Air Compressors

[farmallboy15]

I am currently building a new shop to work on tractors and other equipment. My dilemma is whether to buy a new somewhat lighter duty air compressor or a used totally industrial compressor. What would you do? I would prefer to come in below $1,500 for the compressor itself.


Option one: $1,400 new Eaton PPE05V080I1, 5hp, 80gal, 17CFM. Early reviews on the company are somewhat mixed but overall and recently they seem to be well built with good reviews. They are also relativly local so I can check them out in person. *https://www.eatoncompressor.com/piston-compressors/industrial-series-5-10-hp/industrial-5hp-2-stage-single-phase-80-gallon-vertical-air-compressor*

Option 2: $800 used ($4,000+ new) Champion HR10-12, 10hp, 120gal, 34CFM. This would require a motor change to get to single phase. I would use a 7.5hp Baldor motor and drop down the pulley ratio, reducing output to 25 CFM equating to an HR7-12. This would add another $800 or so, $1,600 total.

If it is your money, what would you do?

 

[David G]

I would rather have the Champion, have a 5HP Ingersoll Rand that poops out when bead blasting.

 

[Frank 41]

You shuld get a Quincy for that kind of money. Catch Rural King sale and or senior sale. I had to replace the Baldor motor after the warranty was off. Replaced it with a Lesson.

 

[farmallboy15]

The one under budget at $1,300, which is the QT-54 looks pretty light duty... *https://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200350475_200350475*

The QT-5 comes in at $1,800 and was second on my list when I was intially looking at new compressors. Specs are pretty similar to the Eaton: pump runs 150rpm faster, 50lbs heavier and $400 more expensive with a more reputable/established brand. Maybe I will wait for a sale after all. *https://www.ruralking.com/air-compressor-5-hp-80-gal-2-sta*

 

[hd6gtom]

I ran a tire shop for 22+ years Ingersoll Rand type 30 or a Quincy industrial should last you most of your life. I bought a used type 30 in 1989 for the tire shop. It is still in use today. It has thousands of hours on it, 60 gal lay down tank. We used NAPA compressor oil in it. We used 1" air guns and 3 or 4 - 1/2 inch. I did have to buy a new motor for it, but that was at least 20 years ago.

 

[David G]

Quincy would be my first choice

 

[Steve@Advance]

That's a decision that depends on what your needs are.

The Eaton would probably be a good choice for intermittent use. If you will be working alone, a few days a week, and it will meet your CFM requirements, it would last many years, be a plug and play application, new with warranty.

But the Champion, though not the top of the line, would be a more enduring piece of equipment. If you will be using air on a daily basis, possibly with employees, and a down compressor would be costly for production, an industrial model would be justified.
Do you have any history on it? The age, hours, working environment? Can you see it run?

Just have to weigh the difference in the needs, cost, and effort to make the used one work, and the gamble of new with warranty, or used with ?.

 

[Stephen Newell]

Unless you plan to do a lot of sandblasting or have several people spraying paint or running air sanders you don't need a big compressor. A mid range portable compressor will run nail guns, provide air for one person spraying paint or run an impact wrench. Something around 7 scfm at 90 psi should do what ever you need. I have one that runs at 4 scfm at 90 psi and I very rarely have to stop and wait for it to catch up. It's only when I sandblast I run out of air.

 

[kcm.MN]

(quoted from post at 19:19:34 05/04/18) Quincy would be my first choice

Same here. However, of the two options you listed, I'd go with the Champion.

 

[farmallboy15]

The old shop has a 60 gal Campbell Hausfeld, "6.5hp" (actually like a 3hp), 10.3CFM (@90PSI, not 175PSI). Realistically, it will primarily be just me working in the shop with limited sandblasting as the max usage. With me painting or using air grinders and the like, this old compressor would run constantly and do so very loudly... I'm trying to go big and preferably never mess with it again.

 

[grizz02]

have you thought about a phase converter ? a buddy of mine runs all his machines on 3 phase with a converter says his electric bills are a lot less might be cheaper then changing the motor

 

[Mike in Mn.]

