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Biggest thing that limits pull participation?

Yesterday's Tractor Forums
M

Mopower

Well-known Member
Just fishing for opinions here...

What is the single biggest existing rule, regulation, limiting factor etc. stunting overall participation in antique tractor pulling today? I'm not asking for new rules saying what you CAN'T do, but eliminating rules so you CAN do something. Whatever competition level or class you wish to comment on is ok. Thanks for your time and thought.

Ethan Berry
 
SKAP has a class for tractors that only allows uncut tires and no stroked motors is the rules for the class. This is a good rule but it just might be a problem to inforce to determine if a tractor is stroked. You better be good at sandbagging if you are a stroked competitor.
 
I will say that the speed limits make the playing field far more level for us guys that dont have 40 grand in a motor. All the power in the world dont matter if you can only use 4 mph of it. So we guys and gals with 40 hp can compete in the lower weight classes with the mega buck, mega hp tractors. Ansd they can go on up in weight to use the money and power they have which I cant.
 
I think it is the 57 to 59 model years. Needs to be moved up to 72. That is 40 yrs. My son grew up on a XT 190 and a 4010. We need to move on. Vic
 
Weather you like it or not, I would say any rule that requires stock parts.

It has been discussed many times, but running a speed limit and saying "run what ya brung" opens up the pull to everybody.

Then you pick 2, 3, 4, or more speed limit classes and let the pullers decide for themselves where they belong.

Yes, the stroked 120hp tractor with cut 18.4 38 tires has an advantage in a 3mph class, but he should considering the time and money he put into his tractor. This isn't kindergarden - there will be winners and losers.

Don't worry, the other 120hp tractors running 6mph or better will harass the sandbagger in the 3mph class and he will step up where he belongs soon enough.
 
Worst limiter of participation in anything. It's easier to sit on your duff in front of the TV or computer with some munchies and beer. Than it is to make the bucks to purchase parts, tools and haul everything to shows.
 
If a person does not like the rules set with in, then one can experience another club.....I would like to see the sponsors money placed on the winning tractors more, bigger pots.
 
The reason we dont go to more pulls is cost. $4.00 diesel fuel in the pickup, entry fee from $15.00 to $25.00 per class, $10.00 a gallon for race gas. The cost building the tractor is the cheap part!
 
If the name of the game is eliminating certain rules to make it easier to participate, I'd say do away with the No Chrome rules in NATPA Div I and II. Lets face it, alot of guys like to dress their tractors up when they restore them.
 
Gas price and being close to two different states, the CDL requirement to move the tractors across state lines.
 

Need to place a limit on just how many times any single tractor can hook to the sled. Watching the same 2 or 3 tractors hook to the sled 4 or 5 times each gets REAL boring REAL QUICK, and it makes the entire event go on and on for hours and hours.
 
The biggest thing for me is the people at the pulls being unfriendly and not willing to answer questions for outsiders to the club you are pulling at. They just look at you like what are you doing here. As you look around you can see everybody in there little groups. When you get that feeling that you are not wanted there chances are you are going somewhere else to pull and send your money. God for bid the you win. You must be cheating. There will be someone to find something wrong with your tractor. I am not saying that everybody is unfriendly at these pulls. But it only takes a few people to spoil the apple cart. I pull at several clubs in my area there and there are your friendly ones and not so friendly ones. People need to lighten up a little and not take this tractor pulling so serious for a plastic trophy and have fun and get to know your fellow pullers.
 
I like what MisterT says down below. I pity the pull that has too many hooks by the same tractor.

We have one pull in our area that refuses to update rules to address the changing times of tractor pulling. They ran a 5mph speed limit for the past 15-20yrs and then dropped the speed limit this year thinking it would be more "fun" for everyone. Attendance has been down in the past few years since much stronger tractors started showing up and attendance was down again this year.

In other clubs we've found that splitting the speed limits, having tire size and cut rules has really increased participation. The guys who have the time, motivation and money prefer to go faster if given the chance. The 6mph modified class is one of the coolest classes to watch.

What's the most limiting rule? A pull that only has one speed limit (or no speed limit).

Zack

PS - why is Tunica the biggest pull of the year? Look at their rules.
 
I agree,,, if there is going to be several tractors at a pull, there should be a limit of 2 and no more than 3 classes. Two would be pleanty if there are several tractors.
 
I'd say most have done great with the rules for the most part. I don't believe that is where the problem lies. Money , or lack of it has more to do with it than anything. Problem is some will use "the rules" for an excuse rather than tell the truth as to really why they aren't at the pulls. Let's face it, it's addictive but there's a wife and house payment at home too. Some just won't admit it.
 
kind of a double edged sword there... People say they want more hooks, just not with the same tractor...

Entry fees are entry fees. The more hooks you get the less everything costs.

As said before, diesel is $4 a gallon, why not hook it up 4-5 times while you are there?
 
Creating rules that a bias towards other people and rules around only the club members pulling tractors, I know a particular pulling organization in the area around me where they seem to single you out, as in you try something new, and it works well the next year there is a rule for that.
 

