Ford 3600 Steering issues

[Ipowell]

Hello

I have a Ford 3600 and have been figuring out the steering issues.

The tractor has a lag in the steering which I do believe is due to the nut not being tight enough in the column.
There is also a play in the steering which I think is due to the tie rod ends but the other issue is the steering will unscrew up and down...how do you fix that without removing the whole steering box?

Thanks Ian

 

[Sean in PA]

Is it manual steering or power assist?

 

[Ipowell]

Is it manual steering or power assist?

Power assist

 

[Hobo,NC]

Hello

I have a Ford 3600 and have been figuring out the steering issues.

The tractor has a lag in the steering which I do believe is due to the nut not being tight enough in the column.
There is also a play in the steering which I think is due to the tie rod ends but the other issue is the steering will unscrew up and down...how do you fix that without removing the whole steering box?

Thanks Ian

You don't have to take the box completely off but by the time you get to the nut you are all but there. After I rebuilt one, I would not have a problem rebuilding it all.

 

[Ipowell]

You don't have to take the box completely off but by the time you get to the nut you are all but there. After I rebuilt one, I would not have a problem rebuilding it all.

So what do I have to do to fix it from unscrewing?

 

[Keith Williams]

So what do I have to do to fix it from unscrewing?

You have to tighten the nut inside the assembly, then stake it in place.

BUT, the question you need to find the answer to is WHY is the nut LOOSE!

If you are lucky, the nut just loosened up because it was not staked correctly. I would not hold much hope that that is it.

Usually one of the bearings has gone bad because of lack of lubrication. Lack of lubrication because a seal went bad.
There was a discussion in the recent past that described this process.

 

[Ipowell]

You have to tighten the nut inside the assembly, then stake it in place.

BUT, the question you need to find the answer to is WHY is the nut LOOSE!

If you are lucky, the nut just loosened up because it was not staked correctly. I would not hold much hope that that is it.

Usually one of the bearings has gone bad because of lack of lubrication. Lack of lubrication because a seal went bad.
There was a discussion in the recent past that described this process.

Is this nut? (Photo)
And I have a video of it but can upload it here it won't let me.

 

[Sean in PA]

Yes, that's the nut. It needs to be tightened a certain amount, then backed off a fraction of a turn, and then it needs to be staked in place so it won't move. I don't have the manual near me so I can't give the specifics for the tightening and backing off, but you should get a Service Manual if you don't already have one. Once it is done correctly, the steering wheel will move up slightly when it is turned in one direction, barely enough to notice, and down the same amount when you turn it in the other direction. It is that slight up-and-down movement that actuates the control valve.

You can't upload videos directly to this site like you can with pictures. You need to upload them to another video hosting site like Youtube, and then embed a link to it in your post here.

 

[Ipowell]

Yes, that's the nut. It needs to be tightened a certain amount, then backed off a fraction of a turn, and then it needs to be staked in place so it won't move. I don't have the manual near me so I can't give the specifics for the tightening and backing off, but you should get a Service Manual if you don't already have one. Once it is done correctly, the steering wheel will move up slightly when it is turned in one direction, barely enough to notice, and down the same amount when you turn it in the other direction. It is that slight up-and-down movement that actuates the control valve.

You can't upload videos directly to this site like you can with pictures. You need to upload them to another video hosting site like Youtube, and then embed a link to it in your post here.

Ihave been reading the shop manual and I think I have a game plan but here is The video

 

[Hobo,NC]

Is this nut? (Photo)
And I have a video of it but can upload it here it won't let me.

Under that nut is a Disc spring: Belleville spring washer it could have broken. Up and down movement of the steering shaft is the nature of the beast. When it’s set correctly the shaft and spool will move while turning 3/16". It does not matter how much you tighten that nut the spool is going to float it’s the nature of the beast.

I spent quite a bit of time analyzing how the factor set that nut and washer up. When the nut contacts the washer it has one more turn in it to bottom out. From the factory a haft turn in bottoms the mut are a haft turn out gets you just the where the nut contacts that washer. The nut has 6 flats turn it 3 flats is a haft turn of the nut. I run the nut to where it just contacts the spring washer at that point you cannot turn the washer with just light pressure of a finger. I turn the nut in 3 flats and nail it there.

