Wall St Bonus--second view

Anonymous-0

Well-known Member
I probably shouldn't reply to the earlier "bonus" post but the amount of effort, intellect and sacrifice to obtain one of these bonuses involves a price few of us would likely be willing to pay. One doesn't just show up nine to five and walk home with the bank. First, you have to be one of the best and brightest established from an early age. While the boys are playing football your pursuit is your studies.

Then degrees and work--60 or 80 hours a week and phone calls at midnight or conference calls at five AM. And the client is someone YOU find and YOU develop. They don't fall from the sky. One has to have the physical stamina and mental ability to out-fox the other foxes trying to take your scalp. Blood pressure is 185/130, cholesterol 325 and Easter or Christmas just another day on the job. There are NO vacations.
Family? No time to have a normal relationship and if one does the pressure is so great the divorce is a relief. No one wants to be around the killer attitude required. And in most case you work all year for a pittance with the "bonus" being neither for sure even promised. It depends on how well you overtake the other guy and how much profit your return for your usually publicly-held firm. Rent is $3,000 a month and job expectation expenses maybe $75,000 a year on top. Want that?

I will say many of those trapped in such an arrangement pine for the chance to breathe clean air and tinker with a planter. But they have neither the skills or prerequisite of lineage in agriculture. They actually envy the guys on this board.
From an investment perspective there are many private small town investors/farmers/housewives that turned $20,000 1970 dollars into a million 2007 dollars in a mutual fund any one of us could have bought. One just had to be willing to take the risk.
Capitalism means that any of us has the potential to choose such a path in life. Socialism means the path is chosen for us. You couldn't pay me to be one of the big-buck guys but I'm glad someone is to add to mine and the US standard of living and world competitiveness.
It allows us to pay baseball players--it is a game after all--$30 million and allows sufficient development to price some small farms in the millions. We are all blessed in this land and thank God I'm a country boy. Were it not for the above efforts, one's tractor might likely be a Belarus and planter a JD 290 wire-set from the '50's.
Don't fall for the "envy" trap that causes us to be jealous of our neighbor and vote for those who cheat the public while promising things that cannot be delivered. Stand tall.
 
Well said. Everthing comes with a price. Sometimes others pay that price for us, like what happened many many years ago today.
 
I would say that might apply to some, just as it applies to some doctors or lawyers. But I think the average Wall Street guy is just like any worker, he just is in a better position to get paid. Many are 2nd or 3rd generation. In other words, they inherited a family business. I don't think they belong on a pedestal. Sports guys have one distinction: They have to perform. I don't think they are worth the money either, but I am not paying them.
 
by chance: while I don't doubt that there're Wall St people who make their money the hard way, by earning it, they're not the ones that have us all in this mess...
The mortgage/housing bubble was deliberately generated by Alan G and the Administrations in power to avoid a slump after the dot.com bust...when the fast-money guys realised all the usual mtg loan requirements had also been relaxed, corruption and fraud crept in, and when it was successful, became rampant (liar's loans and ninja loans, etc).
Everyone-everyone-involved knew it couldn't last, but everyone was getting their money up front, laughing all the way to the bank. Now the end buyers suddenly realize they've got paper they know is worth less than it's face, but impossible to value, and everything is freezing up (little credit available, mainly to well-off people at high rates, the dollar falling into the basement, etc).
The people who pulled off frauds that'd put you and me so far back in jail they'd have to shoot us beans with a .30-.30 have all gotten, and are enjoying, their juicy bonuses, leaving-guess who?-to suffer the consequences and pick up the tab.
 