I bought a new larger compressor about 20 years ago, looking at 5 hp.vs 71/2 hp. The Salesman talked me out of the 71/2 and said the 5 would be just fine. He asked me just how often do you really need that 71/2, cause every time it starts and runs look at how many amps it's going to draw. I thought good point, bought a Schrader/Bridgeport from NAPA at one of their dealer shows, 5 hp, 80 gallon, plenty of air. I do run a pressure tank blaster with an 1/8 tip, rated at 1 square ft. per minute of paint removal, and on average that's close to what it will do. For me that's acceptable, use a blast cabinet also. lots of air tools and two can work and never run out of air. I do have a 30 gallon auxiliary plumbed in with the 80 for 120. In the evening when I'm sitting at the kitchen table, if I forget to shut the breaker off for the compressor, it will dim the lights slightly when it starts, will remind me to run out and hit the breaker, and I have plenty of juice to all the buildings. I'm glad I didn't buy a 7 1/2 hp compressor. Just my 2 cent.

 

[504]

I liked Quincy's till they stopped building them in Quincy.
Belt drive,two stage,175 PSI. You will be happy.

 

[Deutz Lover]

I have a friend who has what I think is a Quincy (80) gallon. When the tank pressure would build to about 125 lbs the pump would start slowing down until it hardly pumped. Something did not make sense.
I had a terrible time resisting the urge to tear the pump down. I finally found the problem despite bad hearing. The two drive belts would start slipping at about 125 psi, but remarkably did not make any squeak or slipping noise. I just suddenly realized that while the pump was slowing down the drive motor was still running the same rpm. D'oh.

 

[Stephen Newell]

I have a compressor similar to that and have never even come close to maxing it out. Even sandblasting the compressor would run and shut off for quite a while before running again. I don't use any air sanders or grinders so this compressor is way more than what my needs are.

As far as noise you might consider putting the compressor outdoors. A compressor has less problems with condensation outdoors and the filter stays cleaner if it's not breathing the shop air. It would only have to have a small awning over it to prevent direct rainfall.

 

[ss55]

An extra air reservoir can be a less expensive way to supply more air once in a while. Add a valve to isolate the extra tank when you don't need it.

Check the manufacture date stamped on any used air tank, they can be older than they look.

 

[DoubleO7]

A $4000 used compressor for $800 is going to have boocoo hours on it.
The compressor head might be iffy.
And why is it being sold in the first place if not crapped out?

 

[DR. EVIL]

SON bought a 1964 Quincy 3 rated hp 2-stage compressor, 80 gallon tank, forget the brand of motor, ran but after shut-off you could hear air leaking in the unloader. Compressor was installed new at the Deck Truckstop along I-80, mile marker 19 Geneseo, Ill. About 1990 was sold to a small machine shop in Silvis, Illinois to supply compressed air to several machine tools, then about 2000 was sold to a body shop in Rock Island, Illinois where it worked until about 2011 when Son bought it for $500. He had to spend some money on the valves and unloader but it performs with ANY 5 hp 2 stage 80 gallon compressor, It has 100% duty cycle, best to let it run constantly, 24-7-for weeks at a time. There's a compressor service shop in Moline Illinois that can get him ANY part next day. Son's saving for a new 80 gallon tank for it to replace the 54 year old tank. It makes about 15-16 cfm @ 175 psi.

I bought a Porter-Cable 7-1/2 hp 2-stage 80 gallon compressor about 15 years ago. 26 cfm @ 165 psi. Runs my 40# HF sand blast pot continously, which compressor is only 50% duty cycle, I aim a shop fan at the motor and compressor when I blast. I wanted a 7-1/2 hp I-R T-30 from Home Depot but they wouldn't deal.

I've got two small Porter-Cable compressors, a 6 gallon pancake and a twin tank contractors compressor. They both run fine on 15A 110V household outlets, and either runs a nailer to do trim or framing nailing, air up tires. They are both oiless, noisey as all get out.

As a guy who suffered with small troublesome too small compressors for DECADES, before I got my big compressor, get a compressor 1-1/2 to 2 times the size you think you need. When I sand blast I really need a 10 hp. The orfice size determines air usage and they start wearing as soon as the sand hits them. Supposedly a 1/8th inch diameter hole flows 15 cfm @ 90-100 psi, everything a 5 hp 2-stage can provide, but it only stays 1/8th inch for a couple minutes. By the time the orfice wears to 3/16ths inch your air usage increases 225%, or about 34 cfm.

