Welders??? What's the difference between....

[Anonymous-0]

A normal arc welder and an inverter welder? What is/are the advantage/s of one over the other? Was just reading on another forum where someone was asking the best thing for a beginner to teach themselves. Folks said that the inverter didn't stick the rods and was easier to use/used less electrecity (current??).

Just wondering.


Dave

 

[Stu]

Most "typical" welders use AC to weld with. An inverter welder uses DC to weld with. AC welders are cheaper, but not as versitile. Welding with DC is much smother than AC. When I only had access to a "buzz box" you could not give me 7018 rods, but that is about all I use after getting a DC welder. I have a Miller 450 power source that works with mig, tig and stick. It is the easiest welder I have used to weld with. Most imoprtant thing to remember, is make suse the weld area and ground connection area is clean. This causes more problems than anything. Get some steel and start burning rods, it just take practice. Stu.

 

[MarkB_MI]

First, what is a "normal" welder? Traditional welders use transformers to step down voltage and step up current. They may be AC only, DC only or AC/DC. They may be constant current (stick/TIG) or constant voltage (MIG), but seldom both.

Inverter welders use solid state switches to convert high-voltage AC input to low-voltage DC. Elimination of the transformer windings makes them lighter than comparable transformer welders. Because they are more efficient than transformer welders, they can frequently work off 120 volts while providing more current than typical 120 volt welders. Most can run off either 120 or 240 just be changing plugs. Many are multi-process (CC/CV), so you can use the same welder for stick, MIG or TIG. Some are capable of AC output for TIG welding aluminum.

So, in other words, inverter units are potentially better in every way, EXCEPT PRICE. Reliability may be an issue with some models; I would never buy a used inverter unit.

What is easiest to use? Assuming you stay away from Harbor Freight junk, any welder can produce a good weld. The more money you spend, the more capable the welder. But a better weldER doesn't make YOU a better weldOR.

What's the best to own? Depends on your budget and requirements. For portability, nothing beats an inverter unit. But you can by a very nice TIG/Stick transformer welder for the price of a comparable inverter, and still have money left over for a MIG welder.

 

[trucker 40]

I think that the difference is that an inverter is like a thing that you can get for say a big truck,that you plug into the cigarette lighter or hook directly to the batteries,that turns 12 or 24 volts into house current. They made a welder using the same idea.Only that instead of having alternating current to weld with,you have DC current to weld with,but its plugged into an alternating current outlet.I don't know how an inverter welder welds,I haven't used one.DC will weld 7018 way better than AC will.Actually DC is what 7018 is made for.

 

[IH2444]

Yep you got it right.

 

[Brad Buchanan]

AC 'buzz box' welders are generally reasonably priced arguably the most durable machines made.

I own a mig welder but if I really want the most strength in a weld I use the stick welder. DC welders are somewhat eaiser to use under certain conditions but there are few instances of general welding that cannot be accomplished with an AC welder and the right technique.

Go ahead, throw the stones boys...I can take it!

Brad

 

[DBAF]

Couple questions. I am no great welder, but I seem to get along fine with 7018 and a buzz box if it's thick steel. It does seem a little stickey until I get it going, but I like the results. 6011 works good for me on thinner steel, but doesn't look as good to me most of the time.

 

[Stan in Oly, WA]

Brad,

You ought to cover up when you're arc welding. The burn you get never turns into a tan. It does increase your chance of skin cancer, though, just like a sunburn.

Stan

 

[trucker 40]

Nothing wrong with a Buzz Box type welder.A DC welder is easier to use 7018 with,and does a better job of welding,but for a lot less money you can weld with a Buzz Box too and get a good weld. 6011 is a fast freeze rod and works good for rusty dirty steel.It is made for that Buzz Box type welder.Its not a real purty weld,but its good for mild steel Of course you can also grind it clean and get a better weld with it.Its just that it makes it possible to weld rusty dirty stuff that you cant get to very good to clean,like when you are fixing something.
Actually,a way to fix thicker steel is run a root pass at the bottom of your veed out pieces and grind the slag off then run 7018 uphill passes until the groove is filled.That way it burns all of the oil and grease off of the metal and deeply penetrates full through the piece because its deep penetrating and then your 7018 over it is medium penetration and made on clean metal which it likes a lot better.

