AaronTM95
New User
- Location
- Mineral, VA
old
Well-known Member
- Location
- Camdenton Missouri
Yes good chance you now need new points and good chance you will also need a new coil since leaving the key on cause both to over heat and burn up or as some say you have let the smoke out of both
If it were mine, I would rotate until points closed (on flat of cam) then turn on ign and open & close points with insulated 'stick' or screwdriver and watch for spark at points opening/closing. If none, clean/scrape/file and try again. This may at least tell you if coil is still alive.
Yea a violation of tip # 38!
Your condenser is fine. Do what JMOR said to check the coil. Replace the points ( see tips 66, 67 & 68) then set the timing.
forums.yesterdaystractors.com
Your condenser is fine. Do what JMOR said to check the coil. Replace the points ( see tips 66, 67 & 68) then set the timing.
75 Tips for Ford N Owners
forums.yesterdaystractors.com
Hard to do on a front mount distributor. Easier to do on a bench with a multitester.
Brown David
Well-known Member
- Location
- New Brunswick Canada
According to the first picture he's right into it, should be no trouble to do as suggested I would think.
Made that way, like donuts....hole on both sides.
OP
OP
AaronTM95
New User
- Location
- Mineral, VA
Got everything put back together. Have power at the wire that attaches to the coil but still no spark at the wires. I’m guessing I put the distributor back together wrong and possibly have a ground inside?
Brown David
Well-known Member
- Location
- New Brunswick Canada
Did you look at his pictures?????!!
Brown David
Well-known Member
- Location
- New Brunswick Canada
Yes.
His do have holes. The ones I put in my old Fergie last summer have two completely flat contact surfaces.
I took your post to mean that you say all point sets have the corresponding "donut" holes.
I may have misinterpreted your post due to lack of clarity.
The first thing you need to check is for battery voltage at the coil. Yes, you need a meter for that, not a light. With the key on, you should see battery voltage ( 6.35 v, 12.65v) with the points open and about half that with the points closed. If you do not see either, the problem is between the battery and the coil, e.g., the resistor, ignition switch or a bad connection.
Assuming that the bushings & advance weights are ok (*see below), & that you have correct voltage to the coil , the most common reasons for no spark or a weak spark on the front distributor are below. Check each one carefully. Even if you find a problem, check all 10:
1. The insulator under the brass concave head screw & where the copper strip attaches. (it's fiber & will wear out; poke & prod w/ your meter leads to make sure it still works) If you need to replace the insulator, you have two alternatives. Cut up an old set of points to replace the metal strip and go to the hardware store for a .250 x 3/8 square nylon anchor nut to replace the insulator. Or the wiser alternative: buy the strip, insulator and brass screw from Tim Ponn for $12. ( 440-437-5572 phone orders only)
2. The pigtail at the bottom of the coil not making contact w/ the concave head brass screw inside the distributor. (With the coil on, the pigtail must firmly contact the brass screw. No contact = no spark) Check for continuity between the top of the coil and the pig tail; a 6 volt coil will be around 1 ohm & a 12 volt coil should be 2 to 3 ohms.
3. The copper strip is broken or grounded to the plate. (look very carefully for cracks & breaks) .
4. The distributor is not grounded to the block because of paint or grease acting as an insulator. Or the points plate is covered in oil.
5. The tab on the bottom of the coil not making contact w/ the brass button on the cap. (With the cap on, the tab must firmly contact the brass button. No contact = no spark.) Check for continuity between the top of the coil and the tab; you should see about 6k ohms.
6. A grounding issue inside the distributor: Incorrect positioning of the spring clip on the plate causing the pigtail to ground. (the open part of the clip goes between 7 & 9 o'clock on the plate. That puts the straight part of the clip opposite of the timing screw at 3 o'clock) or the condenser wire is grounding to the plate or side of the distributor.
7. Incorrect seating of the coil on the distributor due to a loose bail or no gasket.(the coil must not move at all; if it does, replace the gasket or bail. Or stick some cardboard under the bail).
8. Water/moisture inside the cap due to gasket failure or the absence of a gasket. (the cap AND coil have gaskets)
9. Dirty/corroded/burned/incorrectly gapped or misaligned points. I use only Wells, Blue Streak or Echlin brand points (* *see below). If you are using quality points and cannot get the gap to open to .015, chances are you need to replace the bushings. If the shaft has any sideways movement AT ALL, the bushings must be replaced. (*** see below) If the tractor has been sitting unused for a few months, it’s highly likely that the points are glazed. Dress them with brown paper or card stock. Do NOT use a file or sandpaper. That removes the thin metallic coating on the surface and reduces point life considerably. With the points closed, you should have continuity between them; high resistance means they are glazed.
10. Burned rotor, cracked/carbon tracked cap. Brass “dust” in the cap is a sure sign of bushing wear.
After you find the problem & re-check the point gap and set the timing, do a continuity check before you put the distributor back on the tractor. Before you start, make sure your meter/light works.
