Talking about generators

[Jimmydog]

I wasn't going to post this, as it'll be a while before I have the time to monkey with it, but since you guys are on this topic already: I have a B&S Elite Series 6200watt generator that is my back-up. I occasionally loan it out to friends when their power goes out. Well when it came back last time the guy told me it may not be right. Story goes: it quit running abruptly, he goes out to see what happened and notices the power has come back on in the neighborhood. All the circuit breakers are tripped. He resets them and unplugs the load (house) and it starts right up. I should mention he back feeds his house through the electric dryer 220V plug. He makes sure the disconnect switch is thrown so the mains won't come on while the generator is on line. Something must be off with his wiring? What happened? I suspect he may have his common/neutral and ground wires crossed on his adapter/back-feed wire. Even with the main disconnect disconnected isn't the ground still hooked up? Anybody have any theories where the current went? So I fired it up and hooked the air compressor up (220V load) and it appeared to work fine, but when the load was removed the governor almost shut the motor down very erratic RPMs. I tried the test again and this time it did shut down. Now all it does fires and runs for about 15-20 seconds and the gov goes all the way off, kind of slams to one position. I've eliminated the low oil shut down as a cause. It's more of a stall type shut down than an ignition kill. So what say ye all? Burned up coils in the head? Where or what should I look at before tearing into the generator head itself? Any suggestions....anyone?....Billy are you out there?

Busy day today (hot too!) I'll check back tomorrow. Thanks.

JD

 

[big jt]

Auto Idle? If the idle speed screw is set to low or there is a problem in the idle circuit in the carb it could cause this symptom.

 

[1948CaseVAI]

Why would you lend a generator to a moron who is backfeeding through the dryier outlet without a proper transfer switch? He "says" he trips the main first, but then there may be something wrong with his wiring? How responsible will you feel for the dead lineman?

 

[thdrduck]

I'd say crud in the carb. Sounds like it is starving for fuel. To test this you can try to run it with the choke about 1/2 on and see if it runs better, if it does, most likely the main jet has some crud in it and just needs cleaning.
My Honda clone will do this if I don't run it every month or so. I doubt it has anything to do with the generator set but I could be wrong.

 

[WGM]

I assume your friend will pay for repairs or replacement?

 

[Steve@Advance]

big jt, I agree.

Especially if it will continue to run with a load.

I've had several gensets, and other small engines that mysteriously leaned out to the point of surging, dying at idle, requiring partial choke to run.

Sometimes a thorough carb cleaning, scraping out each and every jet will fix it, Some times it takes micro surgical opening of the idle jet or main, depending on the symptoms.

 

[Billy Shafer]

JD The first thing I would do. Is pull the generator plate on the back end. Probably just four screws holding it on. You will be
able to see the stator and rotor. If they are black and crispy looking. It has been back fed. I have seen units that were back fed
that had just enough left in them. For one more shot at working. If it stalls out it may be that it is trying to produce voltage
into a shorted item.

I have heard the dryer plug story. To many times. Always the same thing. I have never had a problem doing this. Well it only takes
once. I rebuilt three units last year because of it. Back feeding is a very dangerous issue.Power companies hate it and I don't
blame them. Around here if they hear a generator running. They will send a man to check on you. If it is unsafe. They will pull your
meter.

Never loan out your generator. Unless you go with it and check out where it will be used. If back feeding is involved. Tell them
sorry but not with my equipment.There are systems that can be installed for proper operation.
Send me the full model and serial number. I can check out what you have.

 

[Dusty MI]

I saw a main panel in a home once that used cartage type fuses. It had a main with fuses, and lugs on the bus bars.
The wires coming in from the meter went straight to the lugs on the bus bars, leaving the main useless.

Dusty

 

[Jimmydog]

Thanks all that replied! Even those of you whom chided me, I expected some blow back when I posted.

So my friend is not a moron, he's not the brightest crayon in the box either. But he has characteristics sadly lacking these days; honesty, integrity, unwavering fidelity to his ethics. I'd be hard pressed to find some one half as good as him. I suspect about anybody else would have returned it and not said a word. Will he pay me for the repairs, probably not, but that's okay by me. After 40+ years things just aren't that big a deal. As for loaning my stuff out....the older I get the more I'm less likely to, but this guy, I'd loan him one of my kidneys if he needed one.

I already played with the choke like some have said, nothing there. It would be nice if it were a mere coincidence the carb going while all the circuit breakers tripped, it seems unlikely to me and points more in the direction that Billy mentioned -a shorted winding some where.The guy told me that it's been running before when power came back on and it hasn't been a problem. I'll give him heck until he installs a proper transfer switch. He/we have been running this set up the same everything for nigh on ten years. His power goes out 2 or three times a year and I wonder why he doesn't just go off grid heh,heh.

So I said I wasn't going to have time to mess with this but hey, I'm the one that poked the sleeping dog, so I'll try to putter around with it today or tomorrow and if I find out more I'll give a shout out. Again thanks all!

mdl# 030242-00(rev) ser# 1015056129

Stay cool everybody....as if you're all not cool enough already!
JD

 

[Uniballer]

He doesn't need a transfer switch if he installs an interlock that prevents the main and generator breakers being turned on at the same time. Here is one manufacturer (I have no relationship with this company, no endorsement implied): https://www.interlockkit.com/.

 

[buickanddeere]

(quoted from post at 18:37:29 07/01/18) He doesn't need a transfer switch if he installs an interlock that prevents the main and generator breakers being turned on at the same time. Here is one manufacturer (I have no relationship with this company, no endorsement implied): https://www.interlockkit.com/.

A functional interlock kit properly installed IS a transfer switch .

 

[D beatty]

A good transfer switch is matched up to generator out put and if set up right you should never overload generator. The transfer switch you pick out what what your going to use and what generator can handle and that is the only circuits that you are hocked to. The interlock you have to shut off every breaker and only turn on ones you need and this could run into problem if you get some body that doesn't know what every thing in house requires and over load generator. My wife can use transfer switch with out me being home and not worry about over loading generator.

 

[Butch(OH)]

Yup, that's what we have. Because I was reading all kinds of differing advise on here I went to the Coop and asked if they were legal and safe. Our primary distribution point is at the last pole and meter with breakers feeding the house and barns. All they asked was since the generator is a pretty good piece away from the meter that we mark the box "generator may be in use" and mark the feed breaker plainly even though the interlock tells that story.

 

[Dusty MI]

With an inter-lock kit you hook the generator to a breaker sized to protect the generator from over load. Then with the inter-lock only the main or the generator breaker can be on at the same time.

 

[JGayman]

I'll second the Interlock Kit. I've had one in my panel for about 5 years and it has worked terrific. I had it installed by an electrician and it complies with code.