2606 Radiator leaks

[bc]

I was planning on firing up my 2606 rebuild today. Just had to add water, oil, and gas. Started pouring in water and darn, it was pouring out of the back of the radiator. I removed it and have a picture attached. I don't think we have any local and nearby radiator shops anymore. Have to check around in Wichita tomorrow.

It looks like there is 2 or 3 tubes that are leaking on the edge. These tubes aren't round type but are oblong or rectangular that go through the thickness of the radiator. I may have damaged it a long time ago and didn't notice or did it trying to straighten some fins.

I think I can clean up the tubes where the fins attach and solder it myself with a little guidance here. Probably have to mount it up high on an angle so no solder will gravity feed inside and fill the entire tube on each one that is leaking. The only solder and flux I have is what is used for copper plumbing and some for wiring so I would need to buy whatever is required. JB weld would be a last resort. I don't have a tank like the shops have but I can boil water and pour it in or get a gallon or two of acid and pour in there if it was necessary. Probably have to give it a light wire brushing to clean it down to bare metal.

Any ideas here? Thanks.

 

[stevieb49829]

All 3 tubes look like they were either severely damaged or rotted out from the inside. If it is rotted out, there isn't much sense in trying to patch 3 tubes when the whole radiator core is junk. If it is just damage, you are in for a lot of work to get them clean enough to solder them up. I use an exacto blade to carefully scrape the tube down to clean brass, after moving the fins out of the way. Then a good soldering paste and even plumber's solder will do the trick, IF you have a torch with a fine enough hot flame to not melt the surrounding joints as you work on one tube at a time. Don't worry about filling a tube with solder. Just get it closed up and soldered shut so it doesn't leak. Figure out how to close up the radiator so you can pressure test it with no more than 10 lbs of air, and a squirt bottle of soapy water. steve

 

[rustred]

I was planning on firing up my 2606 rebuild today. Just had to add water, oil, and gas. Started pouring in water and darn, it was pouring out of the back of the radiator. I removed it and have a picture attached. I don't think we have any local and nearby radiator shops anymore. Have to check around in Wichita tomorrow.

It looks like there is 2 or 3 tubes that are leaking on the edge. These tubes aren't round type but are oblong or rectangular that go through the thickness of the radiator. I may have damaged it a long time ago and didn't notice or did it trying to straighten some fins.

I think I can clean up the tubes where the fins attach and solder it myself with a little guidance here. Probably have to mount it up high on an angle so no solder will gravity feed inside and fill the entire tube on each one that is leaking. The only solder and flux I have is what is used for copper plumbing and some for wiring so I would need to buy whatever is required. JB weld would be a last resort. I don't have a tank like the shops have but I can boil water and pour it in or get a gallon or two of acid and pour in there if it was necessary. Probably have to give it a light wire brushing to clean it down to bare metal. View attachment 68176Any ideas here? Thanks.

As soon as any experienced rad guy sees that rad he will tell u it’s done. U need a new core. Look at all the green on it. It’s rotten. And you need good experience on soldering, a rad is not the thing to practice on. I have also seen some damaged core sections cut out and the ends soldered shut. Removing a couple cores in a good rad is ok. But your solder job still has to hold up to pressure. Plus if you have rebuilt engine , a good clean rad goes with the job.

 

[rustred]

I was planning on firing up my 2606 rebuild today. Just had to add water, oil, and gas. Started pouring in water and darn, it was pouring out of the back of the radiator. I removed it and have a picture attached. I don't think we have any local and nearby radiator shops anymore. Have to check around in Wichita tomorrow.

It looks like there is 2 or 3 tubes that are leaking on the edge. These tubes aren't round type but are oblong or rectangular that go through the thickness of the radiator. I may have damaged it a long time ago and didn't notice or did it trying to straighten some fins.

