up a new post asking for help with diverting the softener effluent from your septic system.

Water softener regen discharge should be routed to a drywell, not to a septic system.

NO KIDDING!!! LOL!!!

 

[Dave G9N]

(quoted from post at 10:53:59 09/22/23) The outlet of my septic tank has the concrete deteriorating from the salt from my water softener, according to my septic tank cleaner. I can remove the concrete that is soft and I could patch over with new concrete, but I'd like to find a salt resistant solution. This damage does not go below the water line. Is there some type of product that will adhere to the old hard concrete but is more of a plastic or polymer that will resist salt?

What is he trying to sell? That sounds like a scare tactic, not good information. If I were to give him the benefit of the doubt, I might say that he is just misinformed. Did you actually see the deterioration? We are talking inside the tank? How old is this tank?

"deteriorating from the salt from my water softener"
The math is against this.
"The outlet of my septic tank has the concrete deteriorating"
If it was salt, it shouldn't be localized.
"This damage does not go below the water line."
But the salt [i:ad30e31cbf]is[/i:ad30e31cbf] below the waterline.

There may be something backwashing into the tank through the outlet, but that would be unusual. Since there is apparently a problem, and that's where it is, you have to look at what is going on there that is different from the rest of the system.

The usgs says that a person uses between 80 and 100 gallons of water per day. Various online sources say that most water softeners use about 30-80 pounds of salt per month. I use 1 or 2 bags per month, so it sounds about right.

The math works out to a range of 0.1 to 0.4% salt in the septic tank, for a one person household, not counting the salt already in the drinking water. That is enough to cause some rust, but not enough to adversely affect concrete. If you had have 6 people in the house, six times the water used reduces the the concentration of salt to 1/6 of those numbers. The concentration of salt with 6 people would work out to between 0.02 and 0.07%.

If I were to attempt a repair, I would consider hydraulic cement. Cleaning the area to be repaired well enough to get a good bond would be a challenge.

 

[550Doug]

(quoted from post at 19:56:03 09/23/23)

(quoted from post at 10:53:59 09/22/23) The outlet of my septic tank has the concrete deteriorating from the salt from my water softener, according to my septic tank cleaner. I can remove the concrete that is soft and I could patch over with new concrete, but I'd like to find a salt resistant solution. This damage does not go below the water line. Is there some type of product that will adhere to the old hard concrete but is more of a plastic or polymer that will resist salt?

What is he trying to sell? That sounds like a scare tactic, not good information. If I were to give him the benefit of the doubt, I might say that he is just misinformed. Did you actually see the deterioration? We are talking inside the tank? How old is this tank?

"deteriorating from the salt from my water softener"
The math is against this.
"The outlet of my septic tank has the concrete deteriorating"
If it was salt, it shouldn't be localized.
"This damage does not go below the water line."
But the salt [i:d0be3f6d98]is[/i:d0be3f6d98] below the waterline.

There may be something backwashing into the tank through the outlet, but that would be unusual. Since there is apparently a problem, and that's where it is, you have to look at what is going on there that is different from the rest of the system.

The usgs says that a person uses between 80 and 100 gallons of water per day. Various online sources say that most water softeners use about 30-80 pounds of salt per month. I use 1 or 2 bags per month, so it sounds about right.

The math works out to a range of 0.1 to 0.4% salt in the septic tank, for a one person household, not counting the salt already in the drinking water. That is enough to cause some rust, but not enough to adversely affect concrete. If you had have 6 people in the house, six times the water used reduces the the concentration of salt to 1/6 of those numbers. The concentration of salt with 6 people would work out to between 0.02 and 0.07%.

If I were to attempt a repair, I would consider hydraulic cement. Cleaning the area to be repaired well enough to get a good bond would be a challenge.

If you read my original post you'll see that "according to my septic tank cleaner" the damage was likely due to water softener salt as he has seen this type of corrosion before and always the owners were using water softeners.

