Trout Run destruction

[Anonymous-0]

Thanks to all the people who are ruining the Trout Run, Pa tractor pull. All the whining and crying around is destroying it.

 

[Anonymous-0]

What happen? I have heard alot about the Trout run pull over the past few yrs and they have alway sounded like a good time!

 

[Antique Outlaw]

I would have to agree that the focus of the club has began to shift from what got it to the fun and enjoyable club that it was. This club was basically built from the ground up and has become one of the premier pulling associations in the state, but now it seems to be "imploding" from the inside out. The club had thrived on accomodating to nearly every type puller in the area from stock to modified and it seems now that a select few individuals have managed to swing votes of other members to favor their rule changes. They have even gone as far as to deny voting rights to club members! The direction of the organization has swiftly redirected to the personal vendettas of a few to shake the very foundation that the club was built upon. Quite a shame to see the organization in this situation.

 

[Anonymous-0]

We are having problems here too!
And it is not getting any better and we are just pulling for bragging rights!

 

[Molinesam]

It's a shame that some folks can't disagree without bein' disagreeable & then engage in personnal attacks.

 

[CLIFF S]

You Know Guys I Been the Guy Trying to Get Classes For Everyone In Our Aera For Years And as Said adbove It Has Led To The Most Secuesfull Club In the Aera and Other Clubs Has Adapted this Approach!

Some May Knot Like It But There Close to NATPA Rules As You Can Get Without all the Help To TECH Every Tractor!!! Just Go to NATPA.COM and Read There Rules And Compair to What We Been Useing!!! And Mutch Better than 10 Years ago!!!
With ONE SIZE FITS ALL Rules Unless you where 1939 or Older !!! Witch is Reduclias Rule And Should Be Thrown Out! 4 People Pulled in it all Year Anywhere i Go And they All Could Be Competitive in Non Cut Or Cut!!!

The Biggest Complaint is The 5000lbs Limiting of Larger Trators into Lighter Classes and What tractors that Size Like Means!!!
This Too Is Left Over From The One size Fits All Rules That Should have Beem Resurched and Patterened after NATPA or USAP and Steped Down and let A Small Light tractor had atleast 2 classes without larger tractors and step up from there!

I Been Working to get close to uniform rules in our Aera to have Safe,Fun and Competive Pulls!

Maby I Should Stop Working On This!!

Cliff S

 

[AntiqueOutlaw]

After attending the last few meetings for the club, although I think that the rule changes that will ensue will have a negative effect on the club as a whole, the most concern that I have is that we are limiting specific members the right to vote. To my knowledge the clubs "By-Laws" have not stated a specified attendance at meetings in order to have the capability to vote. Then to send out personal letters to "lobby" specific club members on a vote that will take place at the next meeting. I must say that to take this approach and send "Lobbying" letters to select members to gain votes is a very resourceful, but being a History and Political Science Major in college and looking at our country's current Political state.....the similarities of our country's political state vs. these actions taken in a Tractor pulling club, shows me why we are where we are. Guess thats the world we live in.

 

[AntiqueOutlaw]

Cliff,

No doubt there has been a trend towards a more "streamlined" set of rules in the area, and yes, most clubs have adapted based on the Trout Run model. Thats why it is difficult to understand exactly why all of these changes are being made based on a couple peoples views, because they are getting beat! On the NATPA and USAP note, don't take me the wrong way, I don't fight you on using a modified setup of their rules, because we are very similar, no doubt, but 90% of the pullers in this area have never and probably will never pull in those circuits and they have built and purchased tractors to pull in our area. There is no doubt everyone will be happy with all the rules, but the ultimate goal is to structure the club around the majority, and as of now 10-15 members that attend these meetings do not speak for the entire membership. As the President at PATPA, I can tell you I am learning alot of "What Not to Do's" in sustaining another club, and to pass these views without the views of all is not fair to the club. If any of these agendas get pushed into PATPA, the entire membership will be made aware prior to a pull, they will have time to think about it, and there will be a special meeting just before the drivers meeting when the majority of the membership is present to make a decision of this magnitude. Just my thoughts on it. FYI, I don't think you should stop pushing for the "streamlined" set of rules for all the local clubs, because it is getting close, but it needs to be "tailored" to the tractor pullers in our area.

