slow front loader on 350 utility

[GP Hansen]

The loader is so slow. The hyd. pump is on the distributor. Do most front loader pumps run off the crank? I'm thinking the pump doesn't have the capacity for the large rams.

 

[notjustair]

It won't move at warp speed, but it shouldn't be that slow with the live pump. I have a live pump on my M with loader cylinders that look a little bigger. It is my only loader tractor and is not slow. I do everything on the farm with it that needs a loader and have never thought about needing it to be faster.

Is it lifting jumpy? I wonder if it is sucking air from a cracked supply pipe? Does it have full range of motion? Has it always done this?

 

[GP Hansen]

Raising and lowering the bucket is very slow. Doesn't jerk. It's full of hyd. oil. Tipping the bucket is ok. The 3 point is ok. I'm thinking it's not supplying enough oil fast enough for 2 large rams.

 

[IH fan]

Is the power steering also operated with this pump? If so, it has priority and will tap off about 3gpm. I can tell by the plumbing on my 240U that it was operated by the live pump at one time, but PS has been added and then whoever had this tractor before added a crank driven pump and separate valves on the loader... no longer uses the built in valves, except for the 3 point. My guess is the loader worked fast enough before PS was added, but PS was a big help with the loader.

 

[GP Hansen]

The power steering is ran off the same pump. But would that effect it if you're not turning at the same time the bucket is being raised ?

 

[IH fan]

(quoted from post at 18:00:55 03/03/13) The power steering is ran off the same pump. But would that effect it if you're not turning at the same time the bucket is being raised ?

Yup, the priority flow to the steering is [u:8ef0adec19]always[/u:8ef0adec19] tapped off to the steering even if it is not turning. Same is true if the engine is idled down... the flow to the steering takes priority and if that is set at 3 gpm, the first 3 gpm goes tothe steering. There may be a little variation, but not much if it's a good priority flow divider.

 

[charlieu]

You say that the system is full of oil. OK when was the last time you removed and cleaned the suction screen. I know that it's a pain in the butt to do but it is necessary.

 

[notjustair]

There's the rub - I thought something was fishy. I have power steering on my loader tractor as well, but have a belt driven pump for it. My live pump is just for the hydraulics.

Sounds like you could really help things out by installing a belt driven pump.

 

[gene bender]

You dont have large rams check your filters in the hy system. As small dia as your cycls it wont take very much flow to raise them i would drain the hy system and then check where there mite be a filter and you front seal in the pump mite be shot and letting hy fluid into the crankase. Check to see if the engine is over full with oil that would be the first clue as the seal condition.

 

[FLOLDFORD]

My 350 is the same way. If you move the steering wheel the loader will just about stop. Looked at putting a belt driven ps pump on it but the way my loader mounts there is not a lot of room. I have to run mine about half throttle to have any hydraulic pressure or flow. I guess these system's are pretty marginal with a loader installed

 

[Rumplestiltskin]

I have a 350U with power steering and the standard (in front of the distributor) hydraulic pump. My loader cylinders look about the same as yours, and I wouldn't say the loader is slow at all; in fact, if it were any faster I might think it a little dangerous. I suspect you have a problem somewhere...partially clogged screen, maybe?

Mark W. in MI

 

[ss55]

Is that an aftermarket 3 point hitch or a modified 2 point hitch on your tractor? How do you like it?
Thanks

 

[willie in mn]

You say lowering is also slow. Is it power down or gravity drop? How about hose size? If 1/2 in hose, going to 3/4 will double the oil flow capacity. Reducer fittings at the hose ends will restrict flow a bit, but not really all that much.
Willie

 

[mkirsch]

How slow is slow?

I don't know of any universal definition of slow. Slow is an opinion. What's slow for one is dangerously fast for someone else. Define slow please.

Are you running the tractor at full throttle to get maximum pressure and volume?

Was it always slow? Did it work fine then suddenly get slow?

 

[GP Hansen]

It"s noticibly twice as slow as the 3 point or tipping the bucket. It would take 10 - 15 seconds to raise it to full height at half throutle empty. It"s been slow since I"ve had it.
The 3 point appears to be an after market one but works fine.

 

[IH fan]

(quoted from post at 11:37:15 03/04/13) It"s noticibly twice as slow as the 3 point or tipping the bucket. It would take 10 - 15 seconds to raise it to full height at half throutle empty. It"s been slow since I"ve had it.
The 3 point appears to be an after market one but works fine.

At half throttle and figuring 2.5 to 3 gpm is "prioritized" for the power steering, you really don't have a lot of flow to work with, so it will be slow. As I said, I suspect my 240U was changed to a second crankshaft driven pump when the Char-Lynn PS was added. If I am below about 1/3 throttle, my 3 point does not work at all, and need to get to half throttle for it to work smoothly. Mine has an added priority valve that taps off about the first 3 gpm for the PS. Yours with factory PS no doubt has the priority flow valve built into the stack valve under the dash.
I used a row crop 350D on a ranch in SD in 1964, and it used the internal valves for the loader, but I don't recall it being slow. However, what we used it for was to load hay bales with a Farmhand 8 bale loader... lift and tilt cylinders worked off the tractor loader valves and a 3rd added valve worked the hooks that tilted into the bales. I don't recall how the flow was tapped into for that 3rd valve, or if it had a second pump... don't believe it did. I doubt we ran it at 1/2 throttle though as we had 400 acres of irrigated alfalfa and we kept moving pretty fast. This was also before I worked 38 years for a hydraulics company and wouldn't have known then what I was looking at anyway.

 

[mkirsch]

Volume does have something to do with it. The bucket will dump a lot faster because it's only one cylinder. Probably the same story with the 3pt but I can't see in the picture how many cylinders it has.

The pump is 12GPM at wide open throttle, so it's not going to set the world on fire as far as speed goes.

10-12 seconds really isn't hugely out of line. Back in 1957, 10-12 seconds was sure a heck of a lot better than a pitchfork and wheelbarrow.

Probably wouldn't hurt to pull the screen and clean it. If you can find a tractor mechanic friend with a flow rate tester, you can see the condition of your pump. Since you're happy with the bucket and 3pt, I'd imagine the pump is in pretty good shape.

 

[pete 23]

A 300 uses a 9 gal pump so not a lot of extra to run a loader after power steering which as pointed out uses at least 3 gal a minute all the time. I would be interested to know what pressure is being built to raise the loader empty. No doubt those valve won't latch as most do not now days, but it should latch and stay while lifting loader if no restriction. If valve will latch without engine running it should also latch while running or excess pressure is required.