June 29, 95 mph winds

[Geo-TH,In]

I wonder if using a tractor on a generator is cheaper to operate?

We were on backup power for 5 days.
A friend asked how much gas did you use?
We ran the little 3500 watt champion 24/7 minus the time to cool off and gas up.
We used 5 gallons a day.

What size generator do you use and how much fuel did you use?

 

[r.w.b.]

thats pretty cheep,depending on size but 75 hp tractor on generator it can handle it will burn as much fuel as it does plowing all day

 

[rmcky]

In 2009 ice storm we used a Honda 3500 w generator about 13 hours a day for 11 days. It used 2 gal per day. Oil changes are a concern for extended usage. Gas usage may also be somewhat dependent on load.

 

[John T]

My Onan 4KW gas powered gensets have used around One Gallon per hour WHEN UNDER HEAVY LOAD.....My Cummins Onan 2.8 KW have used maybe Three Quarts per hour UNDER HEAVY LOAD. I like the later model Inverter Gensets versus the older non inverter, and I liked the older two cylinder 1800 RPM (much quieter) versus the later screaming 3600 RPM one cylinder similar power gensets.

I miss our past resident genset expert Billy Shafer.

John T

 

[john in la]

My 7500w champion is the only one I run 24/7. I go through 100 gallons of gasoline a week and that doesnt include the 5000w generator I have hooked to my well pump that we only use when we need water.

No way I could last a direct hit from a big storm running on propane.

Never really calculated how much my diesel tractor would burn running 24/7 for a week.

 

[Hobo,NC]

Hurricane Fran 1996 we were out power 11 days. I used the gen on my camper a 2500 Onan, the best I remember 32 gal. The good and bad I shuffled it from my house to Mom's till I could get my hands on another gen. The beauty of the camper was a large tank and it was mobile. That Onan was impressive for it size and quite.

I now have a 8K set up for NG so don't worry about fuel. I have another 8K it burns .5 gal a hr. are my best guess. Before I converted to NG I would stock up 100 gal. of fuel for a predicted end of world hurricane.

I knew I would be the go to man in the hood for fuel so I hoped to keep enoufh I would not run out. Wink Wink. Normally if we get a threat of a hurricane towards the end of summer and it does not happen its a P.I.T.A. to handle and burn up an extra 100 gal of GAS. If you stock up on fuel get it early cuzz the local stations will put a limit on how much you can buy at one time. Normally the day before the event cash only so there goes your rewards points : (.

 

[moresmoke]

A genset will always be more efficient than a tractor running a portable generator. Direct drive no gearing losses. That said, cost to own and run might be cheaper on a bigger unit if you need the capacity. Mostly if the tractor earns its keep doing other jobs, it can lend a hand for emergency use for less cost than a dedicated power unit.

I use a Miller welder for backup power. Convenient, sits out of the way in my shop, hookup is wired in with a transfer switch. I am in the process of converting it to dual fuel so I can run it off of the 500 gal LP tank in the yard. Oh and it welds too whenever I need it.

 

[caterpillar guy]

It has been a few years since we used dad's generator on power use for him and we have used from a 674 to the 856 on it. I think the last time we used the 856 it used about 20-40 gallon on a 3or4 day steady run. that is a 100HP tractor the 674 is about the same amount or a bit less with 60 HP probably about a tank for the 3or 4 day run. No heavy load on them any time just the house with a 25KW unit.

 

[Jimmydog]

I have an 8K Gernerac that runs when there isn't enough sunshine. It doesn't run fully loaded just powers the house and chargers. Uses about 1/2-3/4 gallon per hour. It feeds my 1100 amp hour battery bank at 110 amps. I usually just run it an hour or hour and a half, and that will usually last until the next day. Shows how little electricity we really use. If it isn't sunny the next day, run it again. If I remember correctly, the solar panels peak output at 96 amps so two sunny days and the battery bank is back to being topped off.

Even a small battery bank, say 4 or 6, 6-volt deep cycle batteries and a modest sized invertor will provide a fair amount of buffering to keep from having to run your generator nonstop. You'll still have to run a generator for the big draw appliances, but for lights, television, computer, etc. you can run on the batteries. Another thing with a small battery bank, is you could leave it charging from the utility grid, and then when the power goes out it will run a few hours before requiring charging and in a brief outage you may not even have to start your generator. Also, your batteries degrade from charge discharge cycles, if they just sit there only getting used once or twice a year (unlike mine) then they'll likely last ten years maybe more. Mine undergo quite a bit of cycling and I get between 8-10 years out of them.

I no longer loan out my back-up generators because they come back broken.

 

[Wisconsin Ron]

They lean towards what the tractor burns per hour depending on load. Usually here if an issue arise and generator comes out we burn 4.5 to 5 gal diesel per hour with ih 966 pulling a 60kw katolight. Years ago ran a 25kw agri power at 3 gal per hour but outgrew it plus it had poor surge performance. Got a small kubota compact tractor here that seems to run pretty cheap I always wonder how it would perform on small pto generator myself. I kinda doubt pto ones run cheaper. Especially in smaller rigs. I know my brother just bought a champion for his camper and went to a music festival and ran it non stop from Wednesday til Sunday morning on 100lb propane bottle and didn't run out. He has yet to dump gasoline in it. I tell him he should at least try it on gasoline just to make sure it works both ways while under warranty. Sorry if my ramblings don't help answer your question.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

I ran 2 3500 watt champions, one at each location for 0.2 gal/hr.
One place was 2 refrigerators, 1 well pump, toasters, hot plate, coffee pot, not all at the same time, lamps and fans. I found an old 120vac AC window unit I think I might be able to use too. I'll unplug the well when using it. Shut off the AC when I plug in the well.
My other champion did 2 refrigs, 1 freezer, lamps and fans. I think if I turned everything off and started the pump without any water pressure the generator could handle it.