This is contrary to what some say if you do this my way you will not have any play in activating the P.S. it will move at the touch of a finger. This will also eliminate some of the inherent slop in the system.

I would advise when you go into it have all the seals, gaskets, O-rings, nut and new washer in hand. They also make a speedy sleeve kit if the sealing surface is worn to repair that. I personally think a speedy sleeve is kicking the can down the road they are garbage. There is no reason not to remove the spool and check the valves and springs. It’s a simple set up : ).

​

 

[Hobo,NC]

So what do I have to do to fix it from unscrewing?

It has a privision to stake it you will see when you get there.

 

[Ipowell]

Under that nut is a Disc spring: Belleville spring washer it could have broken. Up and down movement of the steering shaft is the nature of the beast. When it’s set correctly the shaft and spool will move while turning 3/16". It does not matter how much you tighten that nut the spool is going to float it’s the nature of the beast.

I spent quite a bit of time analyzing how the factor set that nut and washer up. When the nut contacts the washer it has one more turn in it to bottom out. From the factory a haft turn in bottoms the mut are a haft turn out gets you just the where the nut contacts that washer. The nut has 6 flats turn it 3 flats is a haft turn of the nut. I run the nut to where it just contacts the spring washer at that point you cannot turn the washer with just light pressure of a finger. I turn the nut in 3 flats and nail it there.

This is contrary to what some say if you do this my way you will not have any play in activating the P.S. it will move at the touch of a finger. This will also eliminate some of the inherent slop in the system.

I would advise when you go into it have all the seals, gaskets, O-rings, nut and new washer in hand. They also make a speedy sleeve kit if the sealing surface is worn to repair that. I personally think a speedy sleeve is kicking the can down the road they are garbage. There is no reason not to remove the spool and check the valves and springs. It’s a simple set up : ).

​

Ok perfect I have my shop manual for the tractor and it says " Tighten nut so all end play is removed. then loosen nut 1/6-turn and stake nut to locating slot in steering shaft as shown in Fig 10. Complete remainder of assembly by reversing disassembly procedure." So im going to order seals, the spring washer and new nut but how do you stake it?

 

[Hobo,NC]

Ok perfect I have my shop manual for the tractor and it says " Tighten nut so all end play is removed. then loosen nut 1/6-turn and stake nut to locating slot in steering shaft as shown in Fig 10. Complete remainder of assembly by reversing disassembly procedure." So im going to order seals, the spring washer and new nut but how do you stake it?

Ok perfect I have my shop manual for the tractor and it says " Tighten nut so all end play is removed. then loosen nut 1/6-turn and stake nut to locating slot in steering shaft as shown in Fig 10. Complete remainder of assembly by reversing disassembly procedure." So im going to order seals, the spring washer and new nut but how do you stake it?

Tighten nut so all end play is removed.



Thays the confusing part they are talking about end play shaft to spool bearings. It has an upper and lower bearing the spool is sandwiched between them. I will look for pix tomorrow.

To give you an idea on staking you can use tools on hand.

 

[Hobo,NC]

Ihave been reading the shop manual and I think I have a game plan but here is The video

The one I got Deep into did the exact same thing I found a steering sector sticking in the cap that retains it. Anything that’s jammed up below the spool valve will cause the shaft to have excessive up down moment it’s the nature of the beast. The steering shaft floats with the upper part (spool) noting retains it below the spool “nuttin”. Your issue could be in the steering box are external linkage.

It’s easy to say nut are washer issue you would have to have it in your hands to understand how its functions.

 

[Hobo,NC]

Tighten nut so all end play is removed.



Thays the confusing part they are talking about end play shaft to spool bearings. It has an upper and lower bearing the spool is sandwiched between them. I will look for pix tomorrow.

To give you an idea on staking you can use tools on hand.

This is what you are setting up with the nut. You can run that nut all the way down the spool is still going to float. This is the challenge you will never get the slack out of the steering shaft it’s the nature of the beast. You are setting up these bearings in relation to the spool.