Spook--almost always, the kids want no part of the family business, if you could call it that. Just like the dairyman today. The kids want no part of the farm inheritance (except the cash) despite the rewards. No sweeter smell than drying alfalfa or grass. Tell that to a youngster.
Nope, almost everyone starts from the ground up as first or second generation immigrant. That's where the hunger is.
 
noncompos--my respects; you are very good. I'd add that I feel the mortgage and easier money stuff was intended to prevent a deflation from developing (think 1930s and dustbowl)in which the price paid was so horrendous it scarred the next two generations. No one wants that.
It got out of hand for a lot of reasons but toss in the political pressure to prevent "redlining" and to assure that "everyone" had their chance at the American dream of home ownership, even if they could not afford it.
Bubbles happen for many reasons--remember the $5,000 per cow loans available to dairy guys back in the mid '80? In the middle, everyone is just fine, much like $12 wheat today.
 
all I can say is enron . a thief is a thief no matter the clothes they wear.
and accounting is the counting of in this case money now how in hades can you get creative when you are counting( creatiuve acounting)
 
Brokers are just salesmen. A good salesman (or broker) will bring a buyer and seller together, both walk away happy and the middleman earns a fair commission. A con man misrepresents what he's selling and takes an excessive commission for cheating someone. You decide what happened in many of these cases.
 
Sorry- I have to disagree. "interest only" and ARMs arn't tools of Greenspan or the administration- they are the tools of greedy Real Estate agents and developers. Banks don't want bad paper- hell, they don't even want these houses-they can't sell 'em any mor ethan the owners could!
Let's face it, the folks that made the money on these bogus mortages were the agents and brokers-as well as the home construction folks who put 'em up just as fast as they could. Yep, blue collar folks!
As for Wall Street- their money isn't in residential homes- it's not even in Mortgages. If it's in property, it's in commercial. Most of their dough is in "thought" markets (R&D/ computer/medical) or in commodities- many of which you grow!
Now- about forclosures- no one is losing the family farm out my way. It's all folks who bought in the last 2 years, couldn't afford it then and had nothing in it when they lost it. They are renting now, and that's what they should have been doing 2 years ago. They had poor credit then, and they have poorer credit now. Most of the foreclosures here are Hispanics who were working the construction boom and making damn good money. They were sold a dream by spanish speaking agents, bought a home with no money down and stupid terms, and (since they had no equity in it) left the house when the work dried up. What do they care about credit rating- they struggle just to provide legal documentation! In Manassas Va the "english as a Second Language" classes were reduced by 80% the day that the city stopped providing school services to undocumenteds- and the neighborhoods started emptying out as well. One of the highest foreclosure rates in the country, now.
Check the legal section of the newspaper for any of the top 10 cities for foreclosures, and you'll see that the mortage bust is tied substantially to the immigration piece.
Not a conspiracy theorist, but there it is!
 
It all comes down to Greed the love of Money . Some of the loans the banks gave the the recipent only paid the intrest on loan . "Cheap loans". Neaver anything on the principle . The banks don't care if loan is ever paid off as long as they get intrest . Untill time is up then they will damand total amount . That way they Have the home or Farm and the money . Just pay off a credit card and see how many offers you get in the mail to reopen that card .
the bank and loan instutions have created this mess now let them strighten it out .
 
You seem to know alot about working on Wall Street?Someone you know must work there.We all know that they work long hours and they are very well compensated for it.

Lots of people work long hours and dont make a fraction of what the Wall Street boys do.I work two jobs and put in over 2500 hours per year.Tell doctors,farmers,and many others about long hours.

Bonuses should be given for a job well done.Wall Street did a lousy job in 2007 but their bonuses went up 6% over 2006.Goldman Sachs gave out $600,000 bonuses in 2007 which totaled 18 billion dollars.If their employees worked 3000 hours thats $200 an hour!! Where I work the bonuses are measured in pennys per hour with $1.00 per hour being max.And no I'm not jealous of Wall Street.I have no desire to ever live in New York City.

Things dont seem to being going so well now at Goldman-Sachs and Lehmans.Yesterday S&P downgraded them from stable to negative.It sure is funny that they picked a day when Wall Street was closed to do this..Alot of creative accounting has been done on Wall Street.Look at Bear Stearns.They were broke on Weds and kept on trading until Friday.The govt and Fed bent the rules last weekend in letting Morgan-Stanley buy them out for $2.36 a share.You havent seen the last of this.