I think I can clean up the tubes where the fins attach and solder it myself with a little guidance here. Probably have to mount it up high on an angle so no solder will gravity feed inside and fill the entire tube on each one that is leaking. The only solder and flux I have is what is used for copper plumbing and some for wiring so I would need to buy whatever is required. JB weld would be a last resort. I don't have a tank like the shops have but I can boil water and pour it in or get a gallon or two of acid and pour in there if it was necessary. Probably have to give it a light wire brushing to clean it down to bare metal. View attachment 68176Any ideas here? Thanks.

As soon as any experienced rad guy sees that rad he will tell u it’s done. U need a new core. Look at all the green on it. It’s rotten. And you need good experience on soldering, a rad is not the thing to practice on. I have also seen some damaged core sections cut out and the ends soldered shut. Removing a couple cores in a good rad is ok. But your solder job still has to hold up to pressure. Plus if you have rebuilt engine , a good clean rad goes with the job.

 

[stevieb49829]

As soon as any experienced rad guy sees that rad he will tell u it’s done. U need a new core. Look at all the green on it. It’s rotten. And you need good experience on soldering, a rad is not the thing to practice on. I have also seen some damaged core sections cut out and the ends soldered shut. Removing a couple cores in a good rad is ok. But your solder job still has to hold up to pressure. Plus if you have rebuilt engine , a good clean rad goes with the job.

Mine has 4 tubes that were so tore up the PO cut them off at the upper and lower tanks and soldered them shut at the tanks. They don't leak.

 

[bc]

Mine has 4 tubes that were so tore up the PO cut them off at the upper and lower tanks and soldered them shut at the tanks. They don't leak.

Thanks. Glad to hear that. After what Rustred said, I gave up on wasting a trip to a radiator shop in the big city as they won't want to mess with it. We used to have a local radiator guy who would have done it back in the day but those kind of guys aren't around anymore.

My radiator has 4 rows of 24 tubes each totaling 96 tubes so losing 4 can't hurt too much. Yesterday I tried cutting some fins away with an exacto knife, needle nose pliers, and side cutters. Then tried solder and flux. Nothing stuck and I couldn't really get anything very clean either as it is too soft. Cutting on the fins probably opened up a couple of them making them worse so I won't do that again.

Just below and offset a little is the second row of tubes that I had to avoid. Next step was to use a flux brush and put on some HF paste type steel epoxy. The tube on the side was damaged enough so I cut some out and tried to seal the ends. On the inside three tubes one of them was damaged enough to need to cut some out. So I brushed on some steel epoxy on those as best as I could. Filled the radiator with water laying on its side and had a drop or two showed up on the side tube and had some drips under the other 3 tubes. Here are the pics.

Next step today is to cut the tubes by the tanks and see if I can get some solder or epoxy in there to seal them. There is a little more room there. If any tubes on the inside rows are leaking then this thing is toast. I'm not ready to give up the ship on this yet. It only needs to hold 7 pounds of pressure. I just want to get this rebuilt 2606 running and make it through a few hours of break in. I'll keep an eye on the temperature the whole time. Will post back this evening. I'm not sure I can seal it up to pressure test it but now that all the bolts are cleaned up I can probably install it in 15 minutes and remove it in the same amount of time.

 

[Janicholson]

Thanks. Glad to hear that. After what Rustred said, I gave up on wasting a trip to a radiator shop in the big city as they won't want to mess with it. We used to have a local radiator guy who would have done it back in the day but those kind of guys aren't around anymore.

My radiator has 4 rows of 24 tubes each totaling 96 tubes so losing 4 can't hurt too much. Yesterday I tried cutting some fins away with an exacto knife, needle nose pliers, and side cutters. Then tried solder and flux. Nothing stuck and I couldn't really get anything very clean either as it is too soft. Cutting on the fins probably opened up a couple of them making them worse so I won't do that again.

Just below and offset a little is the second row of tubes that I had to avoid. Next step was to use a flux brush and put on some HF paste type steel epoxy. The tube on the side was damaged enough so I cut some out and tried to seal the ends. On the inside three tubes one of them was damaged enough to need to cut some out. So I brushed on some steel epoxy on those as best as I could. Filled the radiator with water laying on its side and had a drop or two showed up on the side tube and had some drips under the other 3 tubes. Here are the pics.

