Transmission Chatter (very loud) and Engine problems

[RW-IH574]

Hi im new here.

I recently purchased an IH 574 and im not familiar with it yet so i would be glad of some assistance from others.

Two main problems that i have noticed with my IH since i started using it for some work recently. It hasn't had a great deal of use recently so i'm starting to uncover some issues now:

1) I park it up and leave it running at around 2000rpm so i can use my log splitter on the rear. Once the tractor warms up, there is a loud chatter from the clutch / transmission. It sounds like metal on metal so i was concerned. On closer inspection, i found that the noise dissapeard if i depressed the clutch or even just slightly pressed it down to the biting point. The PTO wasn't running and the tractor was stationary so i'm a bit confused. I have also topped up the transmission oil so this can't be the problem. Could some adjustment to the clutch be needed?

2) The first time i ran the machine hot, the exhaust started leaking oily residue onto the bonnet. I initially thought that this was just the tractor needing to run hot for a few hours, however this has continued to the point that it runs down the side of the engine and drips into the floor. In addition to this, the radiator seems to be losing water with no aparent leaks. I used the machine for 2 hours on saturday and found that the radiator needed around 1.5 litres of water after it had cooled down. The engine oil level does not appear to be going down either. Could this mean that a new head gasket is required? (hopefully not!)

Thanks in advance!

This post was edited by RW-IH574 on 12/12/2022 at 04:57 am.

 

[Jim.ME]

What engine?

Are you filling the radiator to the top when cold? If so, the coolant will expand and push out as it heats. When the radiator is cold, after that occurs, the level will be down as it is minus the coolant pushed out by expansion. Down 1.5 liters would be about right for that scenario. Don't add any coolant back in and run it. See if it stays about that level low. If so, the is the real full level you need to watch when cold, not full to the radiator neck or cap.

 

[JimB2]

Hi, welcome to YT. I assume it is a 574 with a D-239 Diesel engine, see link below for free European Operator's, Service and Engine manuals.
If your 574 is USA assembled tractor there will be slight differences in electrical, power steering and remote hydraulic valve(s) but the power train is the same.
There is an inspection plate on the bottom of the bellhowsing that you can remove to look at the throughout bearing and pressure plate.
The clutch pedal should have a return spring that keeps the clutch pedal at the upper limit so the clutch forks don't push the throughout bearing against the pressure plate fingers when your foot is not on the clutch pedal, most of
these springs are broken and long gone. Clutch adjustments are in the manuals.
Hint when running tractor stationary, always put the Speed transmission gears 1-4 in gear 1 and make sure the REV/N/HI/LO is in N but on the upper side of N as the gear shift mechanism wears and the weight of the gear shift handle
will tend to drop below the N and gears in the range transmission will be trying to mesh causing a rattle.

The oily substance is usually Diesel slobber of unburnt Diesel fuel, common problem with the German Diesel engines in this series of IH tractors, the engines like to be worked hard.
Re coolant level, inspect at the water pump behind the fan to see if you can see any sign of coolant running down the front of the engine, next try pulling/pushing on one of the fan blades to see if there is play in the water pump
bearing.
A common problem on the older German Diesel engines was the cylinder sleeve O-rings leaking coolant into the crankcase. Usually would be worse in the cold weather and as soon as engine warmed it would stop leaking.
To check for coolant in the crankcase oil, first thing in the morning before starting the engine, with a clean bucket under the oil drain plug, loosen the plug a few threads until either coolant or oil starts to leak out. If only oil
leaks out then no leaking O-rings. Coolant will settle to the bottom of crankcase. The other test is drain oil when engine is hot then after oil is completely drained put a clean bucket under the drain plug, also after engine is cold
loosen the rad cap and let it sit a couple days and see if any coolant appears. BE SURE to either disconnect the battery or take the key out and tape it to the drain plug so no one will try to start engine without oil.

Again when engine is cold only put the rad cap on until the first click don't tighten it down all the way and run tractor for a day or two and see what happens.

Be sure to add some 2-cycle oil or Diesel fuel conditioner to the Diesel fuel as those older Bosch VA pumps require lubrication that the new ULSD Diesel fuel is lacking.

After you have done five posts on this site then you can post photos, so post a photo of the injection pump showing the STOP/START/RUN lever on the side of the pump in the RUN position as someone in the past may have opened up the HP
limit screw on the STOP/START/RUN to give this engine extra HP and this can also cause the Diesel slobbering to be worse.
UK IH 574 Manuals

 

[RW-IH574]

(quoted from post at 06:27:19 12/12/22)
What engine?

Are you filling the radiator to the top when cold? If so, the coolant will expand and push out as it heats. When the radiator is cold, after that occurs, the level will be down as it is minus the coolant pushed out by expansion. Down 1.5 liters would be about right for that scenario. Don't add any coolant back in and run it. See if it stays about that level low. If so, the is the real full level you need to watch when cold, not full to the radiator neck or cap.