The Fed has recently pumped over 400 billion dollars in to Wall Street and the home lending business.The way it looks it will take much more than this so they had better keep printing up lots more money which eventually will become worthless.

The American taxpayer doesnt appreciate having to shell out billions for corporate welfare.Maybe its time to stop all bail outs and let everyone sink or swim on their own.

The link below pretty well sums up how lots feel.
Wall Street
 
You must live within your means.

If you can't then you must change your living or your means. Don't sit there like a lump thinking it's the governments responsibility to take care of your every need.
 
No wonder you are so confused. Not every OPINION piece on the internet is true. I could find you many that say the opposite.

If you want to make the wages of a fruit picker, be a fruit picker.

If you want the wages of a Wall Street Trader, then be a Wall Street Trader.
 
Sometimes when Im ankle deep in mud in some trench in the freezing rain I think Hey I could have been a stockbroker.Its a free country.Part of the higher pay in cities has to do with putting up with going into the city every day.Im sure Im home at least several hours before them each day.It would be nice to be one of those investors that turned twenty grand into a million but that aint happening.Oh and if you think the stock guys are high stress wait till you meet the commodities traders they are totally wacked.If you cant take stress there youl last about two days on the floor and have lost about twelve grand with your head spinning.These jobs arent for everyone.
 
Jose: You"re right, as far as you go, but you stop too soon. Corrupt loan people couldn"t sell bad loans to Banks THAT HELD THEM-but the Banks re-sold them, to Wall St Houses, who "packaged" them and re-sold "slices" to end-buyers, who wanted the income stream from the mtgs. The usual requirements (down pmt, good job etc) were relaxed/ignored because everyone was getting huge commissions up front, and the risk was on the end-user. Appraisers (who didn"t get paid until loan sold)inflated values; rating agencies (paid by the Wall St Houses) gave the "slices" AAA ratings, guaranteeing them (but failing to keeep adequate reserves).
The Wall St Houses created the instruments to sell to the "market"-the final buyers-assuring them everything was AAA when some of their own people were saying the paper was junk and collapse was coming.
No, you"re not being foreclosed, and, yes, stupid people bought houses they couldn"t afford, as well as being lied to and defrauded outright, and if illegals leave, it"s a pure gain. But the people who were supposed to oversee Wall St, to avoid another 1929--the Fed, the SEC, etc etc--all either cheered everyone on (Yay, the economy"s booming!!) or looked the other way until the bubble popped. Now the dollar is trash (as you can see at the gas station, or when you buy parts) and guess who"s going to be stuck with the final bill. Email me.
 
I see that Cere has nothing but ADDS for Gold and Silver one of the worst buys on the on the market right now. I wouldn't to much faith in someone who wants you to buy Gold at over $1000 per OZ right now as you know it will drop back to around $500 or less in 6 months leaving one with a a lot Gold but.
Walt
 
"but I am not paying them." Any time you buy anything from Fruit Of The Loom, to Gatorade you are helping pay some "Sports hero's" salary.
 
Verniee,
Give me some links to current positive opinions on Wall Street.I want to see those that say the opposite.I'm willing to listen.

So if Goldman Sachs were to suddenly have financial problems,you wouldnt mind helping bail them out?
 
Well put. I do believe that the folks on top are over-compensated, but for the rank and file on Wall Street it's a high-stress occupation with the added attraction of living in the most expensive city in the US. Many of the younger guys will be working half their lives to pay off their college loans, while burdened with enormous mortgages and other costs of living that most of us can't possibly comprehend. It's a business very few people want to enter, and in which fewer yet are successful.
 
I will never be convinced that anything that takes place on Wall Street actually has any value. When you get down to it they are trading upon someone"s best guess as to what the actual value of what they are trading is, and no one really knows what the value is. The reason being most things are hyped, truth concealed, and/or a dozen other reasons. Wall Street is MODERN DAY VOODOO practiced everyday at the clang of the bell. Animal manure has more potential to yield something of value.
 
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