Next step today is to cut the tubes by the tanks and see if I can get some solder or epoxy in there to seal them. There is a little more room there. If any tubes on the inside rows are leaking then this thing is toast. I'm not ready to give up the ship on this yet. It only needs to hold 7 pounds of pressure. I just want to get this rebuilt 2606 running and make it through a few hours of break in. I'll keep an eye on the temperature the whole time. Will post back this evening. I'm not sure I can seal it up to pressure test it but now that all the bolts are cleaned up I can probably install it in 15 minutes and remove it in the same amount of time.View attachment 68322View attachment 68323View attachment 68324

Best of luck with that. You are courageous. If it doesn't work. you could find a similar truck junkyard radiator and patch it on till you can find a replacement or a company to recore it. Jim

 

[caterpillar guy]

Recore it and you will be the happiest in the end. New radiators are cheap and cheesy now days. A new core will be the longest lasting plan for it. Or look into some of the places that do truck rads for a new core or even a better new one if necessary. There is a place I got a new rad for my semi a few years ago and was a decent quality one has been good so far.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

Thanks. Glad to hear that. After what Rustred said, I gave up on wasting a trip to a radiator shop in the big city as they won't want to mess with it. We used to have a local radiator guy who would have done it back in the day but those kind of guys aren't around anymore.

My radiator has 4 rows of 24 tubes each totaling 96 tubes so losing 4 can't hurt too much. Yesterday I tried cutting some fins away with an exacto knife, needle nose pliers, and side cutters. Then tried solder and flux. Nothing stuck and I couldn't really get anything very clean either as it is too soft. Cutting on the fins probably opened up a couple of them making them worse so I won't do that again.

Just below and offset a little is the second row of tubes that I had to avoid. Next step was to use a flux brush and put on some HF paste type steel epoxy. The tube on the side was damaged enough so I cut some out and tried to seal the ends. On the inside three tubes one of them was damaged enough to need to cut some out. So I brushed on some steel epoxy on those as best as I could. Filled the radiator with water laying on its side and had a drop or two showed up on the side tube and had some drips under the other 3 tubes. Here are the pics.

Next step today is to cut the tubes by the tanks and see if I can get some solder or epoxy in there to seal them. There is a little more room there. If any tubes on the inside rows are leaking then this thing is toast. I'm not ready to give up the ship on this yet. It only needs to hold 7 pounds of pressure. I just want to get this rebuilt 2606 running and make it through a few hours of break in. I'll keep an eye on the temperature the whole time. Will post back this evening. I'm not sure I can seal it up to pressure test it but now that all the bolts are cleaned up I can probably install it in 15 minutes and remove it in the same amount of time.View attachment 68322View attachment 68323View attachment 68324

You're in "nothing to lose" territory, so go for it. Radiator's no good as it is.

Unfortunately there were no new radiators for the 606 back in 2014, so it's unlikely there are any now.

 

[bc]

You're in "nothing to lose" territory, so go for it. Radiator's no good as it is.

Unfortunately there were no new radiators for the 606 back in 2014, so it's unlikely there are any now.

Definitely nothing to lose here. I only got started on it yesterday and had to do some other stuff. So far I took a narrow wood chisel and cut through a couple tubes at the bottom fins and then cut at the top of the bottom tank pulling the cut piece out with needle nose pliers. Utility knife would touch the tubes there. Looks like they will clean up with a small round and rat tail files. The only tricky one will be the bottom corner where the bracket is. Then do the top tank and see if they solder up or not. I'm feeling lucky here.