 

[johndeereman]

trout run is a great time id rather go there than anywhere else even though its farther to haul but this talk about rule changes has me a bit worried its the first im hearing of any jerry told me at the banquet that we were going to be using basicly the same rules as last year whats being changed cliff? also cliff and any others that attend meetings i have an idea for the three day show how about on saturday instead of the money pull which we dont get a great attendance for anyway doing the different stuff like the step on and double tree or bring something different in? maybe do a stone boat for anyone thats willing lol i know lots of people wont hook a stone boat but i see it the same as plowing no harm done to a stock tractor even coltons run there strokers on a stone boatjust an idea let me know whats going on please

 

[johndeereman]

trout run is a great time id rather go there than anywhere else even though its farther to haul but this talk about rule changes has me a bit worried its the first im hearing of any jerry told me at the banquet that we were going to be using basicly the same rules as last year whats being changed cliff? also cliff and any others that attend meetings i have an idea for the three day show how about on saturday instead of the money pull which we dont get a great attendance for anyway doing the different stuff like the step on and double tree or bring something different in? maybe do a stone boat for anyone thats willing lol i know lots of people wont hook a stone boat but i see it the same as plowing no harm done to a stock tractor even coltons run there strokers on a stone boatjust an idea let me know whats going on please

 

[johndeereman]

antique sherrif you have a descent pull there but you would get alot better attendance if you could speed it up a little i went to the points pull off and wow 6 tractors per class and it was 8 pm before you started the 7000 pound class thats whats stopping me from coming back its almost a 2 hour trip one way loaded and to have a pull last that long with such few tractors. dont get me wrong its a good track and good pull just too time consuming

 

[CLIFF S]

Ryan,

What i Ment on the Simular Rules Is A Class for All to pull with a Speed limit to Open And Most Pullers that Go to A NATPA Pull From Here Change Verry Little to Pull There!

As For Me I Have Spent More Time and Money Going to Meetings Getting Simular Rules and Pull Dates For a Calinder So All Clubs have Pullers Every Pull than I Ever Should Have!!

Knot Shure I will Do This In the Future!

I May Just Go Pull Where I Have FUN !!!

Cliff S

 

[AntiqueOutlaw]

DeereMan,

I have to agree, that we could move along faster. Unfortunenately, during the championship pull our sled broke and we lost approx. 1.5 hrs. We also did get started abit later than I would have liked to, I have been told we have made great strides vs. previous seasons and I am committed to continuing to improve that. This season we will be starting at 10am vs. 11am and if we have to start limiting hook numbers per tractor, we will. I don't like to deter pullers from hooking as much as possible because of the distances they travel, I like to create a fun place to pull for all. But to directly address your concern, I am aware of that and we will work vigorously to rectify it and keep the hooks moving.

 

[mshultz]

A little history lesson here. Prior to MAFMCA adopting MPH and cut vs. uncut classes back when we first built the sled back around 1999ish(I might be off a year or so), Buffalo Valley, MAFMCA, Hughesville, Nisbet & Antes Fort all ran classes where cuts and uncuts pulled in the SAME CLASS, and there was no speed limits - only 1st or 2nd gear classes at some places(which we all knew was a joke, but did it anyways cause it was still fun). Some places had an RPM limit/policeman, and other places didn"t. Nowhere in this part of the state was there any distinction between cut/uncut and pace classes until MAFMCA started it. As per our other discussion..... tire size/cut, and MPH is the basis of the MAFMCA rules as well as the other rules in the area, and overall it does the job of sorting tractors where they belong.

Another history lesson..... if you look back at most of these old rules, there was usually a magical manufacturers HP number (around 30-36hp) that was the cut point for tractors going below 5,000 pounds, and some of the local fairs still use this magical number to limit tractors.

