Elementary questions .. My rant

[olgentdc]

In the last 40 yrs the mechanical mentality of the average Joe seems to have reached a extreme low... True , Technology improvements have made great steps . But the total lack of common sense , sound reasoning , and dead reckoning of some are nearly non existant ,,. But ,If You DO find one with those that has retained those lost qualities ,, They are most interesting to talk with and to learn from .

 

[Rich'sToys]

Back then many of us grew up on the farm. And in those days, much of the equipment could be worked on and repaired at home, and by anyone. Our Dads did that, and we watched and learned from them. We learned from our mistakes, and were taught common sense along the way. As we got older we helped Dad fix stuff, and we worked on our own cars when we got old enough to have one.

Contrast that to today where hardly anything can be fixed by a lay person, because it's all computers and electronics. People never learned to work on their own stuff, and therefore can't pass those skills on to their own kids, because they themselves don't have them. And so now we have a whole generation that can't do anything except play on their phones.

 

[stevieb49829]

The real question is: What teaches "critical thinking"? Where you identify a problem and you need to develop the skills to solve it. I'm trying to do my part with the grandkids now. Both our sons know how to work through problems. Thank goodness some of it rubbed off. And they are all pretty close by so some of it gets passed on. Even the electronics problems are worth spending time to solve. steve

 

[used red MN]

Curious what is promoting your “rant”? In a recent thread here the member was working on the electrical system on his tractor. He obviously seemed to have no recollection of electrical theory taught in 5th grade science and surely
repeatedly reinforced through later grades on up through high school graduation. Difficult for myself to understand having anlways excelled in science. Possibly paying less attention to the chemistry side of it, but I made it through it. I think actually due to his lack of basic electrical knowledge he ended up severely damaging the wiring on his tractor. I don’t know all the positive negatives of this overall subject, but ultimately it is the “upbringing” of the student that drives their choice whether to engage or just get by. What is probably far more shocking is some of the social items that are taught in school these days.

 

[Brian G. NY]

Back then many of us grew up on the farm. And in those days, much of the equipment could be worked on and repaired at home, and by anyone. Our Dads did that, and we watched and learned from them. We learned from our mistakes, and were taught common sense along the way. As we got older we helped Dad fix stuff, and we worked on our own cars when we got old enough to have one.

Contrast that to today where hardly anything can be fixed by a lay person, because it's all computers and electronics. People never learned to work on their own stuff, and therefore can't pass those skills on to their own kids, because they themselves don't have them. And so now we have a whole generation that can't do anything except play on their phones.

I consider myself very fortunate....my daughter and three of my granddaughters all married guys who are technically savvy and yet know how to do just about anything around the house and property. Two are licensed union electricians and one works with computer systems.
I should also note that all of their Dads have the same qualities.
One of them just completed a new house in which he did (with some help from his Dad) everything including concrete foundation and floor, in-floor heat, wiring, installation of two mini-split systems, gas hot water furnace, all the plumbing and heating, windows, vinyl siding and all the rest except the sheetrocking which he just doesn't like doing.
Uh-oh....almost forgot....they're not married yet but they will be a week from today. LOL
So, there are still young people out there who still have common sense and "know how to do stuff".
Somehow, I think these people are and will become even more increasingly valuable to society.

 

[wp6529]

Contrast that to today where hardly anything can be fixed by a lay person, because it's all computers and electronics.

I take issue with that, because today most things still can be fixed by a lay person, they just have to learn the skills just as earlier generations did. Current generations have good familiarity with computers and scan tools are readily available. It's not really any more difficult than learning how to use a timing light, etc.

 

[zuhnc]

computers and scan tools are readily available

Not applicable to a lot of the modern farm equipment that has "proprietary" components. At the mercy of the manufacturer. JD comes immediately to mind, as well as a couple of others. Pretty sad that someone has to come out to the field (eventually) to reprogram the computer for a $5.00 replacement part. For a complete transmission, or fuel injection pump, or other such expensive item, I can understand that. But replacing a water temperature sensor (for example) requires the computer to be taught to recognize the new, exact replacement part?

I was fortunate in that my dad was both mechanically and technically proficient, and taught me invaluable skills in both fields. I can change a tractor tube, and repair such tube, as well as troubleshoot and repair my own home computer network.

Equipment has become more technically complex, as well as the mechanical aspects. A lot of individuals don't want to deal with any of it, and won't take the time to learn even the basics. IT is the future, but it is going to take people with the mechanical skills (plumbers, carpenters, electricians, etc.) to install all of that hardware. Getting ones hands dirty is not on the agenda for a lot of individuals. zuhnc

 

[olgentdc]

Back then many of us grew up on the farm. And in those days, much of the equipment could be worked on and repaired at home, and by anyone. Our Dads did that, and we watched and learned from them. We learned from our mistakes, and were taught common sense along the way. As we got older we helped Dad fix stuff, and we worked on our own cars when we got old enough to have one.

Contrast that to today where hardly anything can be fixed by a lay person, because it's all computers and electronics. People never learned to work on their own stuff, and therefore can't pass those skills on to their own kids, because they themselves don't have them. And so now we have a whole generation that can't do anything except play on their phones.