During the year we usually pull three different sleds-the sled with the 20 inch drawbar height rule works for us the best.
 
I agree Zack. We added a 2nd speed limit to our pull this year and it went over very well.

We have a 35 year old age limit, and 2 speed limits: 4mph and 8mph. No cut tires in 4mph.

Not perfect, but It does give every tractor a place to pull.
 
I have been turned away from two clubs for wanting to pull an Oliver 88 in the 4500# class. I say if the tractor meets the rules for the class why rule a certain model out? Obviously there are no weight or tire size advantages.... and a stock tractor at a pull in my area is as rare as hens teeth!
 
was interested in building a modified garden tractor about ten years back. Went to a winter national pull at msu. They had about 250 tractors there. Watched them pull for two hours.
The only thing seperateing one from another was the paint and fiberglass. All had cub chassies, ran kohler motors, chrome wheels with pre cut dick cepecs. They all sounded the same and pulled within inches of each other. Wow, real exciteing. Talk about your cookie cutter pullers. Left the pull and said to myself if tractor pulling becomes the same thing it will be time to quit. Is it time? Watching the same cookie cutter tractors over and over is not terribly exciteing. Its not uncommon for one of the clubs we pull with to start pulling at noon and not finish untill 6 pm or later. Crazy thing is they probably wont pull more then 55 different tractors. I can do it once or twice a year but they wonder why there numbers are down for the 7 or more pulls they have each year.
 

Depends on what you are calling "Antique tractor Pulling"..
Go to the original Drawbar height..not 20"..
3 MPH and have the track prepared for pulling..
Antiques should not have to pull on a Hard, un-prepared surface, like I saw at Plain City this year..
Was not fair to those pullers at all..

Ron..
 
Rules rules and more rules will be your downfall Have an antique class,38and older have a farmstock class,have a classic class and an open class Mph in everything but open no cut tires or top cuts in antique,farmstock,two tire sizes over stock in antique,farmstock,and classic. open 18-4 38's largest fullcuts The open class is OPEN RUN WHAT YOU BRUNG.No speed limit no rpm limit Engine from same tractor family Naturaly aspirated Open must have safty rules ie deadman throttle side shields breakaway scatter blankets etc.You have to put on a show to get spectators and young people Watching 3,5,8 MPH classes is BORING to the spectators Thats why an open class it is exciting. As far as money We have a truck pull that brings huge crouds so they have money to attend But our tractor pulls do not bring the spectators just the pullers They limited the open class to 8 MPH again BORING An OPEN CLASS should be open GIVE THE FOLKS A SHOW With these rules everyone has a class and you will draw some spectators and new young pullers
 
I wish a nnalert were in office. At least we would hear someone getting grilled on why fuel prices are soaring and what they plan on doing to help bring it back down. I hear crickets about the subject now!
 
Our clubs insurance provider sets forth most of the rules. Most clubs fight change so you are stuck with the old rules. Also the sled we have is a nice sled but isnt big enough to stop some tractors on a good track. There for we have a 100 hp limit 3.5mph no cut tires nearly stock tractors. Yes it is tiresome watching the same tractor in 3 classes being pulled by 4 people, but some times that is the only tractor in the class. Our spectators are usally strong at the begining but by the ends no one is there.
 
That's why we love cement pulling. Hitch rule, wheelie bars. Pretty much it. Run what you brung and hope you brung enough!!
 
it's funny how personalized the responses are. You can tell just from reading them what kind of tractor someone pulls. What's sad is the responses like this one (Ed), from someone who obviously have a hot tractor and really seem to have no use for anyone else at the pull (8MPH is boring). The only people saying Bring what ya Brung, I don't care what it is, are the ones that aren't allowed to pull by normal rules, or there is only one other tractor to pull against because they've gone so hog wild or stretched the limits of what is allowed.

Look at NATPA Div 2 Topcut. From what we've seen it has been a huge success.
 
For most everyone in my area,(southern Michigan) the price of fuels is slowing down participation and attendance to all antique tractor events...It really hurts to have to fork out 50-100 bucks to haul to and then drive the tractors in the events at the various shows. Everyone complains about it.
 
Good discussion on the pullers. My concern is the audience. Around here, it's very difficult for the audience to know what is going on, who to cheer for and why. If they knew the standings of the pullers in each class they could get involved in the competition and know who was ahead and what the next puller would have to do to get ahead. As with any sport it's about the friendly competition and about watching a winner pull his way to the top. Maybe there would still be an audience by the end of the pull.
 
The fact that rules are made but not enforced, The stock class guys in my area are the worst offenders. Im sorry but an M farmall in third gear running just off idle so he doesnt blow the horn in the 5500 pound class is NOT stock! We run our tractors in the open classes because we dont have enouff engine to pull in the stock classes!
 
#1, Rules
#2, Location
#3, Cost
#4, Politics

# 1, 2 & 4 are usually closely linked.

Because of many unrelated things, I am only involved in one tractor pull a year. I am very thankfull to have that involvement, even though it is a burden on my family. I wish I could still compete, but that is not possible for the near future. If I could compete, it would be a bored & stroked "farm stock" tractor. Now, I am fully aware that that flies in the face of what the term "farm stock" should mean but I also know the pullers and tractors that are pulling in those classes. If one wants to compete in a "Farm Stock" class in my neck of the woods, you better have double the factory HP just to get started.

