Wetlands

[Spudm]

I do not think Right To Farm applies to wetlands, so if you have a wetland on your property, don't mess with it, or you could find yourself in a lot of trouble. They are Federally protected, and you could be fined for disturbing them in any way.
As many of you know, we had a natural gas transmission pipeline explosion on the farm back in September. The incident location was right in the middle of a wetland. Work is still underway in this sensitive area since frogs & turtles have been identified on the endangered species list. Lots of people involved on this now, including enviro-engineers and the MDEQ.

 

[rrlund]

I've often wondered if there was some kind of a grandfather clause. For instance,land that is under water in the spring and after a heavy rain,but has always been pastured. Could they make you fence cattle out of it after pasturing it for 150 years?

 

[farmboy48]

I have 3 quarters with federal wetland easements on them, I am allowed to farm (cultivate, seed, harvest) them when they are dry, only allowed to burn cattails, weeds grasses every 3 years after getting permission from fish and wildlife service.

Dick ND

 

[Spudm]

I am not allowed to do anything in the wetland except look at it and pay taxes on it. A few decades ago, wetlands were considered wastelands because you couldn't farm them or build on them. That has all changed now, Federally protected, which means you don't touch them, just appreciate them.

 

[gbs]

I may have my wires crossed but for farmland the enviro's tried to classify every mud hole a wet lands a few years back and someone in that governmental era had enough gumption to get things reclassified ,if I remember correct farmland that doesn't stand in water under normal conditions for 60 consecutive days wasn't considered wetlands, may not apply to your area,also couple years back we were working in an area where all the drainage was pump controlled I noticed the man whose land we were own had a big loader with a grapple I asked what he used it for he said to re-pile brush piles ,I asked how he was still clearing land he said because it already had all the drainage system put in before the wetlands restrictions were put in place they could clear it.whats funny is a logging outfit can log out the worst swamp in the country with little problem but if a utility has to enter one it's a major undertaking $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ and GUESS WHO PAYS THE BILL IN THE END as another person stated you CAN'T tax or fine a corporation

 

[rrlund]

As Paul Harvey used to say,corporations don't pay taxes,people pay taxes.

 

[john in la]

We have farmland that is pumped dry to farm it.
It will not drain on its own.
All the land on 4 sides is swamp.
Since they were there before the wetlands act went threw they can continue to farm it.

I use to own two city lots that were swamp land.
I bought it in hopes the area would be leveed off and pumped dry so houses could be built.
Then the wet lands act came threw so rather than paying taxes on land I could never use I let it go for taxes.
A few years after I let it go a oil pipeline came threw right across my 2 lots.
Sometimes you are the windshield and some times you are the bug.

 

[Spudm]

I think there is some mis-interpretation of the law regarding wetlands as originally written. I know some Farmers are complaining that the USDA has gone from helping them, to policing them.
There are cases that have been tied up in court for years over what is considered a wetland, and disputes between property owners, the FSA and NRCS benefits that once qualified and now don't.

 

[Heyseed]

Department Of Environmental Quality
Hollister Building, PO Box 30473, Lansing MI 48909-7973
Russell J. Harding, Director
December 17, 1997
CERTIFIED
Mr. Ryan DeVries
2088 Dagget
Pierson, MI 49339

Dear Mr. DeVries:
SUBJECT: DEQ File No. 97-59-0023-1 T11N, R10W, Sec. 20, Montcalm County

It has come to the attention of the Department of Environmental Quality that there has been recent unauthorized activity on the above referenced parcel of property. You have been certified as the legal landowner and/or contractor who did the following unauthorized activity: Construction and maintenance of two wood debris dams across the outlet stream of Spring Pond.

A permit must be issued prior to the start of this type of activity. A review of the Department's files shows that no permits have been issued.
Therefore, the Department has determined that this activity is in violation of Part 301, Inland Lakes and Streams, of the Natural Resource and Environmental Protection Act, Act 451 of the Public Acts of 1994, being sections 324.30101 to 324.30113 of the Michigan Compiled Laws, annotated.

The Department has been informed that one or both of the dams partially failed during a recent rain event, causing debris and flooding at downstream locations. We find that dams of this nature are inherently hazardous and cannot be permitted.

The Department therefore orders you to cease and desist all unauthorized activities at this location, and to restore the stream to a free-flow condition by removing all wood and brush forming the dams from the strewn channel. All restoration work shall be completed no later than January 31, 1998.

Please notify this office when the restoration has been completed so that a follow-up site inspection may be scheduled by our staff. Failure to comply with this request or any further unauthorized activity on the site may result in this case being referred for elevated enforcement action. We anticipate and would appreciate your full cooperation in this matter.