Thanks Jim.ME. Sorry i should have stated, Its the 3.9 Diesel engine with a manual transmission.

Yes perhaps you are right regarding the radiator level. any suggestions on the oil from the exhaust? its quite a lot [/img:f2b0fd33af]

 

[RW-IH574]

Great, thanks Jim. Thats a few things that i can run through and check.

 

[Jim.ME]

If it is not losing coolant below the level previously discussed and the oil level is holding, the drooling you tell of sounds like wet stacking to me. "Wet Stacking" occurs when the engine is getting plenty of fuel but is not working hard enough to really warm up, completely burn the fuel, and dry the condensation from the combustion process. To me running a wood splitter is not going to load the engine enough to make it warm up to design temperature in the cylinders, promoting wet stacking, especially in colder weather. here could be some compression and fuel issues (weak injection nozzles and timing are a couple) involved as well. JMHO

If you are using Modern View, a couple weeks ago the photo restriction for that view (not Classic View) was changed to only needing one text post on record to allow posting pictures in one's second post. There is a 7- 7.5 MB limit on picture size in a post. That can be one 7 mb picture or several smaller ones totaling 7 mb.

This post was edited by Jim.ME on 12/12/2022 at 09:14 am.

 

[JimB2]

Re, IH 574 3.9L Diesel engine is commonly called a German D-239 Diesel engine. They were manufactured by IH in Neuss Germany. There are a whole series of IH German Diesel engines, see the link below.
The rest of the tractor was made by IH UK in Doncaster, England but if it was for the USA market the power train was assembled in the UK and then put in a crate and shipped to IH Louisville, KY, USA where final assembly
was performed. These tractors were referred to a crate unit. Here in Canada our tractors were shipped completely assembled like the European models but with the required Canadian options.
Re reducing the Diesel slobber, make sure engine is up to temp, refer to my photo of Bosch VA injection pump below:
1) Purple colored lever is the throttle
2) Lever with Green, Blue and Red lines is the STOP/START/RUN fuel control lever
3) When lever is in the Red line position that is the STOP position and fuel is shut off.
4) When lever is in the Blue line position with the lever just touching the shut off plunger that is the Cold Start position like a choke on gas engine.
5) When lever is in Green line position fully forward touching the HP adjusting screw that is the RUN position.

It was common for farmers to buy a 574 (52 HP) instead of paying the extra $$ for the larger 674 (62 HP), both tractors had the same D-239 engines but HP on 574 was set 52 HP by adjusting HP screw inwards.
The farmers would then adjust the HP screw out to give then the same or more HP than a 674. Adjusting the HP screw outward and adjusting the STOP/START/RUN control cable to allow the fuel control lever to touch the
screw increased the HP by delivering more fuel to the injector.
When running the 574 on the wood splitter you don't require 52 HP, so just pull the STOP/START/RUN lever down a little from the top to create a a small gap between the HP screw and the fuel control lever like the one in
the photo below. If you move it too far the engine will start to fuel starve and will start revving up and down. Doing this may reduce the Diesel slobber.

IH German Diesel Engines

 

[caterpillar guy]

Pull the bottom plate off under the clutch. There may be grease fitting on the throwout bearing there try greasing it. Also you can see up in there to check the fingers. With engine off you can see them and if they are resting on the throw out bearing or not. They should just clear it by a wee bit. You can also check for slop on the shaft holding the bearing and the cross shaft if the fork is loose. Some of that you may need a small pry to just move things slightly. Though I would suspect a bad bearing causing the chatter or a dry pilot bearing. IF this has set a lot over the years or not used much for several years. For the slobber out the exhaust it needs to be worked hard like plowing for a few days to clean it up. Dad dles the 574 we have all the time. It smokes and has a wet pipe all the time. I have talked to him about it and he just gets pissy about it. If he would just open the throttle up some when driving to the field or woods back and forth it would help a lot. With a loader it get a lot of idling from close space use. If it will not get up to temperature you could put a cover over the rad in the winter to help with temp also. cover the whole thing or have an open at several places . You don't want to cover only the top or bottom halves you can create hot spots that way. We used to cover the whole grill on our MD in the winter to hold temp on it. It did a lot of chore work feeding and grinding feed or if solid and not a lot of snow spreading manure so would get warmed up then cool off while loading and warm again.

 

[RW-IH574]

Thanks, i opened the clutch plate to find a load of ball bearings running around. It appears that the throwout bearing has perished and falled apart. Is this something that can be replaced without splitting the tractor in half? What is the purpose of this and should i stop using the tractor until this is replaced?

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

The throwout bearing releases the main clutch. The tractor must be split to replace it. You should be having trouble putting the tractor in gear. Drive it as little as possible.

The black oily residue out the exhaust is "wet stacking." Unburned fuel mixed with carbon residue. The IH "German" engines are notorious for it.