52 8N side dist. with woods belly mower. The tractor was fine during the winter months plowing snow. When mowing season came in its been nothing but trouble. The tractor runs and drives fine except 4th gear. It dont have enough power to start in 4th. Looses power while mowing to the point of dying in 1st gear within the first 10 minutes. Now is overheating from time to time. This is what i have done so far. Complete tune-up, cleaned fuel system from tank to carb, cleaned the air filter. Pulled the water pump ( looks good, spins easily and is not loose ). Has no thermostat. Im going to put a thermostat in it. Would the coil cause any of this? Does the carb need the economizer jet in it to run properly? Any other ideas.
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I do not know if it will cause your problems but I think that the economizer is required. It will be running at an incorrect mixture part of the time withoute it.
Is it running on all four? pull one wire at time or rather short one out to see if it sounds any different. Pulling a wire off of a plug while running may cause carbon arcing in dist cap.
firing order correct? 1 2 4 3
sometimes we overlook the basic things.
Is it running on all four? pull one wire at time or rather short one out to see if it sounds any different. Pulling a wire off of a plug while running may cause carbon arcing in dist cap.
firing order correct? 1 2 4 3
sometimes we overlook the basic things.
Ive been running it without the econimizer jet for a year and a half. That seemed to be the only way to get it running good at the time. I did fill the radiator full and it run the antifreeze out the overflow. Was still overheating after that. The plug wires are right but will check the plugs. Why would the ignition switch have anything to do with the problems? What wires would you jump together?
I would give some more thought to the fuel FLOW. Take the drain out of the bottom of the carb abd see how good the gravity flow is and if the flow stays and does not get less and less. Under no load like putting in the clutch it will run fairly well with minimum flow but will not if a load is app;ied. Devious in Humble Tx
Bruce (VA)
Well-known Member
I don't mean any disrespect.....but you say you did a " Complete tune-up, " , then you ask "Why would the ignition switch have anything to do with the problems? What wires would you jump together?"
A very basic question like that tells me that you probably didn't exactly get the "complete tune-up" done correctly.
Did you replace the points, plugs, condenser, rotor & cap? Set the timing? What point gap did you use? Double check the firing order?
No, this isn't a coil problem. It's likely a points/timing/wiring problem.
50 Tips
A very basic question like that tells me that you probably didn't exactly get the "complete tune-up" done correctly.
Did you replace the points, plugs, condenser, rotor & cap? Set the timing? What point gap did you use? Double check the firing order?
No, this isn't a coil problem. It's likely a points/timing/wiring problem.
50 Tips
The ignition switch can get hot with flow of electricity,thus giving it resistance,less juice to ign,which is all the load it will handle.the economizer controls metering in an important band of the throttle response.you might have some trash in the tank,restricting flow.drain the gas,remove the cut-off,and flush out the tank with deisel or kerosene,and maybe replace cut-off with one that has a filter,if yours doesn't have it.---lha
No disrespect taken. The tune-up consisted of points, condesor, plugs , wires , cap and rotor. I didnt mess with the switch. The gap on the points and plugs were set to what the IT manual said. .026 on the points and .028 on the plugs. I did not set the timing with a timing light if thats what you mean. I have checked the firing order several times. Some of the basics isnt basic to me.
Bruce (VA)
Well-known Member
The correct gap is .025 on both the plugs & points, but that's not your problem. Fix it after you get it running correctly.
Same w/ the timing.
Yes, it needs the economizer jet & the fact that it runs w/o it tells me you have a carb issue. But, once again, that's not the problem.
It takes three things for an engine to run: spark at the right time, compression, & fuel in the right mixture. For the moment, forget about compression & concentrate on narrowing the problem down to spark or fuel.
There are three very important tools you always need to have in your N tool box: a 3 inch piece of wire w/ alligator clips on each end, an old spark plug w/ the gap opened to at least 3/16” ( ¼” is better) and a 7/16 box end wrench. (see tip # 50 at the link below) And, you really do need a working ammeter on the tractor; it is a very important diagnostic tool. With these tools, you can quickly narrow down most N problems to spark or fuel.
