273 knotting problem

[Mike(NEOhio)]

I'm having trouble getting one side to knot. It make the knot on the #1 twine but not the #2 twine. #2 is just a tail sticking up from between the bales. It cuts off and holds the twine for the next bale but somehow misses getting the #2 into the knot. It ties good when I roll it through by hand but not in the field. The other side (second photo) makes a good knot but one of the tails is not pulled through. Half of the strands are bent back into the knot. I'm thinking the bill tongue is not grabbing all of the twine when it comes around and separates the strands.

 

[Charlie M]

I'm only familiar with IH knotters but I think all balers have to do the same thing - prevent the hay once the plunger leaves the chamber from backing up a little. On an IH baler it can back up enough the bill hooks don't reach the twine and thus miss the knot. Your picture is what happens when the bill hook can't reach the twine. I don't know what prevents that on a NH baler but its worth a look to see if something has fallen off or broken on that side. The other thing is proper adjustments and clearances are critical on any baler. Have you got a manual where you can check all that stuff?

 

[Loosehandle]

I'm having trouble getting one side to knot. It make the knot on the #1 twine but not the #2 twine. #2 is just a tail sticking up from between the bales. It cuts off and holds the twine for the next bale but somehow misses getting the #2 into the knot. It ties good when I roll it through by hand but not in the field. The other side (second photo) makes a good knot but one of the tails is not pulled through. Half of the strands are bent back into the knot. I'm thinking the bill tongue is not grabbing all of the twine when it comes around and separates the strands.

Have you ever tried it with sisal twine?

 

[Fritz Maurer]

The twine is being pulled out of the twine disc. Only the needle end gets tied. Twine disc or holder worn out/ out of adjustment. Making heavy or wet bales the tension at the disc must be at or above specified tension in the book.

 

[MJMJ]

Have you ever tried it with sisal twine?

That is sisal.

 

[Roger in Iowa]

I'm having trouble getting one side to knot. It make the knot on the #1 twine but not the #2 twine. #2 is just a tail sticking up from between the bales. It cuts off and holds the twine for the next bale but somehow misses getting the #2 into the knot. It ties good when I roll it through by hand but not in the field. The other side (second photo) makes a good knot but one of the tails is not pulled through. Half of the strands are bent back into the knot. I'm thinking the bill tongue is not grabbing all of the twine when it comes around and separates the strands.

If the needle twine is not getting knotted, the tucker finger is not putting the #2 twine in the twine disk. Check tucker finger adjustment to the needle.

 

[Fritz Maurer]

Stand back a few feet and take a picture of the whole bale chamber. Is picture 1 a sample bale with the knot at the rear? I viewed the picture backwards , Roger is right.

Picture 2 is insufficient bill hook tension with the ends not pulled all the way through.

 

[DeltaRed]

Fritz has it. However,you really NEED to order a book. That book will have a trouble shooting guide with pictures. Then the remedy,again with pics. Adjust by the book,in the order of the book. And unless things are worn or bent/broken it will tie like a new one.

 

[Mike(NEOhio)]

Got it solved. A few years back I while baling the large spring under the knotter clutch failed, the hook broke off. I started a knotting cycle at the wrong time. Broke both shear bolts and bent up some other parts, among them the twine finger actuator bar and levers. I straightened best I could and it ran OK a few years. Over the winter I took the whole knotter off and apart. Gave it new pinions for the twine discs and bills and reset the whole knotter stack spacing. It went back in smoothly but that's when the missing started and I've been working on it all week. I suspected the twine finger and noticed the shaft had a twist so the troubling one was angled to the rear more and the spring wasn't pulling the fingers all the way back. I tried adjusting the rod on that one, a lot, but that didn't help so I pulled it off, twisted it back in line and straightened the shaft in my press. Put it on this morning and it didn't miss a one.

Fritz, the twine discs are working and not missing because after each missed knot the #1 twine is in position for the next bale so it's being held for the cutoff. It's just outside the bill hook. Still not sure how only half the strands are being pulled through.

 

[Mike(NEOhio)]

Fritz has it. However,you really NEED to order a book. That book will have a trouble shooting guide with pictures. Then the remedy,again with pics. Adjust by the book,in the order of the book. And unless things are worn or bent/broken it will tie like a new one.

I have a book and did all that. This came in while I was typing my latest entry.

 

[DeltaRed]

Got it solved. A few years back I while baling the large spring under the knotter clutch failed, the hook broke off. I started a knotting cycle at the wrong time. Broke both shear bolts and bent up some other parts, among them the twine finger actuator bar and levers. I straightened best I could and it ran OK a few years. Over the winter I took the whole knotter off and apart. Gave it new pinions for the twine discs and bills and reset the whole knotter stack spacing. It went back in smoothly but that's when the missing started and I've been working on it all week. I suspected the twine finger and noticed the shaft had a twist so the troubling one was angled to the rear more and the spring wasn't pulling the fingers all the way back. I tried adjusting the rod on that one, a lot, but that didn't help so I pulled it off, twisted it back in line and straightened the shaft in my press. Put it on this morning and it didn't miss a one.

Fritz, the twine discs are working and not missing because after each missed knot the #1 twine is in position for the next bale so it's being held for the cutoff. It's just outside the bill hook. Still not sure how only half the strands are being pulled through.

The twine finger that fits inbetween the disks gets a groove after several thousand bales. Simply tightening the finger tension does not helpThe only way to find out is to remove the finger and inspect it..Everytime I got a slug in my NewHalland the twine would pull out. Had a 347 JD that did that,too.They both required finger replacement,which fixe the ploblem.

 

[HILLTOPHARV]

Also check that the springs on the dogs, top and bottom are working freely. If they don't operate freely, the hay in the chamber will push back.

 

[Cash4Toys]

Also check that the springs on the dogs, top and bottom are working freely. If they don't operate freely, the hay in the chamber will push back.

Neighbor just went through the same issue on 273, one side ties good but not the other. The roller on the arm that's operated by the cam was shot, hardly anything left of it, flat spot on it. Replaced them both, and works like a champ. Worth taking a look at yours.

 

[Mike(NEOhio)]

Neighbor just went through the same issue on 273, one side ties good but not the other. The roller on the arm that's operated by the cam was shot, hardly anything left of it, flat spot on it. Replaced them both, and works like a champ. Worth taking a look at yours.

Thanks, got it fixed. The shaft for the twine fingers was bent some from a previous mishap when the spring under the clutch failed while baling. The arm for the right side was twisted to the rear some. That's the one that has the spring and the roller was sitting about an inch or more below the cam because the spring couldn't pull it up more. I took the shaft off and straightened the twist and bend. Works perfectly now and the roller is close to the cam. Every little thing makes a difference.