.2 gal per hour or 5 gallons of gas per day, is running on fumes.

I don't think too many generators can say that.

 

[Dave G9N]

WGen5300DFcv - Dual Fuel with CO Sensor
Fuel used so far none. Had it almost a year.

While this is not helpful, I am going to make the point that running a generator with a much larger engine than needed will burn a lot more gas than a smaller engine for the same power.

You need a generator that is large enough for your needs, but excess capacity is expensive. I sized the generator to keep enough things running, but not as many as I would like. Running the AC or electric oven is out of the question for instance. I don't get so much hot weather here, and have gas heat because we do get cold. I got dual fuel because propane doesn't go bad like gasoline or diesel, and you don't have to drain the tank and carb every time you use it. For a little used backup, I paid more upfront to avoid a lot of maintenance down the line. Propane is more expensive, but gas is an option if I need to run for a long time.

You can estimate run time at full load by using the average efficiency of engines in general. For each 10 hp a gas engine will burn about 0.81 gallons per hour and a diesel will burn about 0.57 gph. At lower loads, the engine is less efficient, so the run time at half load is less than twice the full load run time. I calculated fuel consumption per horsepower hour for the advertised run times and they did show that the efficiency drops at lower loads. What it boils down to is that if you size your generator much larger than needed for the actual load, you fuel consumption will be high for the amount of power used.

Based on my generator's 5300 watts, the 274cc engine is running 7.1 hp, which assumes a 100% efficient generator. I calculated the fuel consumption for this generator under full load without correcting for the generator efficiency, which I don't know. It is less than 8 hours and the engine is putting out more than 7 hp. The point is that the advertised run times do show that the fuel consumption is higher under partial loads than it should be based on the power output alone.

Advertised fuel consumption
[code:1:371756c833]Fuel Tank Capacity 4.7 gal. (18 L)
Gasoline Run Time @ 25% 14.5 hrs
Gasoline Run Time @ 50% 11 hrs.
Propane Run Time @ 50% 9 hrs.
[/code:1:371756c833]

Theoretical
[code:1:371756c833]gas full load 8.1 hr 0.5 lb/hp hr
gas at 50% 11 hr 0.74 lb/hp hr
gas at 25% 14.5 hr 1.1 lb/hp hr
[/code:1:371756c833]
So that's what the code button does. Never tried it before. Without using 'code' the tabs were single spaces.[/code]

 

[John T]

I don't think too many generators can say that.

SORRY I HAVE NO IDEA of that ?? some brands may be better some brands worse ?? Ive never seen any test of different brands of gensets versus their fuel efficiency, if Billy Shafer were living he may have had some test data of Champions versus several different brands. Of course, how much fuel they burn depends on the electrical load WELL DUH An air compressor or HVAC a fridge or pump etc etc cycles and idles at times or powers heavy or lighter loads at times, and fuel use depends on when and how often they are compressing or pumping or idling under what load.

Ive owned, been around and had experience with several different brands, based on use experience and observation Honda Yamaha Onan and Cummins Onan and Kohler are good quality units. Of course an Inverter Generator can be more efficient than non inverter because if the electrical load is lighter they idle down and dont have to run at full constant high RPM. But if not needed a cheaper non inverter is fine and does the job well, maybe just use more gas if the load varies. To each their own subject to THEIR needs and budget, both are fine

John T

 

[Dave G9N]

(reply to post at 14:01:33 07/23/23)

PostPosted: Sun Jul 23, 2023 1:01 pm Post subject: Re: June 29, 95 mph winds
I don't think too many generators can say that.

SORRY I HAVE NO IDEA of that ??
WELL DUH

hat was what is called an example. Examples are used to illustrate concepts.

There are many generators that give run time at several loads. The only reason I chose 100% efficiency was to get a ballpark number for the horsepower of the engine, which was not provided. Watts/750 = hp. I did say that the actual number would be different.

The engine does what engines do, and it was just an example that I had numbers for. Better quality engines just keep doing it longer and with fewer problems. Not the point here.

If you look at Nebraska Tractor Test Lab Test 443: Ford 8N you will see that an 8N putting our 2 hp consumes 2.928 gallons per horsepower hour, at 6.33 hp it is down to 1.161 gal/hp hr and at 24.93 it is down to 0.546 gal/hp hr. That is a low compression flathead, which is inherently less efficient than a high compression overhead valve engine, which gets all the way down to 0.5 gal/hp hr.

The mathematical relationship between run time and efficiency tells you that for any given load, a more efficiently operating engine will consume less fuel. Sizing the source to the load saves fuel.

 

[rick n ohio]

I have a Miller bobcat welder that has a 11000 watt generator. It uses a gallon of gas an hour running the whole house that includes furnace or air-conditioner.

 

[Butch(OH)]

My stand by set for the last 15 years is a 15KW belt drive head powered by a 23HP single cylinder diesel engine running 1500RPM. We have about 10KW available. Our power was out for nearly a week June 2022 and we lived as normal running the generator. A/C on and everything. The set ran 24/7 except twice a day shut down to check the oil. Over that week I calculated the fuel usage at 1.2 quarts per hour. My neghbor has a 10KW twin cylinder has burner and he went through almost 1 1/2 gallons per hour.

 

[Geo-TH,In]

My neighbor lived in his camper during our 6 day
power outage.
Nice to have a backup living quarter.