Super A with a Stuck Valve.

[HVFDfirefighter]

I just got this tractor a few weeks ago. I got it running in the barn where it was found in order to get it on the trailer easier. I put new wires on it this week. I have noticed the engine is running rough. Here is a youtube video of the rough running tractor. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uChQyVaGbFs

I took the air filter off and cleaned that. It was full of gunk. Took the carb off and cleaned that. Took the exhaust manifold off. Took the valve cover off. Upon inspection of the push rods, I noticed one was not under the rocker arm. This is the one closest to the gas tank (so cylinder 4). I loosened the nut and the screw on the rocker arm above the push rod enough to get push rod back under the rocker arm then tightened the screw and the nut. I then think I found out why that rod was out of place. On the opposite side of that same rocker arm is the valve (has a big spring). It will not budge. The seven other valves will move when I try to push them down and then they come right back up. This eighth one is stuck. I started to hit with a hammer, it did move a little. I then stopped hitting because I don't want to break anything. (Maybe I already did) I sprayed PB Blaster to the stuck valve every so often while cleaning the carb. It is still not moving. Letting sit over night. My question is: How do I get a stuck valve to move? I hope I do not have to take the header off. I have never gone that deep into an engine bigger than a single stroke engine. I am a little afraid. t looks like three bolts hold valve assembly on. A bunch of nuts to remove the header (8 maybe). I do have an IT manual.

I also noticed that the first three and the last three rocker arms have a string tied around each. The middle two rocker arms do not have this string. Should they?

I know I will need to buy a bunch of gaskets. The nuts holding the exhaust manifold on, are they special? They are in bad shape and need replaced. Can I use regular nuts or are they special?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[da.bees]

Does it look like all the rockers are getting oil. Find out before pulling head in case that need's attention before reassembling.

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

All rocker arms appear to be wet (with oil). The tractor has sat in a shed for 20+ years. When I say shed, I am being generous. No rain, but wind and blowing snow possible. Shed was in an area of New York that is subject to 6+ feet of snow in a week, yes FEET of snow. Tractor looks to be in good shape. But it has sat for 20+ years, That is never good. Just like our fire trucks, the longer they sit, the faster they fade away.

 

[Charlie M]

I have had them stick on my W30 from sitting over the winter and a tap on them with a hammer has made them loosen. If it is rusted bad you may get it to move but not spring back. Depends on your luck for the
day.

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

The push rod that was miss placed does not appear to be bent. I did not remove it though to inspect. It looks as if they can just lift right out.

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

If it doesn't spring back, then what? Time to remove the head and push from other side? If that is true, how much stuff am I going to damage? And, How hard is it to put back together? Like I said, I have never done that before.

 

[TimV]

HVFDfirefighter: where are you located, if you don't mind--I'm in the Tug Hill region myself and so I can well understand the 6 feet of snow in a week, and occasionally that much in couple of days! I had an A with a stuck valve from setting, and once I broke it free with a gentle tap with a hammer on a block of wood I kept at it with PB Blaster, moving it up and down by hand, and it cleared up and ran fine. I run Marvel Mystery Oil with my gas & oil, which seems to help keep carbon buildup (a frequent cause of sticking valves) down.

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

I got the tractor from a camp on the Gomer Hill Road. I live in Heuvelton, NY though about 1 1/2 hours north.

 

[TimV]

Gotcha. Spent 4 years up in that neck of the woods at college. Looks like a good find--the Super A's are a very versatile little tractor!

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

I would love to find a front snow plow and frame for the Super A or back blade.

 

[504]

Common problem, a little varnish and setting around can cause a little rust, and you get stuck valves.
If I smack one with a hammer, I use a rubber mallet. Soak smack. The last one I had stick, the valve was too far down to soak it, so I tried a trick that I stole from this site. Take out all of the spark plugs and find a way to turn the motor over BOTH WAYS so you can rock it back and forth(turning the fan,socket on the crank shaft, etc.) Bring the piston up to the top on that cylinder.you can stick a screw driver in the spark plug hole to tell when you are there. Pull the cylinder a little and fill the cylinder with a piece of rope,turn the piston back to the top and when it stops the rope should be pushing the valve up from inside. You must take you time or you can bend the valve and then you have to pull the head. When you get the valve moving even a little bit you can spray more stuff and tap it down with the rubber hammer. The last one I did took three days,every time I walked past I either rolled the motor,tapped the valve and shot my favorite rust buster,acetone and atf,mixed 50-50(BTW it will separate so you need to shake the oil can every time you squirt.

 

[teddy52food]

Keep soaking it. It didn't stick over night & it won't come loose overnight either. Cut 2 blocks of hard wood to put along each side of the valve & use 2 heavy screwdrivers to pry it back up. Keep soaking. Try turning it back & forth with a vise grips if you can. Keep soaking. I would not pull the head for at least a month. keep soaking.