However, with the comments here I am now thinking that it is hydrogen sulphide converting to sulphuric acid in vapour form that is causing the damage, but I'm open to other suggestions as I am certainly not experienced in the chemistry involved in concrete nor in septics.

As a result I will discontinue the backwashing into the septic tank.
The tank is only 30 years old.

No, I am not selling anything to do with this, although if you are interested in an IH 434 tractor with loader, maybe a deal can be made.

 

[Levi81]

You should NOT be running water softener discharge through you septic system!!!!!

Then where should it go?

 

[Hemmjo]

Then where should it go?

You can run it into the discharge line coming out of the tank. . The salt kills the bacteria that make the septic tank work.

 

[Levi81]

You can run it into the discharge line coming out of the tank. . The salt kills the bacteria that make the septic tank work.

Al if the houses I have ever lived in have had the softener discharging with no ill effects on septic tank operation. Never heard of an issue until your post

 

[Hemmjo]

Al if the houses I have ever lived in have had the softener discharging with no ill effects on septic tank operation. Never heard of an issue until your post

Your millage may vary. Not to be confrontational, but how would you know if the salt affected the biologic balance of your septic system?

This is my experience. We moved into an old farm house in Fall of 1977 with a septic system. The house had a softener, that drained into the septic. The first thing we had to do was have the septic tank pumped as it was plugged up. Spring of 1978 I had to install a new leach bed as the old one was plugged up with sludge from the tank.

Due to new health department regulations, I also had to install a new larger tank in order to get a permit for the leach bed. Fall of 1978 we began extensive upgrades to the house, including the plumbing. It was easier to route the softener discharge to the storm drain than to the septic.

2024-1978= 46 years. We have had the tank pumped 1 time about 20 years ago, only because I had to make a change to the plumbing inside the house and I did not want to risk sewage running back inside. At that time the pumper guy said he very seldom pumps a tank that has so little sludge in it. He asked if we have a softener, I told him yes, but it does not discharge to the tank. His response was, that explains it.

I realize this is not a scientific study. It is just my experience. All of my neighbors seem to have their tanks pumped in less than 10 years. If I had not needed to do that plumbing modification, I may have never had the tank pumped.

ALSO something to note, for those who have a lot of iron in their water. It is very common to use softener salt containing "Red Out". This is actually Sodium HypoChlorite. which contains a lot of chlorine. I think we all know chlorine is a disinfectant. This could be a contributing factor. Perhaps those who use plain salt do not have a problem.

 

[Levi81]

Your millage may vary. Not to be confrontational, but how would you know if the salt affected the biologic balance of your septic system?

This is my experience. We moved into an old farm house in Fall of 1977 with a septic system. The house had a softener, that drained into the septic. The first thing we had to do was have the septic tank pumped as it was plugged up. Spring of 1978 I had to install a new leach bed as the old one was plugged up with sludge from the tank.

Due to new health department regulations, I also had to install a new larger tank in order to get a permit for the leach bed. Fall of 1978 we began extensive upgrades to the house, including the plumbing. It was easier to route the softener discharge to the storm drain than to the septic.

2024-1978= 46 years. We have had the tank pumped 1 time about 20 years ago, only because I had to make a change to the plumbing inside the house and I did not want to risk sewage running back inside. At that time the pumper guy said he very seldom pumps a tank that has so little sludge in it. He asked if we have a softener, I told him yes, but it does not discharge to the tank. His response was, that explains it.

I realize this is not a scientific study. It is just my experience. All of my neighbors seem to have their tanks pumped in less than 10 years. If I had not needed to do that plumbing modification, I may have never had the tank pumped.

ALSO something to note, for those who have a lot of iron in their water. It is very common to use softener salt containing "Red Out". This is actually Sodium HypoChlorite. which contains a lot of chlorine. I think we all know chlorine is a disinfectant. This could be a contributing factor. Perhaps those who use plain salt do not have a problem.

Our tanks have to be pumped every three years by law. Never had to have a tank pump in an emergency or because it backed up.
Never had a septic system problem. It sounds like your comparing a system from the 70s to something newer