Boring 8N cylinders?

[Anonymous-0]

I'm about to rebuild a 1949 8N. Talked to an engine shop in town, and have been advised it is best to pull the sleeves, bore out the cylinder, install oversize pistons and rings, and have at it. I'm not real comfy with it, since w/larger bore will change displacement, put more stress on the drive train. Any thoughts on this advice? Should I find another engine shop?

 

[souNdguy]

IMHO.. you can't bore that engine out ENOUGH to overstress the pto or axles. just not enough meat in the engine.

old trick used to be to pull the sleeves and run merc pistons in the parent bore.. when that wore out you had to over bore and use a repair sleeve to get back to oem.

I'd look for another machine shop.. and go back in with standard sleeves and whatnot.. that hotrod guy you are talking to will have you porting the exhaust and intake and shaving and relieving the head and a ton of other stuff she really don't need and that in the end don't help a hard breathing l head too much.

soundguy

 

[HCooke]

Unless the block won't hold new sleaves, why not replace 'em. It was designed that way for easier rebuilding. I'ld look for another shop.

 

[Anonymous-0]

Yeah, that was about what I was thinking. I may not be around the next time she needs rebuilt, but why mess up a good system with the sleeves. I'll shop around a little more for another engine shop. I think the reason he wanted to bore out the cylinder is that he doesn't want to hassle with the sleeve or doesn't have a tool to press them back in. Just speculating. Thanks for the input!

rob

 

[souNdguy]

I'd wager he wants to get into alot of custom work.. IE.. $$$$$

soundguy

 

[ZANE]

That machinest is full of it!

Don't let him trick you. Sounds to me like he doesn't know what he is talking about or how to go about doing it right. What he is preposing will ruin the engine. The block may not even be thick enough to bore it more. Those cylinder walls are not that thick.

Zane

 

[Devious]

Hi there. I went down to MY local Mom and Pop machine shop and asked if he could do a line bore and sleeve install onmy 4 cyl tractor block and he asked 9n 2n 8n etc. I said yes and it was evident that he knew some what ever about ford tractor motors. He said 100 plus per hole for the line bore and 60-80 per hole for the sleeve install. AND more if the thing had to be resized for a larger sleeve. So it looks like the worst might be 900-1000 bucks and I could go home and put the thing together. I declined and he said as I was going out the door that I could come back later as times were tough and the price might come down later if things did not pick up. Yeah right, just before I was ready to leave after he gets done with the block. I will be looking for another Mom machine shop. Pop aint doin too good. Devious

 

[teddy52food]

Your info is not correct. I worked in a shop & did a lot of Ford blocks. They came with thin sleeves. When those were wore out we pulled the sleeves & ran pistons in the block. When that wore out , the block was bored for the .090 heavy sleeves. A repair sleeve was only needed if the block had a crack or if someone honed it & the .090 sleeve fit too loose.

 

[Devious]

Hi Zane I read your reply about the boring of the block . So agreeing with you that the guy probably did not have his shoes on the right feet that day I need to ask Which sleeve material you prefer? Cast iron or steel? I am getting down to the point of getting a engine ready for rebuild and need to insert the right stuff into my brain so that I don t end up with what some have called Dufus decisions. Plus one other question, before I forget and mix them up, are the head Bolts all the same length? Any other advice you might think of will be appreciated. I am acquainted with the idea behind the boring and relining of the cylinders but not with any ways of screwing up taking sleeves out and replacing them etc. Thanks Devious in Humble (Houston) Tx.

 

[souNdguy]

the earlier units had the thin .040 sheet metal sleeves.. the later had the .090 ci sleeves.

both are available..

soundguy

 

[Fullthrottle]

I have overbored N blocks and installed later model automotive pistons. These were(cheater) engines for n only pulls. Don't do it if your not using it for play. The blocks are erratic at best as to how much they will bore without trouble. Im almost positive heating problems would be a factor if you use it to farm with and the performance gain is small even with dome type pistons. With that said, the answer is, We did it because we could. ;>)

 

[Dell (WA)]

Devious........the 0.090" castiron sleeve seals modern chrome plated rings BETTER. Last longer than the hardened 0.040" sheetmetal sleeves. 3-ring pistons are better than 4-ring pistons. Yeah, ya gotta rebore yer castiron block to fit the castiron sleeves, big deal. Automotive shops re-bore engines all the time. $20-hole? Remember, sleeves are an "interference fit".

Yeah, TOH makes and sells a very NICE sleeve removal and installation kit.

I recommend dry ice chips innna "spool" with 2-wooden discs and 12" all-thread rod. Will shrink the sleeve for eazy fit. Dry ice in yellow pages. Simple, eh? .......Dell

 

[John (TR)]

WHile you are at it you can dowel pin the caps. NOT

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 20:53:10 07/22/10) Talked to an engine shop in town, and have been advised it is best to pull the sleeves, bore out the cylinder, install oversize pistons and rings, and have at it. I'm not real comfy with it, since w/larger bore will change displacement, put more stress on the drive train. Any thoughts on this advice? Should I find another engine shop?

Yes. Unless there is more going on than you describe simply drive out the old sleeves, drive in new ones, install new OEM pistons and rings and your are good to go for $150 in parts. Any decent automotive machine shop can do it for a modest labor cost - if not I make and sell the tools to DIY for $100 or less. Not exactly rocket science - any decent shade tree mechanic can handle it - watch the demo videos on the website: [u:20fe81aa4f]Poke here for Sleeve Tools[/u:20fe81aa4f]

TOH
301.655.0631
[email protected]

 

[lha]

I like they they perform asymbled like ol' Henry made them,with the possible exception of .090 sleeves to replace tin cans.---lha

 

[mobydick]

When you pull out the 040 sleeves you do not bore, you will hone a little to use 87.5 pistons, thus called 090 over. The next plan can be to just install 040 wall sleeves if the holes are not too distorted and you can get 001 press. the next plan is to bore cylinders out to use 090 wall sleeves and install with 001 press fit and then after sleeves are installed, hone to fit pistons that come with the sleeve kit, for labor about $ 200.00
If you want good oil pressure you can get the mains line honed for about $ 130.00 Very seldom do you need line bore.

 

[Roger in Iowa]

Can someone post a picture of the outside of a thin wall steel sleeve, please, after it is removed from an engine.

I want to see the "bluing" from the heat.

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 20:19:51 07/23/10) Can someone post a picture of the outside of a thin wall steel sleeve, please, after it is removed from an engine.

I want to see the "bluing" from the heat.

What bluiing? In my limited experience I have never seen any. I'll post a picture of several when I get a chance.

TOH

 

[Hobo,NC]

I can not imagine anyone with haft a brain installing/going back with .040 sleeves,,, less they like trouble....

I forgot,,, I can not do it (skeered) are I do not know (to lazy)

 

[DollarBill]

[b:4197cbef8a][color=darkred:4197cbef8a]Any thoughts on this advice?[/color:4197cbef8a][/b:4197cbef8a]

As Hobo so eloquently stated - The .090 cast iron sleeves are the better option. That's why Ford did it the last couple years of production.

As to the machine shop advise - It sounds like he isn't familiar with N tractors. I would continue shopping - If there's a Model A club in your area, ask one of the members to recommend a machine shop.

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 21:20:33 07/23/10) I can not imagine anyone with haft a brain installing/going back with .040 sleeves,,, less they like trouble....

I forgot,,, I can not do it (skeered) are I do not know (to lazy)

You left out penny wise and pound foolish - probably reason #1 :? And of course there's always that "originality" that can't be seen....

TOH