 

[Anonymous-0]

Conventional transformer welders that have been around forever operate at the typical 60 cycles(Hertz),the same as most other electric apparatus. Inverters operate at much higher frequencies(10,000 to 20,000+ Hz) by use of advanced electronics. This allows several advantages. The transformer can be much smaller and is much more efficient because there is less energy loss due to heat at the ultra high frequency. The higher frequency provides a very stable arc. There are some disadvantages as well. Inverters can be very costly to repair. Some operators prefer conventional machines for MIG welding. Not all inverters are created equal. Miller typically has the best(and most reliable) inverter power sources on the market. I know a shop that claimed to save $18,000 a month by switching 22 conventional machines over to XMT 304 Miller inverters. Almost $1000 a month per machine is a huge savings! A Miller XMT 304 is comparable in specs. to a conventional Miller Dimension 302 machine but is about 1/6 the physical size. Both are premium industrial machines and very close in price. The Dimension 302 weighs 361 pounds while the XMT 304 weighs 79.5 pounds. Inverters will also work on single or 3 phase input power although there may be some derating. If you want a 110 volt stick welder, go with an inverter because it will have DC current and actually weld very nice compared to ANY of the useless POS 110 volt AC stick welders. A 220 machine is still better because it will burn larger rods. Most Plasma torches are inverter based as well.

 

[Anonymous-0]

A hot spark lands on his arm causing him to jump, which it turn causes him to knock over the uncapped cylinder, which in turn goes flying toward the paint and other chemicals on the nearby shelf, which causes at least one of them to burst open, which causes flammable liquids to fly back on him, which ignites because the rag on the bench is now on fire from dropping the stinger on it... but not to worry because his buzz box never skipped a beat!

 

[Brad Buchnan]

Right on all counts!!! Thought someone would get a kick out of that.

Brad

 

[rustyfarmall]

(quoted from post at 06:04:02 03/11/11) Right on all counts!!! Thought someone would get a kick out of that.

Brad

Brad, the only thing lacking in that picture is a couple of cinder blocks holding up the workbench. :lol: 'Course if you really want to make it interesting, you should lose the shirt, put on a pair of cut-off blue jeans, and swap out the boots for a pair of flip-flops. :lol: 8) :wink:

 

[Puddles]

These inverters are pretty slick! The low cost ones have a fixed “Hot Start”, and “Arc Force”, “Dig”, “Chopper Technology”, “Anger Management Knob”, what ever the catchy term of the day is the manufacture wants to pin on it. But the high end costly ones are really impressive! They have adjustable Hot Start, and Arc Force. It is amazing what they can do with the AC. Adjustable balance, and frequency. I predict in another 10 years all you'll have to do is type in what kind of weld you want the machine to do, and walk away! :lol:

 

[bison]

try 1714's,you will like them

 

[Brad Buchanan]

You 'haint seen nuffin' yet....Iffin yer good I'll show you my straw hat hood!!

Brad

 

[trucker 40]

Also a blaze going from the wood table top burning the hair off of his arm.

 

[trucker 40]

Oops!Might not be a wood table top,so he can soak the rag in solvent or something and put it where it will catch on fire and burn the hair on his arm!

 

[36 Coupe]

Good OHSA poster.

 

[eastexan]

(quoted from post at 09:29:27 03/11/11) try 1714's,you will like them

Bison, if you mean 7014, I agree with you 100%.
They go down smooth and plenty strong with medium penetration.

 

[eastexan]

(quoted from post at 18:12:42 03/10/11) So, in other words, inverter units are potentially better in every way, EXCEPT PRICE. Reliability may be an issue with some models; I would never buy a used inverter unit.

What is easiest to use? Assuming you stay away from Harbor Freight junk, any welder can produce a good weld. The more money you spend, the more capable the welder. But a better weldER doesn't make YOU a better weldOR.

Like you, I tend to shy away from some Harbor Freight items. But they have a little low priced inverter welder that has rave reviews from many who have bought them. They're always on sale for $139 or less.

I'm thinking about getting one of these myself.
http://www.harborfreight.com/80-amp-inverter-arc-welder-91110.html

 

[scotc]

Sounds like the crap they put on "1000 ways to die".