Simms minimec injector pump??????

[dannyidp]

I am wondering if the Simms minimec pump is still being used today on Late Model tractors.


I am in the process of rebuilding mine on the 5000 before anybody jumps down my throat I'm going to take it to the diesel shop when I'm done and fine tune the fuel delivery. After tearing into it I found many issues one the camshaft is worn pretty bad and needs to be replaced I have the number on the cam the rollers and pins need replacing Plus the bearings I can't believe it was running as good as it was.

Problem is finding parts for these pumps does anybody know a good source for parts? I already have purchased the seal kit. That is why I am curious if they still use these pumps today since I'm having issues finding parts? Thanks

 

[David G]

I think they go bad because people do not service them regular.

 

[dannyidp]

(quoted from post at 08:20:32 06/04/17) I think they go bad because people do not service them regular.

Do they still produce these pumps?Just wondering if this pump is being used on newer tractors irritation pumps ect.what year did they if they have?Does anybody have some info?

 

[Bern]

I seriously doubt these pumps are still being produced for anything being built today. You have to remember that this is essentially almost 100-year old technology (Robert Bosch invented the inline pump in the 1920s), and the Simms/Minimec/CAV version of that technology was primitive at best. Ford tractor stopped using these pumps in the mid 90s, so that should give you an idea of where we are at with these things.

 

[dannyidp]

(quoted from post at 23:37:14 06/04/17) I seriously doubt these pumps are still being produced for anything being built today. You have to remember that this is essentially almost 100-year old technology (Robert Bosch invented the inline pump in the 1920s), and the Simms/Minimec/CAV version of that technology was primitive at best. Ford tractor stopped using these pumps in the mid 90s, so that should give you an idea of where we are at with these things.

Thank you Bern you have been really helpful to me in many situations in the last year or so along with others. So if they produced this pump up until the mid 90's why are parts so hard to find I was beginning to think they stopped producing in the 70's lol.

I think my barrels and plungers are ok except for a little pitting at the base hint no diesel in oil.But while I was there i wanted to replace those also along with the cam and wore out pins and rollers.Problem is I cant find a 8.5MM barrel and plunger or cam.

Next ? is there another pump that can be put on the 5000 without to much of a headache with available parts?
If not then when the pumps go so do the tractors.

I am going to do some calling around to diesel shops tomorrow and see what kind of info i can find out.Its almost like a secret society of some sort lol.

My local shop did tell me if my cam was pitted (which I now know it is) that they could send it off and have it built up and reground for a $$$$$.

This tractor is new to me (the complete Restoration post) so I don't know the history except it was wore out from one end to the other.

 

[karl f]

The pump shops get their parts somewhere. So, one can obtain parts. Diesel pump repair is one of the few old fashioned specialist trades left.
What I mean is you can't google what you're looking for or go to Walmart. You have to go to the professional shop with credentials and the
secret contact list. On one hand it's frustrating and expensive but on the other it supports small businesses and gives you perfect results. I like
to fix things myself to save money and would not be afraid to tackle a pump, but without the special tools I can't do it either.
I guess the place you got the seal kit may sell all the parts but doesn't advertise because of trade tradition, so you could contact them for help.
Worst they'd say is "no you must be a shop."
There is a Star diesel online that I found has almost enough parts listed to get in over your head. They may be another contact. Maybe part of
the problem for the public is all the volumes of manuals that need to be digitized?

Good luck
Karl f
Untitled URL Link

 

[thepumpguysc]

Parts are redily available if you have the correct part #'s..
Whats your pump #? P-????
Email me direct w/ the pump # & parts required & I'll furnish the P#'s..
I have the Delphi{CAV/Simms} program on my home computer.. it'll take me seconds..

 

[karl f]

(quoted from post at 11:36:26 06/04/17)

Next ? is there another pump that can be put on the 5000 without to much of a headache with available parts?
If not then when the pumps go so do the tractors.

Our neighbors had a late 5000 with dual power. It has a rotary pump on it. Timing cover plate, linkages, and injector tubes come to mind as obvious different parts. Probably injector pump gear too.

-karl f

 

[Bern]

You should be able to install most any 4-cylinder CAV pump onto your 5000 without issue, as long as you re-adjust the maximum fuel setting accordingly. The only exception would be the later model pumps with the external lube line. You'd have to add the necessary plumbing for that.

 

[dannyidp]

Thanks guys and thepumpguysc That would be awesome as I have spent hours researching with no luck.I cant find your email and I think pm's are disabled

 

[thepumpguysc]

Your right..fuel shops are under contract to use OEM parts.. I've been in the business for OVER 30 years..
and help out on the forums after hrs..
SOME shops will help you out IF you have the pump #.. They'll look up the parts & SELL THEM to you..
They WONT TELL you where to get them.. Contracts cost money.. you HAVE TO PAY inorder to get the pump info from the manuf.. THATS WHY they don't give out part #'s..

