Oliver 1750 wet stacking

[used red MN]

Thanks for the replies. Tragically I didn't know enough to quiz the tech to make sure he set the valve protrusion correctly. And he no longer works at that shop, so I can't ask him.

The tractor starts good. I ran it for a while today and once it warms up, the wet stacking is severe at 2,000 RPM. It wasn't doing this before the overhaul. Made a mess all over the new paint job. Some white/gray/light blue smoke. I didn't see much blow by unless it was idling.

So the pencil injector adapter is not quite as long as the injectors by about an inch. It is close to the same diameter as the injectors, no quite as tight. I put a rubber washer on it to seal the pressure. That makes it just a bit shorter of course, so maybe that was a mistake.

This is the test kit I purchased. The pencil injector adaptor is second from the left. Anyone have a simple way to test the compression accuracy of my kit?

Thanks again.

The compression numbers you posted are very low. Take a rubber tipped blow gun on your air hose. Hopefully you have a 120psi, 175 would be better. Find an adapter the blow gun will seal on. See how close the gauge reads to the pressure in the air system.

 

[tom upton]

Is your air filter clean? Your symptoms sound like an air obstructiion to me?? I know the valve protrusion is important, but I cant see it being drastic enough to cause your wet stacking.

 

[Sheriff]

The compression numbers you posted are very low. Take a rubber tipped blow gun on your air hose. Hopefully you have a 120psi, 175 would be better. Find an adapter the blow gun will seal on. See how close the gauge reads to the pressure in the air system.

Good suggestion. I Investigated this a bit yesterday. I discovered the quick connect studs that came with the kit were not great at sealing. Some adaptor's studs seemed better than others. Cheaply made I am sure. So I put a good one on this pencil adaptor and with no escaping air with compressor gauge at 127 was getting about 85 psi on the testing gauge. So my compression is probably around 250 or so. I'll see if I can find a different gauge and try again. Some of that drop may be the length of the air hose?

 

[Sheriff]

Is your air filter clean? Your symptoms sound like an air obstructiion to me?? I know the valve protrusion is important, but I cant see it being drastic enough to cause your wet stacking.

It looks clean, but it is 20 years old (my dad dated it when he installed it). Next time I run it, I will pull it out altogether. I did pull the hoses off of the intake manifold and everything from the filter housing to the intake looks clean and clear.

I appreciate your input.

 

[Sheriff]

My rebuild drags on . The valves were recessed instead of protruding...as some of you suggested might be the issue. It is in a different shop now. They indicate the replacement valves they ordered (and received) are not the correct ones.
Yesterday's Tractor apparently did not have them. I asked the machine shop to try there first. They can't find them elsewhere. Does anyone have a suggestion where to get these?
My motor is a 310D. Tractor is a 1750 built in 1968. Serial number stamped on the alternator bracket is 163606.

Thank you!

 

[showcrop]

My rebuild drags on . The valves were recessed instead of protruding...as some of you suggested might be the issue. It is in a different shop now. They indicate the replacement valves they ordered (and received) are not the correct ones.
Yesterday's Tractor apparently did not have them. I asked the machine shop to try there first. They can't find them elsewhere. Does anyone have a suggestion where to get these?
My motor is a 310D. Tractor is a 1750 built in 1968. Serial number stamped on the alternator bracket is 163606.

Thank you!

A good automotive machine shop will source valves by specs not by name. One of my Fords has valves for a Chevy V8 in order to restore correct protrusion.

 

[tom upton]

Last valves I put in a 310 I got from this company.

Custom Valve Order | Ferrea Racing Components

Find Ferrea Racing Engine Valves at Ferrea.com. We manufacturer engine valves and valve train components for the racing industry.

www.ferrea.com

Chances are good that your valve seats may be part of the problem as well so maybe mention that to shop doing the work? If you do order from Ferrea you will probably want shop doing the work to fill out the order form specs. It was a few years ago but I remember cost not being crazy for custom made valves? Again you probably need new seats installed.

 

[Dieseltech]

My rebuild drags on . The valves were recessed instead of protruding...as some of you suggested might be the issue. It is in a different shop now. They indicate the replacement valves they ordered (and received) are not the correct ones.
Yesterday's Tractor apparently did not have them. I asked the machine shop to try there first. They can't find them elsewhere. Does anyone have a suggestion where to get these?
My motor is a 310D. Tractor is a 1750 built in 1968. Serial number stamped on the alternator bracket is 163606.

Thank you!

The 283/310 diesel heads need ALL valves ABOVE the deck surface, My White 4/78 4WD forklift needed head work years ago due to hard cold starting in a 60 degree shop, compression check was at 300 PSI. Pulled the head and found ALL valves and seats had been ground too much as ALL were .035/.040 inch BELOW the deck surface and I was told they should be about.045/.050 ABOVE the deck. I had my head shop put in ALL new seats and place the used reground valves at .095/.100 ABOVE the deck. They have plenty of room as the pistons have .140 deep valve pockets cut into them, plus the head gasket thickness adds more also. It starts MUCH better now cold. Compression heat is CRITICAL for diesels to start well cold, and can help with cold use wet stacking trouble too.

 

[scootergmc]

My rebuild drags on . The valves were recessed instead of protruding...as some of you suggested might be the issue. It is in a different shop now. They indicate the replacement valves they ordered (and received) are not the correct ones.
Yesterday's Tractor apparently did not have them. I asked the machine shop to try there first. They can't find them elsewhere. Does anyone have a suggestion where to get these?
My motor is a 310D. Tractor is a 1750 built in 1968. Serial number stamped on the alternator bracket is 163606.

Thank you!

There was an Oliver service bulletin on valve protrusion. I don't have it handy, but I'm sure there was. Dieseltech may have the specs correct.

Edit: I found a thread with a photo of the bulletin, it also has the exhaust seat part numbers: https://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/threads/310-valve-protrusion.1600135/

Intake: .014" min. .026" max
Exhaust ..026" min .034" (nominal) .041" max

Edit again: Reliance makes the aftermarket valve: #S223336D (OEM 164498A), and intake 223236A (OEM 163648A), probably available from a few places. Maybe your shop can cross easier. I know Arrow makes aftermarket engine parts too.

 

[scootergmc]

Also, make sure the sleeve protrusion is correct as well. I don't have that spec handy, but maybe .004"????????

 

[scootergmc]

Also, take a look at Chris's video here at the 8:00 min mark

 

[Janicholson]

An Inch short of full depth at the Injector port with the test adapter is really important. It will lower the test pressure even more than the gauge error! Jim

 

[mechanicfred]

IF everything is up to par then wet stacking is a result of not enough load and or rpm on engine . Bringing the rpm up should stop the wet stacking even if you are not loading engine very heavy. turning down fuel delivery won't help because injection pump will only deliver the amount of fuel required to maintain selected rpm . Even new injectors need to be checked before installing . Last but not least : I had a 2255 Oliver with a 3208 Cat that was wet stacking , I called the local Fabik guy & he said " heat it up ". So a 28' disc at about 5" cut stopped the wet stack !!

3208s were terrible with raw fuel smoke on gen sets, we would load them up on a load bank and cure them of that problem!!

 

[Sheriff]

Thank you all. I am trying to source these from Ferrea now. I'll give an update as soon as I can.