I guess since I"m probably one of the tractors their picking on, I"ll just throw it out there. The old magical HP rule was the basis for my choosing to run a CC versus just going up to a DC (where parts are more plentiful, they"re easier to start(electric!), and a lot more operator friendly). I only have a 1500 pickup and a trailer rated at 7,000 pounds that I bought specicfically to be able to take my CC along with 1500 pounds of weight (get me to 5500) and go pulling with. I"ve not stripped a thing off of it to get it to 4,000 pounds other than the fenders... and that"s because the 38" tires don"t fit under my fenders(it was acutally LIGHTER before I put the tin wheels on it). If I need to start at 5,000 I"ll only get 2 classes and it"s not worth my time to drive an hour for 2 classes. I"ll never be able to get the HP that the high compression long stroked engines do - I"ve got to crank that thing by hand for crying out loud! Do I have more HP than a stock CC - sure! But so does everyone who pulls in that cut tire class. I"d bet that most of them could run 6mph if they wanted to, but they"re affraid of competition. I was actually pleasantly suprised at how well I did in 6mph when they kicked me out of the 3mph last year, and if the rules stay as they were last year I"ll probably just stay in that 6mph class if I bother coming up. I"m not out to cause trouble - just want to have a good time and go home.

I understand the rationalle behind the NATPA rules and why they group "tractor engine families" together.

 

[AntiqueOutlaw]

Mike,

You are not the only one that is going to be getting singled out on this. It was even passed in the 6 mph class. Now M's, A, G's, WD-45's and (Heres the best part) "Like Size Tractors". Biggest problem I have is what is a like size tractor? Beauty of it is that it doesn't effect where I pull, but I think that it is an "Old Time" rule that, for the most part has gone away, now all of a sudden it is infiltrating every class at TR. Very disappointing, and you wouldn't be the only one that will not be coming. I encourage you to come to PATPA if you have an opportunity, we would like to see more of you guys from MAFMCA there. Like i had mentioned above, the way that this was "Lobbied" for via "secret" mailings was also very unsettling.

 

[mshultz]

Ryan,

I've been wanting to get up to Hughsville - we used to pull up there all the time back in the 90's with Art Woolever, George Easton, and some of those other guys I haven't seen at an antique pull in years. We used to run Nisbet, Antes Fort, Hughsville, and Buffallo valley back before MAFMCA had monthly pulls. Then somehow we just got away from it - marriage, career, kids.... time just gets away on you in a hurry! My biggest problem with Hughesville and Trout Run really isn't anything rules related - it's the fact that they're on a Sunday and I have a hard time setting a good example for my kids when my actions would say that pulling is more important than God. Don't get me wrong - I've gone up to TR a few Sundays, but I don't honestly feel right about it. BV works out okay some months as we can hit church and still get to the pull, but that's not possible up your way. I mostly just go up to TR to mingle with some of the guys that come down to MAFMCA - support their pull since they support ours kind of thing. I'd like to do the same at Hughsville - just hasn't seemed to be a good time to get up there yet. I'd like to hit all the places on the calendar at least once a year if I could swing it.... but I've been saying that for the past 4 years it seems. I might not like all of the rules at some of the places I pull - heck I think we could still make some improvements to some of our MAFMCA rules/classes. But I like mingling with the people and hooking to the sled enough that I can go and pull and still have a good time even if I'm picked on a little for what I bring to hook to the sled. The only reason I wouldn't go to TR again would be if they jump me up to a class too heavy for me to haul with my trailer & truck. They can choose their rules(whether done correctly or not...) and I'll pull by them. I don't agree with the "like tractors" deal either, but if that's where they want me I'm not going to loose sleep over it.

I see too many friendships broken over this silly sport. Once in while I like to argue my points a little, but I hope it is all taken in good natured way. I can agree to disagree with people and still get along with them. I think tractor pulling is one of the greatest ways to make friends and meet new people who like the same type of stuff you like, but if it comes to the point I start loosing friends over rules, weight classes, etc. I think I'd seriously consider selling the pulling tractors - they're really not that important to make enemies over.

Take care

I've been spending way to much time typing the past couple days. Fortunately I have a student teacher now, so I have a couple extra free minutes each day. But the pile that's been on my desk for 2 months is supposed to be getting smaller and it's still getting bigger cause I'm spending my extra time on here messing around!!!