When I google "IH 2606 radiator" it brings up stuff going all the way up to 800 bux but I'm not seeing an exact match. Mine has the top tank that overhangs the core by a couple inches and the only ones that resemble that says they fit an IH 140. Mine has a center inlet at the top and an outlet at the bottom left and it looks like the outside framework is soldered into the top tank. I saw on ebay where Engine Cooling Master in Chino, CA lists some 4 row aluminum radiators for CaseIH VA VAS VAC VAO VAH VAI made by ASI Performance Pro for 159 bux but the inlet and outlet sizes are different. Anyone have any ideas here? Haven't really had a chance yet to look into a recore or how much that runs.

I do know that I'm definitely NOT going to put any Barsleak into my rebuilt engine. Thanks everyone.

 

[stevieb49829]

Definitely nothing to lose here. I only got started on it yesterday and had to do some other stuff. So far I took a narrow wood chisel and cut through a couple tubes at the bottom fins and then cut at the top of the bottom tank pulling the cut piece out with needle nose pliers. Utility knife would touch the tubes there. Looks like they will clean up with a small round and rat tail files. The only tricky one will be the bottom corner where the bracket is. Then do the top tank and see if they solder up or not. I'm feeling lucky here.

When I google "IH 2606 radiator" it brings up stuff going all the way up to 800 bux but I'm not seeing an exact match. Mine has the top tank that overhangs the core by a couple inches and the only ones that resemble that says they fit an IH 140. Mine has a center inlet at the top and an outlet at the bottom left and it looks like the outside framework is soldered into the top tank. I saw on ebay where Engine Cooling Master in Chino, CA lists some 4 row aluminum radiators for CaseIH VA VAS VAC VAO VAH VAI made by ASI Performance Pro for 159 bux but the inlet and outlet sizes are different. Anyone have any ideas here? Haven't really had a chance yet to look into a recore or how much that runs.

I do know that I'm definitely NOT going to put any Barsleak into my rebuilt engine. Thanks everyone.

"The only tricky one will be the bottom corner": You really don't have to go all the way to the tank, if you can get a clean cut across the tube higher up. A small scissors might work to clip it off, and it looks like your epoxy is getting into the small spaces.

An aluminum replacement might work, IF you can get dimensions that will fit your tractor. The good thing is almost any good welding shop can reweld any fittings or brackets you need on an aluminum radiator, if it doesn't fit just right. I'm considering getting one for my MH 101, and the ones that are close in dimensions are built for Model A Ford hotrods. They are very similar to what you describe above for yours. steve

 

[bc]

Well, the saga continues. Figured out the tubes on the outside aren't connected to the tanks so they must be there for support. Cut the 3 leaking tubes at both ends leaving one in between them so I decide to cut it out as well in case I nicked it cutting fins. Got a pic of each after cleaning them up with files. Tried solder next. Preheated the tank area with a plumbing torch and tried to use a small soldering iron that wasn't hot enough. Used the torch and had to move the heat around but managed to get all tube holes filled with solder. Not pretty as you will see in the pics but it worked. Put in water and found a fifth tube next to the others that leaked next to where the others did and also realized I nicked the top of three second row tubes by the top tank that were leaking. My soldered tubes were OK. Cut out and cleaned where the fifth tube was and nicked one in the second row on the bottom tank. Decided I might melt the other solder joints trying to do one by it self so I went to plan B. Mixed up some paste liquid steel and brushed it on the tube holes and all the nicked tubes. Didn't like the way it looked so I got some putty type JB weld and stuffed some of that in there. Letting it dry and will try tomorrow but don't have any high expectations.

Lessons learned so far is don't even mess with fixing tubes in the middle of the radiator but just go straight to the tanks and next time I would buy a little dremel tool or something to cut tubes without damaging others. Leave a little tube sticking out so it can be bent into the hole making it easier to solder with a big soldering iron. Fixing inside row tubes is doable if you also take out one on the outside row.

Tomorrow it will be time to start phoning around for a core job or another radiator. Assuming it leaks, my last gasp effort would be to cut out the JB weld, nicked tubes, and see if I can solder everything and not unsolder the tank. Thanks.