If you run the nut down till all slack is taken out of the bearing then back it off 1/16 turn you will add extra sloop and have a little excessive free play in the steering wheel. If that’s your cup of tea cool follow the crowd, if not try it my way it will be extremely responsive: ).

 

[Ipowell]

The one I got Deep into did the exact same thing I found a steering sector sticking in the cap that retains it. Anything that’s jammed up below the spool valve will cause the shaft to have excessive up down moment it’s the nature of the beast. The steering shaft floats with the upper part (spool) noting retains it below the spool “nuttin”. Your issue could be in the steering box are external linkage.

It’s easy to say nut are washer issue you would have to have it in your hands to understand how its functions.

So I fixed it up but for some reason, I'm having a pressure issue...all the lines are correct but it has been pushing fluid out the top of the steering column...i changed the seals and stuff but I don't know what is the cause any ideas?

 

[Sean in PA]

So I fixed it up but for some reason, I'm having a pressure issue...all the lines are correct but it has been pushing fluid out the top of the steering column...i changed the seals and stuff but I don't know what is the cause any ideas?

How does it steer? Does the power assist actually assist it, or does it steer like it's got manual steering? If you staked the nut when it was too tight, then the control valve can't do it's job because the column isn't moving up and down enough, and that could possibly be contributing to an over pressure situation that is causing the seal to leak.

 

[Ipowell]

How does it steer? Does the power assist actually assist it, or does it steer like it's got manual steering? If you staked the nut when it was too tight, then the control valve can't do it's job because the column isn't moving up and down enough, and that could possibly be contributing to an over pressure situation that is causing the seal to leak.

i Staked it to Hobo's recommendation but after a long run (about an hour) it would start pouring oil out the top and i did steer like a power assist. I have since chained the seals in the column but i have also tightened the nut to the book so we will see what happens. I'm not sure why the thing is over-pressuring only thing i can think is the lines are clogged?

 

[Hobo,NC]

How does it steer? Does the power assist actually assist it, or does it steer like it's got manual steering? If you staked the nut when it was too tight, then the control valve can't do it's job because the column isn't moving up and down enough, and that could possibly be contributing to an over pressure situation that is causing the seal to leak.

The steering shaft is going to move the control valve even if you run that nut all the way down.

 

[RGmechanic]

Under that nut is a Disc spring: Belleville spring washer it could have broken. Up and down movement of the steering shaft is the nature of the beast. When it’s set correctly the shaft and spool will move while turning 3/16". It does not matter how much you tighten that nut the spool is going to float it’s the nature of the beast.

I spent quite a bit of time analyzing how the factor set that nut and washer up. When the nut contacts the washer it has one more turn in it to bottom out. From the factory a haft turn in bottoms the mut are a haft turn out gets you just the where the nut contacts that washer. The nut has 6 flats turn it 3 flats is a haft turn of the nut. I run the nut to where it just contacts the spring washer at that point you cannot turn the washer with just light pressure of a finger. I turn the nut in 3 flats and nail it there.

This is contrary to what some say if you do this my way you will not have any play in activating the P.S. it will move at the touch of a finger. This will also eliminate some of the inherent slop in the system.

I would advise when you go into it have all the seals, gaskets, O-rings, nut and new washer in hand. They also make a speedy sleeve kit if the sealing surface is worn to repair that. I personally think a speedy sleeve is kicking the can down the road they are garbage. There is no reason not to remove the spool and check the valves and springs. It’s a simple set up :

I’m currently installing a new steering valve on a 2600, and have been partially re-assembling to test it. Should I be staking the nut before my test runs? (Since I’m here, obviously tests are not going well…) Currently, I have the rod ends of the pistons disconnected, so they move independently from the mechanical steering. When turning left, the pistons don’t start to move until I’m held against the turn-stop on the king pins. Pistons stop moving as they should when I release the steering wheel. I have a gauge set up in line between the pump and valve. Pressures are within spec found in the manual. But as soon as I turn the wheel a slight amount to the right, pistons will go all the way to full extension for a right turn with pressure above 1000psi. Both bearings looked to be in good shape so they were not replaced. Does this sound like issues with how tight the nut is?