Yeah, I don't need 26 cfm of air often, but depending on what I'm doing in the shop the compressor may only run once a MONTH.

 

[Destroked 450]

I prefer a Quincy but the QT5 they sell today is not like the old Quincy's, I have one setting in my shop with a trashed crank and rods, even through the oil could be seen in the sight glass it got too low to lubricate the rods.
These are good compressors, just not the same as the Quincy 325 series pumps that are oil pressure lubed and are completely rebuildable.

After reading over the specs on the Eaton Polar Air it looks to be a good quality compressor, US made all cast iron construction with replaceable rod bearings instead of aluminum rods.
800 rpm compressor speed so it's a decent size pump that's not being run to death
Full 5 year warranty, if I didn't have a QR25 Quincy I'd have to give one of these a serious look

 

[MickeyDBP]

I have that 10HP Champion (five years now) and it runs about 6 hours a day (machine shop). Change the oil and air filters in it twice a year and it just works. Had a Quincy QT-10 before that and it was a hard starting breaker tripping piece of junk. Used to eat at least one contactor a year and shut the shop down until we got the reserve compressor online. On the Champion other than the auto drain on the bottom of the tank crapping out (we just open the dump valve every morning now) it has been trouble free.

 

[caterpillar guy]

Never have to much air. And for anybody that has never put air in truck tires,you want that 175 or more pressure or take all day airing tires. When they call for 120 or so 135 just doen't get it. if you don't want to fool around to finish the last 20 PSI in the tire. Your so close to the cut out on the pressure switch it may not kick back on in time to finish the tire. 175 will do it fine. The slower the compressor runs the longer it should last.

 

[Hobo,NC]

For my use I would not buy either. I need 20 plus CFM I have a 21 that's the least I need, I have a 27 CFM its all I need... You can get by with less but I don't like to...

The drawback to a high RPM compressor is they make lots of water the slower you turn it the less water they produce... I see deals all the time for good units most folks don't have the power to run a 5/7-1/2 HP 20 plus CFM compressor.

 

[farmallboy15]

Well, I have done a little more research into the Quincy's. I found two used one's a state over in Indiana. One is a 5hp with a 325 pump (asking $1000 but it already has a single phase motor!), the other is a 7.5hp with a 340 pump (asking $750, not sure on the motor phase). Right now I'm leaning pretty heavily towards one of these because of the pressure lubricated feature.

I also took another glance at the type 30 Ingersoll Rand's and the reviews seem VERY spotty. There were quite a few with failures in the first couple hours/ days...

Thanks for the help guys!

 

[Hobo,NC]

https://www.ebay.com/i/253281647972?chn=ps

Kellogg American pumps are good one's also... I have a 335 and a 321 I have been into both EZ to rebuild. Like any engine if they knock/rattle the pump needs to disassembled :wink:

http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/viewtopic.php?t=704322&highlight=compressor

 

[Destroked 450]

You can't go wrong with one of those compressors
The 325 is rated for 3-5 hp with max cfm of 18.6 @ 175 psi
The 340 is rated for 5-10 hp with max cfm of 29.6 @ 175 psi
7 1/5 hp model will probably be in the 23 cfm neighborhood.

My 325 compressor is big, the pump alone weighs 295 lbs
The 340 is a monster with the pump weighing 480 lbs
Both are pressure lubed and rebuildable just like a engine will over sized pistons and under sized bearing available.
The unloader allows the pump to start easily and doesn't start pumping air until oil pressure is established.

That's a good deal on the 340 but it probably has a 3 phase motor and 7 1/2 hp single phase motors are hard to find used, a new one will set you back around $650-800.
5 hp motor is rated at 28 amps, uses 10 gauge wire and a 50 amp breaker.
7 1/2 motor is rated at 40 amps, uses 8 gauge wire and a 70 amp breaker
Looks like the 7 1/2 hp compressor is going to use a good bit more electricity.
Unless you really need the extra air I'd stay with a 5 hp model