 

[Loren in Iowa]

The next thing I would do is a compression test. If other cylinders are uneven, you might
want to pull the head and grind the valves, anyway. You've got an interesting project,
there, and pulling that head shouldn't be too tough, now that you have the manifold off.

 

[RBoots]

You can take a small hammer and tap on the
top of the valve. Stop when the spring is
all the way compressed. Spray the valve
down with penetrating oil, then stick a
small prybar between the spring could and
try to get it to pop back up a little bit.
Just have to work it back and forth a
little once it starts to move. The manifold
nuts aren't anything too special, just a
little taller than regular nuts. Some parts
stores carry manifold nuts like that,
doesn't hurt to try. If they don't, regular
nuts will be ok. I try to use the SAE
washers under the nuts. They are a smaller
OD than the USS washer. Try to get it
running with the valve cover off, then make
sure you have oil dripping at each rocker
arm before putting the valve cover back on.

 

[504]

Common problem, a little varnish and setting around can cause a little rust, and you get stuck valves.
If I smack one with a hammer, I use a rubber mallet. Soak, smack. The last one I had stick, the valve was too far down to soak it, so I tried a trick that I stole from this site. Take out all of the spark plugs and find a way to turn the motor over, BOTH WAYS, so you can rock it back and forth(turning the fan,socket on the crank shaft, etc.) Bring the piston up to the top on that cylinder.you can stick a screw driver in the spark plug hole to tell when you are there. Pull the cylinder up a little and fill the cylinder with a piece of rope,(leave a foot sticking out of the hole)turn the piston back to the top and when it stops the rope should be pushing the valve up from inside. You must take you time, or you can bend the valve and then you have to pull the head. When you get the valve moving even a little bit you can spray more stuff and tap it down with the rubber hammer. The last one I did took three days,every time I walked past I either rolled the motor,tapped the valve and shot my favorite rust buster,acetone and atf,mixed 50-50(BTW it will separate so you need to shake the oil can every time you squirt.

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

This is my first Farmall. My other two tractors are ORANGE. I have an Allis Chalmers 1953 WD and a 1960 D14. Both were barn finds. The Wd is almost a WD45. Being that it was made in 53 and parts for the 45 were in production, they threw a lot of the new parts in this WD. Making it sort of a cross over tractor. Kinda weird.
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<image src="http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/photos/mvphoto2155.jpg"/>

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

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[Steve@Advance]

Don't pull the head just yet. Let the PB Blaster soak in good, keep spraying it. If you can, give it several days to soak.

Try the hammer again, a small hammer, more shock than beating. If it will go down, it should come back up. Try 2 large screw drivers on each side of the spring, try to pry up, equal pressure on each side so not to bend the stem. The object is to get it to move, just a little, just enough to break it loose so more PB can get down the stem. You might get lucky and it will come loose and pop shut. If it does, keep tapping it with the hammer, pry down on it to free it up. Just be careful not to push down on the spring retainer. The keepers will fall out and the cap will come off. Not that big a deal to put it back on, just more hassle.

Once it is free, put the pushrod back in, adjust the lash, get it running and watch it to be sure it stays free. Also watch the rocker assembly to be sure it is oiling. Won't oil much, just drip, but all the rockers must show some sign of getting oil.

After it has run a while, shut it off and adjust the valve lash again.

There may be a reason it was stuck. Hopefully it was just condensation or rain. But a head gasket or cracked head can also get moisture in the cylinder. Time will tell. The strings tied to the rockers? Who knows, someone has been there, maybe marking them as they were adjusted? Who knows.

Since you are going to be working on, and finding more problem areas, a shop manual would be a very valuable investment. It will more that pay for itself in mistakes not made!

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

If I start it up with valve cover off, will oil spray everywhere?

 

[rustred]

if its stuck that bad , pull the head and do it properly. this tapping and waiting and wasting time i have no patients for. in 1/2 hr the head is off and your going to fool around for a month waiting, no thank you. this way you can actually clean the rust out of the valve guides and lube them up.you can buy a smallround wire brush that works excellent for guides. how else you gonna get the rust out? sure dont come out by waiting. plus rust causes wear on them.plus at the same time you can see what shape the valve seats and valves are in. that tiny little engine is a good candidate for learning on. if no repair is required you will have it running in one day easy.

 

[docmirror]

(quoted from post at 19:28:55 08/17/17) If I start it up with valve cover off, will oil spray everywhere?

Prolly not. It'll drool, and may get some runs off the head.

Stuck valves are due to build up of crud on the stem of the valve, and it gets stuck to the bottom of the guide inside the chamber.

