LIVE POWER TAKE OFF

[ZANE]

I posted a couple of weeks ago about experimenting with fabricating a live power take off for the Ford tractors that didn't come with it. I was thinking of fabricating a sort of tractor jack set up so that the lift could be used to raise the rear wheels when a baler etc was getting choked up so the PTO could remain turning while the wheels just spun the air and the ground speed stopped till the clogg could clear.

I got some negative comments from the Peanut gallery.

I have been reading a stack of Old Tractor magaxines from the UK for the past few weeks that my old friend Danny Doyle who is an expatriot of Ireland sent me when his wife made him clean out the house.

Turns out that my idea is not a half cocked as some thought. This device was made and used on the TO 35 Fergusons in the mid fifties. It was commonly called the peeing dog live PTO. It used only one wheel that was activated by the lift to do just what I had suggested and worked great. It raised the right rear wheel to stop the forward movement of the tractor.

So There!!! :O)

Zane

 

[Anonymous-0]

Just because it was done in years past does not mean it was or is a good idea.

Years ago they believed slaves made excellent farm implements but we know better now dont we?

 

[Elvin Frank]

Zane,
I don't say a whole bunch on here but I will say this, I like your idea, I think others like you ideas and if someone thinks its a bad idea they don't have to buy it or like it. Thanks for all you knowledge you share and have a Merry Christmas.

 

[Fleeter]

We used to put a chain on one tire and leave the other tire unchained when blowing snow with a trans drive PTO tractor..
The unchained tire would spin when the the tractor hit a drift. You would nudge it along by riding the unchained tire brake. The tires were usually on ice or hard packed snow so tire wear didn't seem to be a problem.
I had also thought about putting a clutch pack on a rear axle similar to a crawler steering clutch pack that would allow the hub to free wheel when depressed. In the end it was faster and easier to buy a live PTO machine.

 

[karl f]

this link to a post mentions a TSC product that raises the wheel: http://ytforums.ytmag.com/viewtopic.php?t=502275

With the Live Thang, you could combine the concept of Dual Power with a Dearborn Live PTO somehow and have some fun It would operate similar to that power director thing on the orange machines, but I don't know if you would be able to slip your version.

karl f
prior post about aerial live pto

 

[oldtanker]

(quoted from post at 17:45:39 12/19/11) I posted a couple of weeks ago about experimenting with fabricating a live power take off for the Ford tractors that didn't come with it. I was thinking of fabricating a sort of tractor jack set up so that the lift could be used to raise the rear wheels when a baler etc was getting choked up so the PTO could remain turning while the wheels just spun the air and the ground speed stopped till the clogg could clear.

I got some negative comments from the Peanut gallery.

I have been reading a stack of Old Tractor magaxines from the UK for the past few weeks that my old friend Danny Doyle who is an expatriot of Ireland sent me when his wife made him clean out the house.

Turns out that my idea is not a half cocked as some thought. This device was made and used on the TO 35 Fergusons in the mid fifties. It was commonly called the peeing dog live PTO. It used only one wheel that was activated by the lift to do just what I had suggested and worked great. It raised the right rear wheel to stop the forward movement of the tractor.

So There!!! :O)

Zane

Zane I don't think I commented on it but here are my thoughts about the Ferggie system.....there was a rear lift hook up that relied on a spring jaw affair to hook into the draw bar that could and would fail. If you were plowing with it you wound up with a plow in the middle of your back. It was a man killer. I was made by Allis Chalmers and called the "snap coupler system". Sure it was designed by mechanical engineers but that didn't make it a good idea. I really am not comfortable with setting in the seat of a tractor and lifting one or both rear wheels off the gound to stop forward motion. Down or up hill on a wet or slippery surface could be an issue with something as heavy as a baler on behind and lifting only one on a side hill could be a disaster. Also could be a liability issue for a manufacturer. Heck people flip tractors over on themselves just cause they don't know what they are doing.

Rick

 

[Charles Krammin]

My idea of a live PTO would be a driveshaft under or along the bottom of the trctorwith a clutch in it . Front would be driven by pulley from front crankshaft. Rear would be hooked and supported by external PTO shaft. A chain (or belt) to a pto shaft at the standard ASE height, would also make it like all other tractors. I'd build it , but got too many other projects.
Charles Krammin SW MI

 

[souNdguy]

from a sheerly safety standpoint.. I think a mechanical pinion clutch makes a good semi- live pto option.. some tractors had a hand and foot clutch.. this would be a similar setup.

less feeding than the slaves too..

 

[ZANE]

I gave up the idea of making the wheel lift live PTO already so you sissies can feel good about that. Better not go out in that automobile today either. I hear they kill and maim more people than tractors!!!! Scary ain't it????

Just thought it was interesting that my idea had been invented about 50 years ago.

I know how dangerous mechanical things are since I've been hammering and twisting bolts and nuts on them for over 60 years.

I never intended to let my five year neighbor's kids use it. If I was still pulling a haybaler with an 8N I would actually make and use one.

