Will this work

[cjunrau]

I guess I’ve been lucky.
My well system is completely sealed and the water comes from 200 feet in the ground so how is harmful bacteria suppose to get into the water in the first place to start growing.

Educate me on this subject.

Not hard to add bacteria to a well if run off water can somehow get into it from the top, or from leaching through the soil. I for one don't care about the bacteria as in 50+ years I know of nobody who has gotten sick from bacteria in a well, or well water that we drink. Our wells are as little as 10 ft deep. Mine is 8 ft deep.

As far as getting hot water to the other end of your house. My brother had a circulating pump to do that when he built 20 years ago. you should insulate that line so as not to loose to much heat from it. If you heat with electric it won't make any difference except in summer when you don't want the extra heat in the house. You would even notice it If you would insulate that hot line without a pump. My hot water line to my washroom is 45 ft long. It runs in an open crawl space. The wood furnace is sunk in lower so all the heat from the furnace heats up the crawl space first. When the fire is going all day and I take water in the evening it is warm almost right away. In the morning it is cold. I turn the hot on in the sink a minute before I jump in the shower and that fixes it for me. I do know it takes awhile to get to full heat even if it is warm in a minute(probably only30 seconds). I will probably insulate it some day but it doesn't bother me much the way it is.

 

[504]

Just buy the cheap 110v water heater on line and hook it up in the shower room. It will only run when you turn the water on and you can set your big heater where ever you want it. I have had 1000.00 dollar heater and the one in my house now costs 300.00 and it runs two showers at the same time (gas)

 

[jhwis]

I have a 50 gallon water heater within a couple of feet of my master bathroom so hot water is not a problem here.
My kitchen is the next room over plus my dishwasher has a water heater in it.
So if this was the end of the story I could set my water heater very low saving money.

The problem is I have a second bathroom with a shower and clothes washer in it.
It takes the hot water several minutes to reach this room as it clears all the pipes of cold water in the entire house.
I realize a hot water circulation setup would be best but this will not allow me to turn the water heater way down.
So I am thinking of adding a small under the counter tankless water heater where the line comes into the room.
It will heat the cold water as the lines get purged. Then it could supplement the warm water to make it hot enough for the clothes washer and shower.

My question is will the savings in turning the electric water heater down say 20 degrees pay for the under the counter tankless heater as this is the only room I need extra hot water for because of the shower and clothes washer.

How much money are we talking about saving? It seems like peanuts in the overall scheme of things. Electricity is cheap.

 

[john in la]

Not hard to add bacteria to a well if run off water can somehow get into it from the top, or from leaching through the soil.

Like I said before my well is completely sealed to ground water. The only way bacteria can get into the water is if it came from 230 feet in the ground.

My well is a 2 inch pvc pipe 230 feet in the ground. The water level in the open pipe is 2 to 3 feet below ground level.
On the top of this 2 inch pipe is a glued cap with a 1 inch hole in the center. A 1 inch pvc pipe is glued into this hole and goes down about 100 feet inside the 2 inch pipe.

While water 230 feet in the ground may have naturally occurring bacteria such as iron bacteria these types of bacteria are harmless to humans.
And I would think a well 230 feet deep and 250 feet from my septic system would have enough dirt to filter out any pathogenic bacteria that might be present on the surface.

So it stands to reason if no pathogenic bacteria can get into my well pressure tank then no bacteria can get into my water heater tank.

If you feel my thinking is wrong and pathogenic bacteria could be present in water 200 feet in the ground please educate me.

 

[john in la]

How much money are we talking about saving? It seems like peanuts in the overall scheme of things. Electricity is cheap.

Turning down the water heater is an after thought and really is not necessary.

Having hot water to this room before the washing machine tub fills is the main concern.
This would also help water wasted waiting on hot water to take a shower.

As I said in the original post a hot water circulating system is probably my best answer. Something I could turn on and off as one reply suggested. I was just thinking an instant water heater that heats the cold water in the line until the hot water from the tank can get there would be another option.

I don’t understand how a small water heater in this room would help for the shower as some suggested.
First you get hot water from the small tank.
Then you get cold water from the line filling this small tank.
Then you get hot water from the main tank.
That is unless you think 2 gallons of hot water is enough to take a shower.
But I can see how this small tank would help the washing machine.

