How to trouble shoot starter?

[Dan(nyc)]

I just got a Ford 860 and while they were trying to jump the tractor they (the seller), seemed to kill a component. Probably either the starter or the solenoid I would guess. The Tractor is a 12 volt conversion. Now when you push the starter button nothing, not evan a click (battery is not dead). With a tow will start as soon as you drop the clutch. What would you all recommend looking at?

Thank you all in advance!
Dan --nyc

 

[souNdguy]

What would i look at? well both of them.

The thumb start button simply grounds the solenoid. Make sure it does. If it does, and the solenoid don't kick in.. but you can jumper around it and make the starter spin.. you know to replace the solenoid.

Soundguy

 

[Dan(nyc)]

O.k. I will do that. Just for my knowledge what does a solenoid do? And can I jumper from one big post to the other to try that? The current solenoid it the 4 post variety. Dan -- nyc

 

[Anonymous-0]

Dan,

You can definitely short around the solenoid by touching both of the big connectors on the solenoid. When you do so, the starter motor should immediately spin. If it does, you know that the starter motor is good. If it doesn't you know that starter motor might be bad, but then again, maybe not. It could be bad connections at the battery, solenoid, or starter.

Three BIG precautions:

1. If the tractor is in gear it will immediately leap forward or back depending on whether the tractor is in a forward or a reverse gear. Insure that it out of gear.

2. If the tractor is in gear and the ignition switch is turned on, the tractor will start and run OVER YOU. Insure that it is out of gear.

3. You will draw a pretty good arc when you touch the two terminals together so be prepared for it.

The solenoid is an enclosed electro-magnet that gets sucked into a chamber inside the solenoid. When it gets sucked in, the armature closes contacts inside the solenoid that are attached to the two big posts on the solenoid, thus completing the circuit from the battery to the starter motor.

Good luck - be safe. Did I mention how important it is to make sure that the tractor is not in gear when you do this?

Tom in TN

 

[john_Bud]

Make sure the thumb switch is connected and going down all the way. If it is not in N, you can't get it to go down all the way. A safety feature.

On conversions, many have real bone head wiring. Could be just that simple.

jb

 

[Dan(nyc)]

So the Solenoid is normally open between the two large posts until the starter grounds out one of the smaller posts then the solenoid is a circuit between the posts is what I am getting Soundguy? Thanks I'll check that Saturday. Dan --nyc

 

[souNdguy]

OEM solenoid was 3 posts.. 2 bigguns.. and one little one. The 2 bigguns.. one went to battery, and the other went to starter. ( make sure to get the right wire onthe right side or the solenoid won't work.).. the little post went to the starter button... which is just a ground. Inside the solenoid, one side of the coil is hooked to the big wire that goes to the battery.. that is where it picks it's power up from... the user doesn't get to see that wire.. and the other side of the coil that needs ground to make the coil energize, is that one that goes to the starter button.

Now.. id someone has retrofit a 4 post eolenoid on there.. all bets are off. there are 2 styles of 4 post solenoids. The common type is a 'bypass' style.. and won't work with the big thumb button.. the other style is an 'isolated base' type, and can be made to work like the oem 3 terminal, by simply tieing one of the smll terminals to the battery side big lug, and then the other small terminal to the grounding starter button. Many 12v converters disable the big thumb button and put in a bypass style 4 post solenoid so they can start with a key.. thinking they are cool or something.. when in reality.. they have just bypassed an important safety device.

post back if you need more help.

Soundguy

 

[Dan(nyc)]

It is a 4 post with a 12 volt conversion (1 wire Alternator) The wiring and starter problem is the first hurdle on this new to me tractor. I am trying to post a photo hope it works. Now I realize that the guy trying to jump it did touch the small posts of the solenoid while trying to get it to start. So would this have fried it?
Thank you for sharing and patience! Dan --nyc

photo of solenoid

 

[souNdguy]

OK.. in this Photo, it APPEARS to be a 4 post iso type solenoid. I see a short wire coming from the battery side to one small post.. thent he other small post presumably goes to your thumb switch.. right? If so, and it used to work.. then that is correct. now.. if the prev owner jumped power over to that wire going to your thumb switch, he may have burnt it up. A way to check would be to take the wire off the thumb switch and ground it, and see if the starter solenoid kicks in.. Make sure tractor is in neutral..e tc.

if that don't work, mark the wires on the solenoid, and pull the wires off the small posts. make sure you have power at the bit bat post on one side... now, use a jumper wire and jumper power to one of the small posts? anything if not.. jump power to the other small post? anything? if not.. it is either an iso base style.. or it is a BAD bypass style. Next.. jumper power to one small post.. and ground the other small post.. anything? if no.. then the solenoid is bad... If yes, then the wire running to your thumb switch is bad.. or the thumb switch itself is bad. ( thank prev owner! )

do yourself a favor.. if you have to repalce the solenoid.. get the proper 3 terminal one... makes hookup EZ..

post back if ya need more help.. we will get you going...

Soundguy