You know they make thousands of pull behind discs for the old tractors and there is no telling how many people were killed and injured with those things when you made too sharp a turn with one and it climbed up the rear wheel and over the driver. Crunch!
Zane

 

[Sycamorecreek]

(quoted from post at 10:00:25 12/20/11) I gave up the idea of making the wheel lift live PTO already so you sissies can feel good about that. Better not go out in that automobile today either. I hear they kill and maim more people than tractors!!!! Scary ain't it????

Just thought it was interesting that my idea had been invented about 50 years ago.

I know how dangerous mechanical things are since I've been hammering and twisting bolts and nuts on them for over 60 years.

I never intended to let my five year neighbor's kids use it. If I was still pulling a haybaler with an 8N I would actually make and use one.

You know they make thousands of pull behind discs for the old tractors and there is no telling how many people were killed and injured with those things when you made too sharp a turn with one and it climbed up the rear wheel and over the driver. Crunch!
Zane

Well said Mr Zane.

 

[oldtanker]

(quoted from post at 10:00:25 12/20/11) I gave up the idea of making the wheel lift live PTO already so you sissies can feel good about that. Better not go out in that automobile today either. I hear they kill and maim more people than tractors!!!! Scary ain't it????

Just thought it was interesting that my idea had been invented about 50 years ago.

I know how dangerous mechanical things are since I've been hammering and twisting bolts and nuts on them for over 60 years.

I never intended to let my five year neighbor's kids use it. If I was still pulling a haybaler with an 8N I would actually make and use one.

You know they make thousands of pull behind discs for the old tractors and there is no telling how many people were killed and injured with those things when you made too sharp a turn with one and it climbed up the rear wheel and over the driver. Crunch!
Zane

Whatever call all the names that make you feel good about yourself.

I wasn't talking about 5 years operating one.......lots of older guys do dumb things too without making it easyer for them to kill themselves. I bales on some hilly ground that I wouldn't want to lift a rear wheel off the ground on. If you think that makes me a sissy then so be it. Guess I'll just go on using the tractor with a live PTO for running the baler thats too big for the N anyway. About the only thing the N is good for with hay is raking for me......even if I had a loader for it I really don't think it would do 1800 pound bales very well.

I have been told by others here that your Zane thing was a great idea. I just don't think this one was.

OK it was invented a long time ago......how long was it in production? What killed it, live PTO or too many accidents caused by it or did it just not work well or maybe it just was a high breakage item????

Rick

 

[Dean]

If it made economic sense, it would be available in the commercial market.

Trust me on this.

Dean

 

[TheOldHokie]

(quoted from post at 15:52:24 12/20/11) If it made economic sense, it would be available in the commercial market.

Trust me on this.

Dean

If nothing else the product liabilty insurance costs would make it extremely expensive. And even one lawsuit could/would wipe out the Sherman fortune....

TOH

 

[Britcheflee]

Couple of times the pin holding the brush hog to the lift arms got knocked off by the wheel (hopefully I have adjusted the chains enough to stop that now) but on a turn the hog would catch on the rear wheel and ride up - on more than one occasion I have looked back to see the thing way up on its side blade whirling - scared me..(insert your favourite phrase here).

Joke:

My next door neighbour just confronted me about items missing from her
washing line...I nearly crapped her pants!



Lee

 

[Ultradog MN]

Some years ago I thought up a set of air activated training wheels that would mount on a Harley so my friend who was dying of Agent Orange could ride a little longer.
Press a button just before you got completely stopped at the light and the wheels would deploy and keep him upright. His nerves and legs were giving out but he could still have rode with that contraption.
But he died on me and there's a few things we didn't get finished. God rest his soul.
It's a great idea Zane. Good old American ingenuity. But givin the advantages of buying a tractor with lpto and probably a lot of other improvements over an N it just isn't practical.
The Allis WDs probably had the best version of a non-live "lpto" with a seperate lever to disengage the splined coupler.
Study that and make a manual one like it for an N. Has to be economical mind you...
That would be a legacy that would surpass even your marvelous Zane Thang.
JMO

 

[Fuddy Duddy]

You should check this out. It's called the ecomobile.
ecomobile

 

[Jerry Kirkpatrick]

(quoted from post at 14:52:24 12/20/11) If it made economic sense, it would be available in the commercial market.

Trust me on this.

Dean

It other words, if a person has an idea that makes economic sense, forget about it because someone else would have already made it available in the commercial market...hmmm...if everyone thought like that, we'd still be walking around in animal skins carrying clubs looking for something to eat.



JK

 

[Bill(Wis)]

Dear ZANE: With all due respect to your expertise in matters such as this, it seems to me to be a bit ZANEY. (;>)) I'll attempt to explain why. Granted, the tractor will stop if either rear wheel (or both) is lifted off the ground. In the case of one wheel coming off the ground, it will spin at a rate approximately double that of when it was on the ground. The problem would arise, as I envision it, when you went to let the wheel back down to continue forward travel. The shock load would be sufficient to do damage to the weak link in the driveline over time. This would be accompanied by a considerable yawing moment making for an uncomfortable day if you were going through this quite often. Which you probably would due the underpowered nature of the N. I never saw an N hooked to a hay baler, even a hay baler with an engine.