With the distributor still off the tractor, follow these steps:
1. Coil off, cap off, points open. One probe on the brass screw & the other on both sides of the open points. On the side closest to the cam, you should have continuity. Not on the other side! If you do, you will also have continuity everywhere because the points are grounded.
2. Coil off, cap off, points open. One probe on the brass screw & the other anywhere on the body of the distributor. You should have no continuity! Now, rotate the tang on the distributor....as the points open & close, you have continuity (closed) and lose it when they open.
3. Put the coil on the distributor, cap off, points open. One probe on the lead on the top of the coil, the other on the cam side of the open points. You should have continuity!
4. Coil on, cap off, points open. One probe on the lead on the top of the coil, the other anywhere on the body of the distributor. You should have no continuity!
75 Tips for Ford N Owners
forums.yesterdaystractors.com
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OP
AaronTM95
New User
- Location
- Mineral, VA
Incredible information. I got new wires for the spark plugs coming because one of them was frail as could be and broke when I was messing around. Also have a multimeter coming. Should be here tomorrow so the journey will continue!The first thing you need to check is for battery voltage at the coil. Yes, you need a meter for that, not a light. With the key on, you should see battery voltage ( 6.35 v, 12.65v) with the points open and about half that with the points closed. If you do not see either, the problem is between the battery and the coil, e.g., the resistor, ignition switch or a bad connection.
Assuming that the bushings & advance weights are ok (*see below), & that you have correct voltage to the coil , the most common reasons for no spark or a weak spark on the front distributor are below. Check each one carefully. Even if you find a problem, check all 10:
1. The insulator under the brass concave head screw & where the copper strip attaches. (it's fiber & will wear out; poke & prod w/ your meter leads to make sure it still works) If you need to replace the insulator, you have two alternatives. Cut up an old set of points to replace the metal strip and go to the hardware store for a .250 x 3/8 square nylon anchor nut to replace the insulator. Or the wiser alternative: buy the strip, insulator and brass screw from Tim Ponn for $12. ( 440-437-5572 phone orders only)
2. The pigtail at the bottom of the coil not making contact w/ the concave head brass screw inside the distributor. (With the coil on, the pigtail must firmly contact the brass screw. No contact = no spark) Check for continuity between the top of the coil and the pig tail; a 6 volt coil will be around 1 ohm & a 12 volt coil should be 2 to 3 ohms.
3. The copper strip is broken or grounded to the plate. (look very carefully for cracks & breaks) .
4. The distributor is not grounded to the block because of paint or grease acting as an insulator. Or the points plate is covered in oil.
5. The tab on the bottom of the coil not making contact w/ the brass button on the cap. (With the cap on, the tab must firmly contact the brass button. No contact = no spark.) Check for continuity between the top of the coil and the tab; you should see about 6k ohms.
6. A grounding issue inside the distributor: Incorrect positioning of the spring clip on the plate causing the pigtail to ground. (the open part of the clip goes between 7 & 9 o'clock on the plate. That puts the straight part of the clip opposite of the timing screw at 3 o'clock) or the condenser wire is grounding to the plate or side of the distributor.
7. Incorrect seating of the coil on the distributor due to a loose bail or no gasket.(the coil must not move at all; if it does, replace the gasket or bail. Or stick some cardboard under the bail).
8. Water/moisture inside the cap due to gasket failure or the absence of a gasket. (the cap AND coil have gaskets)
9. Dirty/corroded/burned/incorrectly gapped or misaligned points. I use only Wells, Blue Streak or Echlin brand points (* *see below). If you are using quality points and cannot get the gap to open to .015, chances are you need to replace the bushings. If the shaft has any sideways movement AT ALL, the bushings must be replaced. (*** see below) If the tractor has been sitting unused for a few months, it’s highly likely that the points are glazed. Dress them with brown paper or card stock. Do NOT use a file or sandpaper. That removes the thin metallic coating on the surface and reduces point life considerably. With the points closed, you should have continuity between them; high resistance means they are glazed.
10. Burned rotor, cracked/carbon tracked cap. Brass “dust” in the cap is a sure sign of bushing wear.
After you find the problem & re-check the point gap and set the timing, do a continuity check before you put the distributor back on the tractor. Before you start, make sure your meter/light works.
With the distributor still off the tractor, follow these steps:
1. Coil off, cap off, points open. One probe on the brass screw & the other on both sides of the open points. On the side closest to the cam, you should have continuity. Not on the other side! If you do, you will also have continuity everywhere because the points are grounded.
2. Coil off, cap off, points open. One probe on the brass screw & the other anywhere on the body of the distributor. You should have no continuity! Now, rotate the tang on the distributor....as the points open & close, you have continuity (closed) and lose it when they open.