 

[dannyidp]

(quoted from post at 05:51:12 06/05/17) Your right..fuel shops are under contract to use OEM parts.. I've been in the business for OVER 30 years..
and help out on the forums after hrs..
SOME shops will help you out IF you have the pump #.. They'll look up the parts & SELL THEM to you..
They WONT TELL you where to get them.. Contracts cost money.. you HAVE TO PAY inorder to get the pump info from the manuf.. THATS WHY they don't give out part #'s..

Okay my pump is the simms P 4862 I cant email you but if you could email me the info I sure would appreciate it
[email protected]

I need the camshaft # which I have the number on the camshaft but have not found any info.
the barrels and plundger#
the pins and rollers#or whole assemble with the lifter
Thanks

 

[thepumpguysc]

EMAIL SENT

 

[dannyidp]

(quoted from post at 17:05:09 06/05/17) EMAIL SENT

Thank you for this. Info. I will let you know the number on my camshaft is different than yours maybe it don't matter.
The cam lobes have alot of wear I don't know the tolerance of except able wear. But if it was a cam in my 350 Cid it would definitely be replaced.

 

[JDEM]

If it runs good, I'd put oil in it and leave it alone. Problem with those pumps is they have their own oil reservoir and get run dry if not
checked once in awhile. They are real tough. I have gotten a few running again after they seized up from being run dry. I just got the
plungers unstuck with a pry-bar, put some oil in, and all was fine again. That camshaft is very hard and not just Parkerized like and old
Chevy camshaft.

 

[dannyidp]

(quoted from post at 17:05:09 06/05/17) EMAIL SENT

TPG thanks again.
. I know you will know the answer to this I called a reground shop in N.C and they told me that they do not build up the camshafts but just regrind them and you would have the same lift with the grind profile. The problem that I see with that is the top of my points are worn so if they do just a regrind there may be as much lift on the camshaft but there is not a adjustment to take up for the amount that was taken off in the pump am I correct on this? I can see doing this with a automotive or tractor cam because you can take up the amount that was taken off with the rocker arm through the push rod down to the lifter whereas in this situation I don't think there is an adjustment.

 

[dannyidp]

(quoted from post at 20:04:17 06/05/17) If it runs good, I'd put oil in it and leave it alone. Problem with those pumps is they have their own oil reservoir and get run dry if not
checked once in awhile. They are real tough. I have gotten a few running again after they seized up from being run dry. I just got the
plungers unstuck with a pry-bar, put some oil in, and all was fine again. That camshaft is very hard and not just Parkerized like and old
Chevy camshaft.

JDEM
That's the problem no 3 cylinder was not hitting like the rest after disassemble of the pump no 3 lobe was worn way down as if the roller locked up on it and done a number.

 

[dannyidp]

I wish I had a manual for This pump but I don't.I found a new cam for a reasonable price got it on the way.Do you know how much end play I need on the cam shaft?

 

[thepumpguysc]

How are you getting the delivery valve holders[top nuts] loose & more importantly, Torqued??
Vise grips?? I "normally" just borrow the socket from work but decided to buy my own.. it was 90.00 AFTERMARKET.
I DONT want to discourage anyone from attempting a repair on their pump BUT.. between the camshaft, the plungers & barrels, the rollers & pins, the bearing, the springs & the governor weights that should be replaced, then the special tools AND a 100 thousand $ machine to run it on, to set the timing, equal delivery between cylinders and the speeds.. ya think it mighta been cheaper to pay the 5-6-700.00 for a rebuild?? Not only THAT.. But you don't even have a book.. just sayin'..

I too have knocked em loose JD.. The customer, JUST WANTS IT RUNNIN.. nothing wrong w/ that..

 

[dannyidp]

Thanks TPG
I could not find this pump rebuilt for 700.00 1200.00 was as cheap as I could find there was some out there offering to rebuild for 700 but that did not include the cam or governor. I just rebuilt a 2000 Honda Accord auto transmission and fig how hard could that little pump be?
So I decided to tackle it I love learning about things and I'm glad I did.

When I am done it will be a lot cheaper than 1100 that is including my local diesel shop calibrating and phasing the pump.

I was not going to replace the B&P's but because the feet we're wore so bad and not the same wear from one to the other I decided for the price to replace them.

I would never use vice grips on the Service delivery valves I am in the process of finding a socket that will fit.
As far as my governor which is supposed to be the number one failure in these pumps my governor has no flat spots on the balls I was told by a diesel shop if there is no flat spots the governor is fine.

I was also told 15 years ago that I could not rebuild my Johnson 150 GT outboard engine that if I did not get it perfect in those kind of RPMs that it turns it would fly all the pieces. That push my buttons so I rebuild it myself that engine still runs perfect today.

I'm not saying that just anybody can rebuild these pumps but the fuel injection pump services sure do try to put the fear of God in you that you cannot do this.