Next time it stops, check quickly for fuel then spark. When I say quickly, I mean get off the seat, grab the tools & do it right then. Do not wait a minute or two. First, check for fuel. Get a can & put it under the carb. Remove the bolt in the bottom of the carb; as long as the fuel is turned on, you should see gas flowing out of the carb. Let it run for at least 30 seconds. If it’s a dribble, or runs for 5 seconds & stops, or none at all, you have solved half the problem: it’s fuel related. If gas flows well out of the carb & only stops when you turn it off at the sediment bowl, chances are very good it’s not a fuel problem. So, next, turn the key on, crank the engine & look at the ammeter. What is the needle doing? Does it show a constant discharge, no movement at all, or does it move back & forth slightly? Next, get the old plug, ground it to a rust & paint free spot on the engine, turn the key on & crank the engine. If the spark jumps the 3/16” gap, you probably don’t have a spark problem. If it won’t jump the 3/16” gap, you have a spark problem. If the ammeter needle shows a constant discharge, or doesn’t move at all, that also tells you that you have a spark problem. Jump the ignition switch w/ your jumper wire & see what happens. If it runs, you found the problem. If it doesn’t have spark after you jump the ignition switch, post back for more info on further troubleshooting. (and do not forget to turn the ignition switch off; see tip # 38)
If it does not have gas coming out of the carb at a steady stream w/ the bolt out for at least 30 seconds, you have a fuel problem. First, remove the gas cap. Your vent could be clogged & it vacuum locked. If that doesn’t work, tap the carb bowl w/ a hammer handle in case the float is sticking closed. (don’t whack it w/ the head of the hammer; you can crack the bowl). If you still don’t see gas flowing, the N has three fuel screens; one in the brass elbow, one in the top of the sediment bowl & one on the stem of the sediment bowl in the gas tank. Check the screen in the elbow & the screen in the top of the sediment bowl. (don’t worry about the one in the tank) Both probably need to be cleaned. If you have the fuel knob turned on all the way, & 1 gallon or less in the tank, it may be trying to feed off of the reserve inlet which is probably clogged. Only open it 2 full turns. Put at least 2 gallons in the tank. (and do not forget to turn the gas off; see tip # 9)
There are ways to check for spark & fuel that work & ways that don't. For example, having gas to the carb is nice, but having it past the float is what counts! That’s why removing the bolt in the bottom of the carb is the way to do it. And, same thing w/ spark at the plugs. Some folks think that checking for spark means pulling a plug wire off & looking for one. Well, it's the distance the spark jumps at the plug that gives you the info you want. It takes about 17kv to jump a 3/16" gap & 22kv to jump ¼” in the open air, so that's why you need to use a spark plug. Or, a store bought plug checker. Remember, it’s 14psi outside of the engine & about 90psi at a 6:1 compression ratio in the cylinders & compressed air creates electrical resistance, so you really need the 17-22kv to fire the plugs when the engine is running.
50 Tips
Same w/ the timing.
Yes, it needs the economizer jet & the fact that it runs w/o it tells me you have a carb issue. But, once again, that's not the problem.
It takes three things for an engine to run: spark at the right time, compression, & fuel in the right mixture. For the moment, forget about compression & concentrate on narrowing the problem down to spark or fuel.
There are three very important tools you always need to have in your N tool box: a 3 inch piece of wire w/ alligator clips on each end, an old spark plug w/ the gap opened to at least 3/16” ( ¼” is better) and a 7/16 box end wrench. (see tip # 50 at the link below) And, you really do need a working ammeter on the tractor; it is a very important diagnostic tool. With these tools, you can quickly narrow down most N problems to spark or fuel.
Next time it stops, check quickly for fuel then spark. When I say quickly, I mean get off the seat, grab the tools & do it right then. Do not wait a minute or two. First, check for fuel. Get a can & put it under the carb. Remove the bolt in the bottom of the carb; as long as the fuel is turned on, you should see gas flowing out of the carb. Let it run for at least 30 seconds. If it’s a dribble, or runs for 5 seconds & stops, or none at all, you have solved half the problem: it’s fuel related. If gas flows well out of the carb & only stops when you turn it off at the sediment bowl, chances are very good it’s not a fuel problem. So, next, turn the key on, crank the engine & look at the ammeter. What is the needle doing? Does it show a constant discharge, no movement at all, or does it move back & forth slightly? Next, get the old plug, ground it to a rust & paint free spot on the engine, turn the key on & crank the engine. If the spark jumps the 3/16” gap, you probably don’t have a spark problem. If it won’t jump the 3/16” gap, you have a spark problem. If the ammeter needle shows a constant discharge, or doesn’t move at all, that also tells you that you have a spark problem. Jump the ignition switch w/ your jumper wire & see what happens. If it runs, you found the problem. If it doesn’t have spark after you jump the ignition switch, post back for more info on further troubleshooting. (and do not forget to turn the ignition switch off; see tip # 38)
If it does not have gas coming out of the carb at a steady stream w/ the bolt out for at least 30 seconds, you have a fuel problem. First, remove the gas cap. Your vent could be clogged & it vacuum locked. If that doesn’t work, tap the carb bowl w/ a hammer handle in case the float is sticking closed. (don’t whack it w/ the head of the hammer; you can crack the bowl). If you still don’t see gas flowing, the N has three fuel screens; one in the brass elbow, one in the top of the sediment bowl & one on the stem of the sediment bowl in the gas tank. Check the screen in the elbow & the screen in the top of the sediment bowl. (don’t worry about the one in the tank) Both probably need to be cleaned. If you have the fuel knob turned on all the way, & 1 gallon or less in the tank, it may be trying to feed off of the reserve inlet which is probably clogged. Only open it 2 full turns. Put at least 2 gallons in the tank. (and do not forget to turn the gas off; see tip # 9)
There are ways to check for spark & fuel that work & ways that don't. For example, having gas to the carb is nice, but having it past the float is what counts! That’s why removing the bolt in the bottom of the carb is the way to do it. And, same thing w/ spark at the plugs. Some folks think that checking for spark means pulling a plug wire off & looking for one. Well, it's the distance the spark jumps at the plug that gives you the info you want. It takes about 17kv to jump a 3/16" gap & 22kv to jump ¼” in the open air, so that's why you need to use a spark plug. Or, a store bought plug checker. Remember, it’s 14psi outside of the engine & about 90psi at a 6:1 compression ratio in the cylinders & compressed air creates electrical resistance, so you really need the 17-22kv to fire the plugs when the engine is running.
50 Tips
john waller
Member
Had similar trouble with my 8N. Worked fine in the winter with moving bales or blowing snow. In summer, it would suddenly start missing and actually stop. And, of course, power loss. Started very well but 'tired out' after a couple hours.
It was the coil. Got hot after a while and lost some and eventually all spark. Replaced the coil and not more trouble.
It was the coil. Got hot after a while and lost some and eventually all spark. Replaced the coil and not more trouble.
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