 

[jhwis]

Turning down the water heater is an after thought and really is not necessary.

Having hot water to this room before the washing machine tub fills is the main concern.
This would also help water wasted waiting on hot water to take a shower.

As I said in the original post a hot water circulating system is probably my best answer. Something I could turn on and off as one reply suggested. I was just thinking an instant water heater that heats the cold water in the line until the hot water from the tank can get there would be another option.

I don’t understand how a small water heater in this room would help for the shower as some suggested.
First you get hot water from the small tank.
Then you get cold water from the line filling this small tank.
Then you get hot water from the main tank.
That is unless you think 2 gallons of hot water is enough to take a shower.
But I can see how this small tank would help the washing machine.

I agree on the small tank not helping on the shower. The tankless heaters of the past were maintenance headaches. I can't speak of current ones.

 

[john in la]

I agree on the small tank not helping on the shower. The tankless heaters of the past were maintenance headaches. I can't speak of current ones.

I looked at a circular system that runs hot water back to the tank via the already existing cold water line.
Now in looking at the system that uses a separate 3rd line to return the water to the tank. I think I like this system better.

Picking out the pump for each is where I’m at as a pump for system A will not work on system B and vise versa.

 

[Willow Lane]

Have you looked at a heat pump water heater? It won't solve your waiting problem, but it will save money heating the water.

 

[showcrop]

How much money are we talking about saving? It seems like peanuts in the overall scheme of things. Electricity is cheap.

Maybe where you are.

 

[Nordic]

John in la: I would challenge you to try one of those 2.5 gallon in line heaters that runs on 120 V (with adjustable heat setting). I don't think you would be disappointed. They only cost around $200 with a very simple install. We have 3/4" copper all through the house, no insulation on the copper lines, in a big house. My wife is absolutely thrilled with this great improvement. Once we turn the tap on, as I said earlier, we have hot water at the count of five, hot enough you can't keep your fingers there. it never cools down while the water is on the way from the hotwater tank, I call it 'seamless', what more could you want? The tank comes with a warranty as well.

 

[Ray,IN]

I guess I’ve been lucky.
My well system is completely sealed and the water comes from 200 feet in the ground so how is harmful bacteria suppose to get into the water in the first place to start growing.

Educate me on this subject.

https://southernlouisianawater.com/wp-content/uploads/TCEQ_Well_Disinfection.pdf

 

[MarkB_MI]

https://southernlouisianawater.com/wp-content/uploads/TCEQ_Well_Disinfection.pdf

I follow the process on that document, more or less, but I only let the chlorinated water sit in my pipes for a couple of hours. Anything the bleach hasn't killed in two hours probably won't be killed in another day. Also, if you have a water softener it's important to put it in bypass while you do the chlorination, as high chlorine levels can damage the resin bed. Flip the bypass back to normal before flushing with fresh water; there'll be enough residual chlorine in the well water to sanitize the water softener when you flush out the system. You'll want to take the screens out of your faucets before flushing, as all kinds for nasty stuff will come out.

 

[Russ from MN]

Turning down the water heater is an after thought and really is not necessary.

Having hot water to this room before the washing machine tub fills is the main concern.
This would also help water wasted waiting on hot water to take a shower.

As I said in the original post a hot water circulating system is probably my best answer. Something I could turn on and off as one reply suggested. I was just thinking an instant water heater that heats the cold water in the line until the hot water from the tank can get there would be another option.

I don’t understand how a small water heater in this room would help for the shower as some suggested.
First you get hot water from the small tank.
Then you get cold water from the line filling this small tank.
Then you get hot water from the main tank.
That is unless you think 2 gallons of hot water is enough to take a shower.
But I can see how this small tank would help the washing machine.

I have a small water heater near my shower, with 35 feet of 3/4 water line to the main 50 gallon heater, when I take a shower I barely notice any temperature change.