 

[wwoodrow]

I do not blame you for trying

I was planning on firing up my 2606 rebuild today. Just had to add water, oil, and gas. Started pouring in water and darn, it was pouring out of the back of the radiator. I removed it and have a picture attached. I don't think we have any local and nearby radiator shops anymore. Have to check around in Wichita tomorrow.

It looks like there is 2 or 3 tubes that are leaking on the edge. These tubes aren't round type but are oblong or rectangular that go through the thickness of the radiator. I may have damaged it a long time ago and didn't notice or did it trying to straighten some fins.

I think I can clean up the tubes where the fins attach and solder it myself with a little guidance here. Probably have to mount it up high on an angle so no solder will gravity feed inside and fill the entire tube on each one that is leaking. The only solder and flux I have is what is used for copper plumbing and some for wiring so I would need to buy whatever is required. JB weld would be a last resort. I don't have a tank like the shops have but I can boil water and pour it in or get a gallon or two of acid and pour in there if it was necessary. Probably have to give it a light wire brushing to clean it down to bare metal. View attachment 68176Any ideas here? Thanks.

bu

 

[rustred]

It does not work to re solder. All that happens is u unsolder the soldered stuff. You’re just chasing your tail around. You can not resolder used solder. The tanks would have to come off and be totally cleaned , then use muratic acid to clean the surface and resolder it. That core is done , and not understanding why ur playing around with an old junk rad , while u say u have the engine rebuilt. The 2 go together like bacon and eggs. And yes I have experience in soldering. I have a stack of 4 or 5 660 rads that the rad shop would not touch, and they look a heck of a lot better than what u got going on there. Green means it rotten. It’s just how it is. Not what u want to hear.

 

[Tom in Mo.]

You don't mention what part of the country you live. There is a radiator repair shop in DeSoto, MO Potosi, MO and Ballwin, MO. Those are the three near me that I know off.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

It does not work to re solder. All that happens is u unsolder the soldered stuff. You’re just chasing your tail around. You can not resolder used solder. The tanks would have to come off and be totally cleaned , then use muratic acid to clean the surface and resolder it. That core is done , and not understanding why ur playing around with an old junk rad , while u say u have the engine rebuilt. The 2 go together like bacon and eggs. And yes I have experience in soldering. I have a stack of 4 or 5 660 rads that the rad shop would not touch, and they look a heck of a lot better than what u got going on there. Green means it rotten. It’s just how it is. Not what u want to hear.

Not sure what you mean here. Bacon and eggs go great together. Had some for breakfast the other day. Delicious.

He's messing around with an old junk radiator because the alternative is... well, there is no alternative. No aftermarket support for this particular radiator. No radiator shops around. He has nothing to lose at this point except for a little time, and he just might learn something along the way.

 

[rustred]

my comparison was if you have bacon,... eggs is usually with it,.. so with a rebuilt engine the rad is usually check out at the same time or should be. yes i know his situation, but i was giving some info as to the why"s and what happens when trying to solder a rad. lots of opinions get posted but not much explaining to go with them. and maybe he could pick up some pointers to help him out. have you tryed soldering a used dirty rad?

 

[stevieb49829]

have you tryed soldering a used dirty rad?

I have! But, I built special small scraping tools out of sacrificial screwdrivers, to get down to clean brass, meticulously cleaned away the oxidized solder, heated one area at a time with a small neutral flame and flowed good solder slowly along a well-fluxed surface. Many people don't have the patience, or knowledge, or skills to do this, UNTIL they do it a few times and fail a few times. I didn't start as a successful solderer of old dirty radiators, either. BC is practicing to get good at this. IMHO steve

 

[bc]