 

[johndeereman]

this is what all the fuss is about the 5000 lb limit? geesh the only one that has an argument is mschults his tractor basicly LOOKS stock as for the rest you have aluminum and have it stripped to the bone and then some as for the rule i could take it or leave it makes no difference to me i understand why its in place though i used to pull a jdb before i got my dc and a no way would i go to a pull where i had to run with m's and a's and such i dont care how much money you have you can only make a tractor so big and you guys are alot bigger to start with most of you would pull better heavy anyway those engineers knew what they were doing when they designed those tractors. antique outlaw you are running 34 inch tires put some 38's on it and see where you go then i think you would do alot better taller tire = more ground speed you might have to gear down but you would still be going faster taller tire would also give you more bars on the ground i know who they are singling out with this rule and its not either of you mschultz or antique outlaw

 

[CLIFF S]

Mike,

The 1939 and Older Class Has No Restrictions For Your Tractor at TR
I Know theres only A Few in it But the Compitoon is just as Good!

Cliff S

 

[AntiqueOutlaw]

Mike,

Not a problem there at all. I completely understand. I too will have the same dilemma when I have children, I also think that setting a good example and having them grow up in the church is important. Look forward to hearing from you soon when you get your work done.

 

[CLIFF S]

JDMan ,

The Rule that Certin Tractors Not Aloud below 5000 Has been in the Rules Since Day 1 at TR !!!

Ther Only Concern was What Tractor is as Stated Is Size Like Tractors?

There was a Lot of Consern about This!

The other Change that might get Relooked at Was to include these tractors in 6 MPH Classes!

I Think they Should Start Over and Do as NATPA Div3 and4 Dose! A Step Down Or Up how Ever you look at it and Let Smaller Tractors a class or two without a Large Engine Tractor that Can Pull higher weight!

Think about it No WC,WD,Wd45,H ,66,Etc Below 3500Lb
No CC/DC,M,A,G,Etc Below 4500Lb
No L/LA,W9,560,Etc Below 5500L
It Would Stop the Arguements And Give Everyone A Chance!!!

Cliff S

 

[CLIFF S]

Ryan and Mike Read Below

Cliff S

 

[DEERE LURE]

All i know is they are ruining the 6 mph class in TR. I thought the point of pulling the 6mph was to get your tractor as light as you could to be able to put the weights where you want them, and to be able to get your tractor in a class where you have enough power to compete! I dont have enough power to run in the heavier classes where they are gonna make my 88 run so im just not gonna bother taking it. For any body that is going to be affected by the rule changes, i highly suggest The PATPA pulls in hughesville or Twins tracks in Monroeton!!!!!!!!!!!11

 

[johndeereman]

i know about that rule in the uncut class but from reading everyones input i was under the assumption they are making all the classes that way like i said it doesnt affect me any more now than it did before but i see both sides of the argument and someone has to draw the line somewhere or you will have 150 horse tractors in the 2500 pound class eventually with enough aluminum. i also see where your going with the like size tractors but think about how many tractor manufacturers there was back then the list of like sized tractors would be horendouse if you spelled everyone out thats where people need to use a little common sense how is anyone supposed to get started in the 6 m.p.h. if they let the bigger tractors pull that light? we are not all machinists that have acces to everything and can afford to alluminize everything. yes i have put alot of money in mine but its been over the course of a few years try to get a newcomer interested and they see the competition you might as well forget it hard to please everyone sometimes you just have to make it a little more fair for people as a whole might make a few enemies in the proccess but you will end up with more friends in the long run

 

[CLIFF S]

Lisen Guys Before you Rite Off Trout Run or Talk Bad About them Remember that the Only thing That Changed Was A Rule in 6 Mph That If it Concerns You Go To The Next Meeting and Voice Your Opinion THERE!!!

Also I remember A Day last Spring that was Mainly Trout Runs Main People That Where Almost The Only Pullers That Twin Tracks Had That Day!

So Come Voice Your Opinions At The Meeting Where They Should Be Voiced!

Cliff S

 

[Anonymous-0]

Im not saying anything bad about trout run i love to pull there. I do give it too you that alot off ppl do show up from trout run and i am glad they do they are a great group of ppl to pull with but there is always alot of tractors at TWIN TRACKS pulls that dont make it to trout run. and i was also told that there would be no further discussion on the rule changes!

 

[CLIFF S]

Rules Should Be Gone over 1 Time a Year But in this 6 MPH Rule Should Have Never Been Beought Up!
I Bet Its Descussed Agian!!!