To get back to the original question, treat the pullers like they are human and give everyone the same application of the rules. Pullers may not agree with an application of a given rule, but they will respect the organizer if they are consistent with applying those rules to all pullers. If you run your pull with that mind set, you should be fine.
 
vic bring them to WEST ALTON,MO. Oct. 14th 10 a.m. 69 and older 4,6, and 8mph any tire just no cab tractors as you know we have roof over the scales go to Rivers Point Tractor Pulling Association for more info
 
I'm to poor to have any newer tractors, but I would like to bring our 45 WC. Allis. The JD is down at the moment. might get it running by then if the parts come. I think your idea is good. In the lighter classes will be hard to beat the old tractors. But in the heavier classes might be different. Although a RD 560 or a 800 Moline are tough. Hope to make your pull. Vic
 
First of all Ed you had a year to bring in a class of tractors to pull with you you did not. The club paid for added insurance just for you.You complained you did not get enough money when you were the only one in your class. Why do you not go pull at other clubs their is competion out there, but you would rather not.You would rather cause friction with in are club.Acting childish like you did at are last pull will not gain you any respect. Take your ball and go play somewhere else.
 
Sorry, maybe you were responding to one of the other postings. People always think I'm Ed because of my initials and E-mail address.
 
It seems that there are 2 points of view to look from: the puller and the organizer.

The organizer wants his pull to be a success. He wants as many hooks as possible, and he would like to turn a profit at the end of the day.

Most pullers want a good track, a good sled, a class that their tractor will fit in, a fairly administered set of rules, no "old boys" club, friendly competition, and friendly people.

The delicate balance for the organizer is to not turn anybody away who is willing to pay a hook fee, while TRYING to keep MOST of the pullers happy regarding rules and classes.

Ethan, I would do what you can to get as many pullers out as possible. No mater what you do, 10% of the pullers will have a chip on their shoulder, cause trouble, and threaten to not come back. You can't please these people so don't waste your resourses trying.

To the 10%, you would be far better off and have a lot more fun if you just "go with the flow" and try to make some friends while you are out at the pull. Win, lose, or draw, it is way more fun when you and the guy you were pulling against can enjoy a cold beer together after the pulling is done.
 
easy easy.....i don't hear too much on political radio sayin that 4.29 a gal. when bush was in was the norm until the election in 08 when the price of everything fell on its a$$....
 
You are correct. What I"m saying though is you heard an ear full everyday about the gas prices when crude hit $147 during his term. Now we are numb to it....except when I fill up of course.
 
Any rule that keeps me from pulling haha


But seriously, lack of rules, poorly stated or misunderstood, and enforcement of rules has a pretty big effect on pulling. My tractor is not the hottest and it does not win all the time but I still get alot of bad attention for it. I've always felt there was alot of bias since it's a Deere. I've made it to run with the big MM and it seems like they don't like me for the simple fact that Deeres usually do not keep up with the MMs. It's not fair to let the MM guys swap all these parts around and then tell the rest of us that we can't do anything.

I guess that's why I never go to "antique" pulls.
 
FACTORY FARMER, are you just ignorant? You must not pull
much, because jds get EVERY advantage available. Increased
deck height, duplex carbs, etc. The national sanctioning
bodies allow a sheet metal on g's etc...mm really gets
screwed, but I doubt you know enough to realize it.
 
Plain City was a nice sticky track all year. Not sure what youre talking about. If you pulled on any day other than sunday then your not talking bout osatpa youre talking bout someone else.
 

Nosir, it was at the Steam Show on Saturday and the track was not prepared one Iota..
No one could put any power to the ground..a real disappointment..
 
I'm just curious, what is it you are told you can't do to your Deeres? I believe some places won't let you use Duplex carbs (which should be legal), but everything else seems ok.

Oliver and MM appear the most restricted tractors in the national rules.
 
(quoted from post at 18:56:39 09/30/12) FACTORY FARMER, are you just ignorant? You must not pull
much, because jds get EVERY advantage available. Increased
deck height, duplex carbs, etc. The national sanctioning
bodies allow a sheet metal on g's etc...mm really gets
screwed, but I doubt you know enough to realize it.
Click to expand...

No my friend you are the ignorant one. Did I ever say I pull nationally? I have no desire to waste my time with that until my pro farm gets finished.
 
(quoted from post at 12:20:51 10/01/12) I'm just curious, what is it you are told you can't do to your Deeres? I believe some places won't let you use Duplex carbs (which should be legal), but everything else seems ok.

Oliver and MM appear the most restricted tractors in the national rules.
Click to expand...

From the few antique pulls that I have went to they complained about: RPMs when nobody else was running stock RPMs, appearance (chrome), no side shields which is fine but then they complain about the manifold and intake system that I made since they can see it. There's a couple of other little things as well.
 
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