 

[Ray,IN]

I follow the process on that document, more or less, but I only let the chlorinated water sit in my pipes for a couple of hours. Anything the bleach hasn't killed in two hours probably won't be killed in another day. Also, if you have a water softener it's important to put it in bypass while you do the chlorination, as high chlorine levels can damage the resin bed. Flip the bypass back to normal before flushing with fresh water; there'll be enough residual chlorine in the well water to sanitize the water softener when you flush out the system. You'll want to take the screens out of your faucets before flushing, as all kinds for nasty stuff will come out.

It requires time to kill the biofilm that forms on hard surfaces, as it is killed in layers in contact with chlorine.

https://www.cleanwaterstore.com/resource/how-to-guides/how-much-chlorine-to-add-to-storage-tank-to-kill-bacteria/

 

[showcrop]

It requires time to kill the biofilm that forms on hard surfaces, as it is killed in layers in contact with chlorine.

https://www.cleanwaterstore.com/resource/how-to-guides/how-much-chlorine-to-add-to-storage-tank-to-kill-bacteria/

I read all through the article. I didn't see anything about biofilm or layers. Just about testing concentration, maintaining a chlorine level by adding when it goes down.

 

[Ray,IN]

I read all through the article. I didn't see anything about biofilm or layers. Just about testing concentration, maintaining a chlorine level by adding when it goes down.

Your last sentence pertains to the treatment of biofilm.
It might not be addressed in the article, but I assure you it is a proven fact, and must be killed in layers as each comes it contact with chlorine. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10117668/
and an easier to understand version: https://biofilm.montana.edu/biofilm-basics/what_are_biofilms.html

 

[showcrop]

Your last sentence pertains to the treatment of biofilm.
It might not be addressed in the article, but I assure you it is a proven fact, and must be killed in layers as each comes it contact with chlorine. https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10117668/
and an easier to understand version: https://biofilm.montana.edu/biofilm-basics/what_are_biofilms.html

That is a looong stretch

 

[Fixingfarmer]

When something is worked on is when it’s most likely introduced 200 feet down off your hands if you had the pump out touching something. You shouldn’t have to worry about this part. However it is the easiest place sometimes to access and get ahead or where you have worked on plumbing.

When we work on the well we just shake some chlorine tablets in there and find something else to drink for a week it’s not a big deal.

If your well has an access hole and you have done some major plumbing that’s probably wise to shake some in as well and just move on with the next thing it’s one of those if you are right clap clap clap good for you we won’t ever know. If he’s right you end up sick. Chlorine pellets are cheap.

 

[john in la]

When something is worked on is when it’s most likely introduced 200 feet down off your hands if you had the pump out touching something. You shouldn’t have to worry about this part. However it is the easiest place sometimes to access and get ahead or where you have worked on plumbing.

When we work on the well we just shake some chlorine tablets in there and find something else to drink for a week it’s not a big deal.

If your well has an access hole and you have done some major plumbing that’s probably wise to shake some in as well and just move on with the next thing it’s one of those if you are right clap clap clap good for you we won’t ever know. If he’s right you end up sick. Chlorine pellets are cheap.

Like I have said my well is completely sealed and has been sealed since it was drilled in the late 70’s. The only reason I would have to open the well is to replace the foot valve on the end of the suction pipe.
There is no way for me to get chlorine or anything else down the well unless I go to cutting pipes.
Between the pump and the top of the well is a check valve so once the water comes out the well it can not get back into the well to contaminate anything.

I looked online about shocking a well and everything I see is for wells that have a removable cover with a 4+ inch pipe and the pump down in the well. I couldn’t find one setup like mine anywhere.

Like I have also said for bacteria to enter my well it would have to come from 200 feet in the ground and while rust may be present I find it hard to believe E. coli bacteria could get down that far.
And since my well pump pressure tank and pipe are all sealed from the check valve to my kitchen sink faucet I find it hard to believe that any surface bacteria could get in my system unless it got in while I was working on the system.

While none of us has ever been sick from drinking our water you guys got me scared so I am going to call my local health department next week and ask them about a water test.

 

[1948CaseVAI]

Like I said before my well is completely sealed to ground water. The only way bacteria can get into the water is if it came from 230 feet in the ground.

"Completely sealed" is a fantasy. No such thing. Don't let pride cause you to make bad decisions.