Please feel free to contact me at this office if you have any questions.

Sincerely,
David L. Price
District Representative
Land and Water Management Division


Dear Mr. Price:

First of all, Mr. Ryan DeVries is not the legal landowner and/or contractor at 2088 Dagget, Pierson, Michigan -

I am the legal owner and a couple of beavers are in the (State unauthorized) process of constructing and maintaining two wood "debris" dams across the outlet stream of my Spring Pond.
While I did not pay for, nor authorize their dam project, I think they would be highly offended you call their skillful use of natural building materials "debris." I would like to challenge you to attempt to emulate their dam project any dam time and/or any dam place you choose.

I believe I can safely state there is no dam way you could ever match their dam skills, their dam resourcefulness, their dam ingenuity, their dam persistence, their dam determination and/or their dam work ethic.
As to your dam request the beavers first must fill out a dam permit prior to the start of this type of dam activity, my first dam question to you is, "Are you trying to discriminate against my Spring Pond Beavers or do you require all dam beavers throughout this State to conform to said dam request?" If you are not discriminating against these particular beavers, please send me completed copies of all those other applicable beaver dam permits.

Perhaps we will see if there really is a dam violation of Part 301, Inland Lakes and Streams, of the Natural Resource and Environmental Protection Act, Act 451 of the Public Acts of 1994, being sections 24.30101 to 324.30113 of the Michigan Compiled Laws annotated.

My first concern is - aren't the dam beavers entitled to dam legal representation? The Spring Pond Beavers are financially destitute and are unable to pay for said dam representation so the State will have to provide them with a dam lawyer.
The Department's dam concern that either one or both of the dams failed during a recent rain event causing dam flooding is proof we should leave the dam Spring Pond Beavers alone rather than harassing them and calling their dam names.

If you want the dam stream "restored" to a dam free-flow condition contact the dam beavers but if you are going to arrest them (they obviously did not pay any dam attention to your dam letter-being unable to read English) - be sure you read them their dam Miranda rights first. As for me, I am not going to cause more dam flooding or dam debris jams by interfering with these dam builders.
If you want to hurt these dam beavers be aware I am sending a copy of your dam letter and this response to PETA. If your dam Department seriously finds all dams of this nature inherently hazardous and truly will not permit their existence in this dam State - I seriously hope you are not selectively enforcing this dam policy - or once again both I and the Spring Pond Beavers will scream prejudice!
In my humble opinion, the Spring Pond Beavers have a right to build their dam unauthorized dams as long as the sky is blue, the grass is green and water flows downstream. They have more dam right than I to live and enjoy Spring Pond. So, as far as the beavers and I are concerned, this dam case can be referred for more dam elevated enforcement action now.

Why wait until 1/31/98? The Spring Pond Beavers may be under the dam ice then and there will be no dam way for you or your dam staff to contact/harass them then.

In conclusion, I would like to bring to your attention a real environmental quality (health) problem; bears are actually defecating in our woods. I definitely believe you should be persecuting the defecating bears and leave the dam beavers alone. If you are going to investigate the beaver dam, watch your step! (The bears are not careful where they dump!) Being unable to comply with your dam request, and being unable to contact you on your dam answering machine, I am sending this response to your dam office.

Sincerely,
Stephen L. Tvedten

 

[showcrop]

I know of two small flagged wetlands that I remember being farmed. The new owners didn't maintain drainage so it grew cat tails. Now nothing can be done with them.

 

[LeonardWD45]

All wetlands are relative. I have driven by an area on the Tacoma tide flats that are wetlands, I drive local for USF Reddaway, and they are currently filling and leveling the area for more warehouse space. So I am under the opinion that if the government, be it local, state or federal, wants revenue they will do what ever they want.

Leonard

 

[JML755]

I hear you. Dealing with the DEQ is not pleasant and I can't imagine any interaction with them coming out in your favor. I was looking at purchasing some Lake Huron beachfront property few years back and looked into the DEQ rules/regs. Decided to pass on the purchase rather than risk trying to clean up the beach without getting arrested.

I've got some wetlands on my property and I called the DEQ anonymously to ask them a question. They REALLY wanted to know who I was and where my property was located. I wouldn't tell them, never got my question answered either. IMO, they're a bunch of eco-Nazis both on state and Federal level (EPA). I'm not against a clean environment but they don't know what common sense is when it comes to rural property. Yet, the government will encourage some company to pave over acres and acres with cement and put up a factory in the name of creating jobs and then feel good because they make them put in a little pond with water lilies and cat-tails.