Thanks guys. Here's Chapter Three of the saga. Put water in it this morning and found another nicked tube at the top tank and leaking at the bottom. Figured out that when removing fins the little short portion of the fin that is on the top edge of the tube can be stuck to it and open up a pin hole. Even though I've been told the radiator is done, I checked around and found a radiator shop in Wichita and took it down there. (Wish I would have done that at the start.) Showed him the place in the middle and he said he could have fixed those holes for a 100 bux by cleaning the area with muratic acid, tinning it with solder and flux, and then solder up the tubes with a low heat soldering iron. I showed him my plan B option of cutting the tubes at the core and trying to solder them. He said if I would have brought it in that way he would have tinned the whole area around the top of the core and then soldered the tubes shut for 200 bux. Told him about the JB weld I put on and he said that will eventually fall out and there is something in the weld even if chipped out such that he has never been able to clean that stuff off of the core plate good enough to be able to tin the core plate so it can then be soldered. Because of the JB weld my only option now is to recore it and that would run me 800 to 900 bux for one that size. Not quite ready to spend that much yet and he referred me to the tractor salvage north of town as he cleans and pressure tests all radiators they sell.

Then I go up to the tractor salvage and apparently there were only about 200 of these 2606s made but he said they all started from the IH 460 Utility tractor and subsequent utility tractors. We checked the shelves and drove around the yard but he didn't have a 460 utility radiator which he said would work with a little modification. Asked him what one would go for and he mentioned about 250 after he pays the radiator shop 100 to check it out.

So I've learned that I should have taken it a shop to begin with, not to use JB weld, how the radiator shop does their repairs, and he showed me one that he had soldered a couple tubes in the middle. With expanded options now for buying a replacement radiator I will check around on the web for a while to find one. Probably have to use different hoses as most options don't have that angled outlet at the bottom and might have to make some brackets. In the meantime I have nothing to lose by chipping out the JB weld and seeing if I can do any better cleaning, tinning, and soldering. Will follow up when there is something to report. I would just be using the backhoe around the farm at the pond and other places and probably wouldn't put more than 100 hours a year on it so it won't see any heavy use. Thanks.

 

[stevieb49829]

Thanks guys. Here's Chapter Three of the saga. Put water in it this morning and found another nicked tube at the top tank and leaking at the bottom. Figured out that when removing fins the little short portion of the fin that is on the top edge of the tube can be stuck to it and open up a pin hole. Even though I've been told the radiator is done, I checked around and found a radiator shop in Wichita and took it down there. (Wish I would have done that at the start.) Showed him the place in the middle and he said he could have fixed those holes for a 100 bux by cleaning the area with muratic acid, tinning it with solder and flux, and then solder up the tubes with a low heat soldering iron. I showed him my plan B option of cutting the tubes at the core and trying to solder them. He said if I would have brought it in that way he would have tinned the whole area around the top of the core and then soldered the tubes shut for 200 bux. Told him about the JB weld I put on and he said that will eventually fall out and there is something in the weld even if chipped out such that he has never been able to clean that stuff off of the core plate good enough to be able to tin the core plate so it can then be soldered. Because of the JB weld my only option now is to recore it and that would run me 800 to 900 bux for one that size. Not quite ready to spend that much yet and he referred me to the tractor salvage north of town as he cleans and pressure tests all radiators they sell.

Then I go up to the tractor salvage and apparently there were only about 200 of these 2606s made but he said they all started from the IH 460 Utility tractor and subsequent utility tractors. We checked the shelves and drove around the yard but he didn't have a 460 utility radiator which he said would work with a little modification. Asked him what one would go for and he mentioned about 250 after he pays the radiator shop 100 to check it out.

So I've learned that I should have taken it a shop to begin with, not to use JB weld, how the radiator shop does their repairs, and he showed me one that he had soldered a couple tubes in the middle. With expanded options now for buying a replacement radiator I will check around on the web for a while to find one. Probably have to use different hoses as most options don't have that angled outlet at the bottom and might have to make some brackets. In the meantime I have nothing to lose by chipping out the JB weld and seeing if I can do any better cleaning, tinning, and soldering. Will follow up when there is something to report. I would just be using the backhoe around the farm at the pond and other places and probably wouldn't put more than 100 hours a year on it so it won't see any heavy use. Thanks.

We do learn through our experiences. Good luck, and make sure you report back when you get her working. steve