To work the stuck valve use the 'rope trick'. Here's how you do it:

Loosen the adjusting nut for both rockers, and move the pushrod off both rockers, so they don't actuate the valves for that cylinder. Remove the spark plug. Use a screwdriver in the plug hole, and make sure the piston is down about 2-3" from TDC on that cyl. Now, feed about a foot of 3/8" nylon rope into the cylinder. Tie a not in the end, so you don't push ALL the rope in there! Once you have the rope stuffed into the cylinder, use a wrench and NOT THE STARTER to move the crankshaft and push the piston up, and push the bound up rope into the head of the valves, pushing them back into the guide. Don't slam it hard, just work the wrench on the crankshaft back and forth and 'bump' the rope up into the head and valves.

You can watch the valve as you bump the crank around and the rope into the valve. You may need to rearrange the rope in the cyl to hit the correct valve. You should see the valve kinda move back up into place. Once this is done, leave the piston with rope bound up tight to the top. Now, from the rocker side, you can maybe remove that one rocker off the end of the shaft(lucky its the end), compress the spring, take off the keepers, the retainer and the spring. You can rent or borrow a spring compressor from AutoZone. With the top of the valve exposed, see if there is a rubber cone seal on the valve, and if so - remove that seal. Now you can drool a mix of ATF and diesel fuel on the valve shaft and lube it down in there.

While you have the valve spring off, make sure you don't move the crankshaft, or the valve could drop into the cylinder, then you would have to remove the head. Once you get it lubed, then put the seal, spring, retainer, and two keepers back on the valve. Check to make sure it's all snug, and then roll the crankshaft down, remove the rope, install the spark plug, fit the pushrods to the rocker, and adjust them, and try starting it.

That should have knocked some of the carbon off the valve shaft, and the lube will let it run back in.

 

[Charlie M]

My wife is from the Tug Hill region - most people don't know snow until you've been there.

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

If I do end up removing the head, it looks pretty straight forward. Drain coolant, remove valve assembly, take off
head. How hard is it to get head back on? Any special tools needed? Never done this. Pistons will be exposed
right? How do I get rings back in the cylinders. Or is it as easy as just reversing the above steps? New gasket of
course.

 

[rgthompson]

TimV,

Would you happen to be Tim Virkler, Class of '91? From Croghan, NY?

Robert Thompson '91
[email protected]

 

[Dan Richardson]

All pretty good advise. But use Sea Foam penetrating spray. After you get it loose use MMO to prevent it from happening again. Been there done that.

 

[mjbrown]

It won't hurt to try all of the suggestions here. If not successful it will be a good learning experience if you take the head off and have it gone over. Everyone here did it a first time at some point. Luckily for you, youtube has a number of Farmall specific videos about head removal and reinstall. I haven't done a farmall but I bet they are not too difficult. Tractors of that vintage were designed to be simple to fix.
Good luck.

 

[Fritz Maurer]

I'd say thats 100% accurate. He might luck out, but... at this stage the head could be off nach zehn Minuten

 

[John M]

Just do reverse what you do to take it off. Youll need a torque wrench for the headgasket. Rings wont come out.

 

[Will Herring]

(quoted from post at 22:19:51 08/17/17) This is my first Farmall. My other two tractors are ORANGE. I have an Allis Chalmers 1953 WD and a 1960 D14. Both were barn finds. The Wd is almost a WD45. Being that it was made in 53 and parts for the 45 were in production, they threw a lot of the new parts in this WD. Making it sort of a cross over tractor. Kinda weird.
&lt;image src="http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/photos/mvphoto2154.jpg"/&gt;

&lt;image src="http://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/photos/mvphoto2155.jpg"/&gt;

Both of my WDs had some 45 parts like the crooked gear shifters. Kind of neat having ones from the inbetween period.

 

[gene bender]

Iwould quit wasting time and pull the head and get it to a shopsetting around that long the seats and valves will ned attention. That will saveproblems down the road if its stuck that bad from setting around that long. Thenyou will have a good engine to start and run. There is a reason its stuck that bad. You will find out the others need attension. btdt my self.

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

incleaned the tractor all up. Removed all the old cakes on grease and dirt. I took the head off! Yeah! Wasn't too hard. Had to heat a bolt from front end of head going to radiator siphon and fan. Inside there is a lot of carbon build up. I got that cleaned up mostly. When I insert a rod into base, I get a little splash of water (leaked in when I pressure washed). I have not changed oil yet. If I drain oil now, can I flush the engine and let all the gunk drain out before filling with new oil? If so what can I use to flush? Water? Purple Power? And, where do I put it? Do I put it through the eight holes that the rods go into? I took a small wire and inserted inthenbase of the road seats, would not go any further. Not sure how oil gets up into engine. I may need to unplug those whiles if I knew where they were.

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

 

[HVFDfirefighter]

yEAH! I GOT THE STUCK VALVE TO MOVE! Worked it back and forth. Move good now!