IAgreed

 

[olgentdc]

what prompted Me ,, for starters just look around , And Yesterday My son just told Me about a kid that could not get his new brakes over the calipar for a 70s F 100 ,,..He threw the calipar in the back of his truck and drove a couple miles to his place for help from My grandson ,,. ,He Had NO BRAKES and Did ok but was lucky

 

[wp6529]

Not applicable to a lot of the modern farm equipment that has "proprietary" components. At the mercy of the manufacturer. JD comes immediately to mind, as well as a couple of others. Pretty sad that someone has to come out to the field (eventually) to reprogram the computer for a $5.00 replacement part. For a complete transmission, or fuel injection pump, or other such expensive item, I can understand that. But replacing a water temperature sensor (for example) requires the computer to be taught to recognize the new, exact replacement part?

I was fortunate in that my dad was both mechanically and technically proficient, and taught me invaluable skills in both fields. I can change a tractor tube, and repair such tube, as well as troubleshoot and repair my own home computer network.

Equipment has become more technically complex, as well as the mechanical aspects. A lot of individuals don't want to deal with any of it, and won't take the time to learn even the basics. IT is the future, but it is going to take people with the mechanical skills (plumbers, carpenters, electricians, etc.) to install all of that hardware. Getting ones hands dirty is not on the agenda for a lot of individuals. zuhnc

If you have a $$$K tractor, you can afford the $K tools necessary, they are not dealer only, there are options for independent mechanics. I have a $70K (now $90K) truck, I spent the $150 for the factory service manuals and the $100 for the necessary (laptop based) scan tool.

I have come to hate pneumatic tires... I can change and patch a tube, but the first company to provide an affordable DIY foam fill kit will get plenty of business from me. My dad was a semi-machinist (setup for operators mostly) and that provided a little introduction to machining. I took my interest and progressed it from there as well as interest in electronics, computers and damned near everything else.

The general populace is being deliberately conditioned into mindless dependent consumerism.

 

[zuhnc]

they are not dealer only

Then why aren't there very many (if any) independent shops around to repair these high dollar machines. Most everything I have read is manufacturers, JD especially, do not sell (or lease) anything to independent shops for repairs/computer "adjustments", etc. "Right-to-repair" hasn't happened in the farming equipment area, as it has around the automotive area. Independent shops, and you, can repair the automotive equipment all day long, at not too much cost. Farm equipment, nada.

Around my area I have seen quite a few of the green machines sitting in fields, half harvested, for a few weeks. That implies that independent shops don't have the equipment to fix, and it is dealer only, at the dealers' convenience.

 

[jddrawbar]

what prompted Me ,, for starters just look around , And Yesterday My son just told Me about a kid that could not get his new brakes over the calipar for a 70s F 100 ,,..He threw the calipar in the back of his truck and drove a couple miles to his place for help from My grandson ,,. ,He Had NO BRAKES and Did ok but was lucky

Priorities in education have changed drastically the past few years. Example, I saw in today's news that Chicago will start gender identity in kindergarten.

 

[buickanddeere]

In the last 40 yrs the mechanical mentality of the average Joe seems to have reached a extreme low... True , Technology improvements have made great steps . But the total lack of common sense , sound reasoning , and dead reckoning of some are nearly non existant ,,. But ,If You DO find one with those that has retained those lost qualities ,, They are most interesting to talk with and to learn from .

Kids raised in town by single mom’s have little to no mechanical, live stock, construction . Hunting , fishing and driving experience .
They can however smoke dope and run up a score of death and mayhem playing Grand Theft Auto.

 

[oliverkid]

In the last 40 yrs the mechanical mentality of the average Joe seems to have reached a extreme low... True , Technology improvements have made great steps . But the total lack of common sense , sound reasoning , and dead reckoning of some are nearly non existant ,,. But ,If You DO find one with those that has retained those lost qualities ,, They are most interesting to talk with and to learn from .

All im I’m gonna say is remember that the current generation is the offspring of the kids raised by your generation. It’s all a cascading effect.

 

[Eagle Beagle]

All im I’m gonna say is remember that the current generation is the offspring of the kids raised by your generation. It’s all a cascading effect.

Always heard apples don't fall too far from the tree. 50 years ago an owners manual might have shown how to set valve lash.
Now there are 32 pages of warnings for things like " Do not drink the battery acid "

 

[Dingo3]

Kids raised in town by single mom’s have little to no mechanical, live stock, construction . Hunting , fishing and driving experience .
They can however smoke dope and run up a score of death and mayhem playing Grand Theft Auto.

So who are you blaming? The mother? The kids? Divorce means separation of the adults not the separation of the responsibility to the children.

 

[Rich'sToys]

Always heard apples don't fall too far from the tree. 50 years ago an owners manual might have shown how to set valve lash.
Now there are 32 pages of warnings for things like " Do not drink the battery acid "

I swear that the owner's manual for my riding lawn mower has more "warnings" in it than actual instructions on how to operate the mower!

 

[used red MN]

Priorities in education have changed drastically the past few years. Example, I saw in today's news that Chicago will start gender identity in kindergarten.

This is probably not steering this away from political, but you read between my lines.

 

[randyrenfro7]

Rich, WARNINGS are actual instructions for idiots.

 

[moresmoke]

I take issue with that, because today most things still can be fixed by a lay person, they just have to learn the skills just as earlier generations did. Current generations have good familiarity with computers and scan tools are readily available. It's not really any more difficult than learning how to use a timing light, etc.

Actually easier than figuring out a dwell meter.