3. Put the coil on the distributor, cap off, points open. One probe on the lead on the top of the coil, the other on the cam side of the open points. You should have continuity!
4. Coil on, cap off, points open. One probe on the lead on the top of the coil, the other anywhere on the body of the distributor. You should have no continuity!
75 Tips for Ford N Owners
old
Well-known Member
- Location
- Camdenton Missouri
You need true wire core plug wires not carbon core wires. As for meter most any auto parts store of farm and home stores have them for less then $50
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OP
AaronTM95
New User
- Location
- Mineral, VA
OP
OP
AaronTM95
New User
- Location
- Mineral, VA
Alright
so I got this distributor back off. When I’m checking for continuity from the brass screw to the body of the distributor I’m getting nothing with the points closed or open. I attached a picture of it incase you see something obvious that’s wrong.The first thing you need to check is for battery voltage at the coil. Yes, you need a meter for that, not a light. With the key on, you should see battery voltage ( 6.35 v, 12.65v) with the points open and about half that with the points closed. If you do not see either, the problem is between the battery and the coil, e.g., the resistor, ignition switch or a bad connection.
Assuming that the bushings & advance weights are ok (*see below), & that you have correct voltage to the coil , the most common reasons for no spark or a weak spark on the front distributor are below. Check each one carefully. Even if you find a problem, check all 10:
1. The insulator under the brass concave head screw & where the copper strip attaches. (it's fiber & will wear out; poke & prod w/ your meter leads to make sure it still works) If you need to replace the insulator, you have two alternatives. Cut up an old set of points to replace the metal strip and go to the hardware store for a .250 x 3/8 square nylon anchor nut to replace the insulator. Or the wiser alternative: buy the strip, insulator and brass screw from Tim Ponn for $12. ( 440-437-5572 phone orders only)
2. The pigtail at the bottom of the coil not making contact w/ the concave head brass screw inside the distributor. (With the coil on, the pigtail must firmly contact the brass screw. No contact = no spark) Check for continuity between the top of the coil and the pig tail; a 6 volt coil will be around 1 ohm & a 12 volt coil should be 2 to 3 ohms.
3. The copper strip is broken or grounded to the plate. (look very carefully for cracks & breaks) .
4. The distributor is not grounded to the block because of paint or grease acting as an insulator. Or the points plate is covered in oil.
5. The tab on the bottom of the coil not making contact w/ the brass button on the cap. (With the cap on, the tab must firmly contact the brass button. No contact = no spark.) Check for continuity between the top of the coil and the tab; you should see about 6k ohms.
6. A grounding issue inside the distributor: Incorrect positioning of the spring clip on the plate causing the pigtail to ground. (the open part of the clip goes between 7 & 9 o'clock on the plate. That puts the straight part of the clip opposite of the timing screw at 3 o'clock) or the condenser wire is grounding to the plate or side of the distributor.
7. Incorrect seating of the coil on the distributor due to a loose bail or no gasket.(the coil must not move at all; if it does, replace the gasket or bail. Or stick some cardboard under the bail).
8. Water/moisture inside the cap due to gasket failure or the absence of a gasket. (the cap AND coil have gaskets)
9. Dirty/corroded/burned/incorrectly gapped or misaligned points. I use only Wells, Blue Streak or Echlin brand points (* *see below). If you are using quality points and cannot get the gap to open to .015, chances are you need to replace the bushings. If the shaft has any sideways movement AT ALL, the bushings must be replaced. (*** see below) If the tractor has been sitting unused for a few months, it’s highly likely that the points are glazed. Dress them with brown paper or card stock. Do NOT use a file or sandpaper. That removes the thin metallic coating on the surface and reduces point life considerably. With the points closed, you should have continuity between them; high resistance means they are glazed.
10. Burned rotor, cracked/carbon tracked cap. Brass “dust” in the cap is a sure sign of bushing wear.
After you find the problem & re-check the point gap and set the timing, do a continuity check before you put the distributor back on the tractor. Before you start, make sure your meter/light works.
With the distributor still off the tractor, follow these steps:
1. Coil off, cap off, points open. One probe on the brass screw & the other on both sides of the open points. On the side closest to the cam, you should have continuity. Not on the other side! If you do, you will also have continuity everywhere because the points are grounded.
2. Coil off, cap off, points open. One probe on the brass screw & the other anywhere on the body of the distributor. You should have no continuity! Now, rotate the tang on the distributor....as the points open & close, you have continuity (closed) and lose it when they open.
3. Put the coil on the distributor, cap off, points open. One probe on the lead on the top of the coil, the other on the cam side of the open points. You should have continuity!
4. Coil on, cap off, points open. One probe on the lead on the top of the coil, the other anywhere on the body of the distributor. You should have no continuity!
75 Tips for Ford N Owners
Attachments
The copper strap "A" appears to be missing, therefore no connection from brass screw ( G ) to points (F ).
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