A couple of oil filter housing questions

[sharptailhunter]

My 47 H ran out of fuel in the pasture one day and before I could get it refueled and out of the pasture my steers had destroyed ALL the wiring. Even the battery cables were chewed up. So, I got it into the shop and I figured now is a good time to do a few of the things Ive been neglecting since I bought the tractor last year. Im going to convert it to 12v and rewire it. Yes, I know some people will scoff at the 12v conversion.

While Im waiting on those parts I thought I would change the oil and the other fluids. For the life of me I cant get the oil filter housing drain plug out. I took the housing off the engine so I can maybe put some heat to the plug. It has already been rounded off by someone else using pliers or something. When I removed it, I noticed there isnt a gasket between the housing and the engine block. I tried to find one online but I cant seem to locate one. Is there supposed to be a gasket there? I have so many oil leaks on this thing its hard to tell where theyre all coming from but there is a lot of old oil around where that housing attaches to the engine block. Secondly, any tips on how to get that dang drain plug out? Lastly, what do I replace it with once I have it out?

 

[fastfarmall]

WOW, those darn pliers,what i would do is grind the old plug off flat, then enter punch it in the center,try drilling it out,i realize its a small plug,start small and slow and work up,use heat when u try the eazy out!! Even the wax trick might work, it worked for me on a diff thing,i let it sit over nite, and used my fingers to turn it out!

 

[used red MN]

If you do not have a welder find someone who does
that will help you out. Find a hex nut that will go over it
properly a 1/2 thread and weld it on. Let it cool 30
seconds or so and turn it out. The plug is just a normal
NPT 1//4 in I believe. Get one in the black pipe section
of a hardware store. Almost bet the gasket it on the
block. It is just smashed down and hard. Here is a link
to a place that has them. Also I am including the CNHI factory online parts diagram link where I looked up the number.
Gasket

Farmall H CNHI online parts diagrams

 

[caterpillar guy]

With a set of vice grips just squeeze them as tight as you can get them and it wil probably come out . Then don't tighten the sh out of it like the last guy did. Al it needs to be is a snug. They do make hex head pipe plugs and brass plugs for those type of jobs. I would go with the hex plug . Yes there is a gasket at the joint ans it is probably about as hard as the casting now 70-75 years later or more. There is a gaske remover you can spry on it will help if left for a wee bit to soak in as it drys. There should be a gasket ring in the base for the shell to set on. Most times there are more than one or they don't get changed since it is hard to dig them out of the groove. I use a nail sharp punch or something like that. I also don't change them every time I change oil either.

 

[Dave BN]

Is this the original oil filter set up? If so that plug really doesn't
need to come out. You will only get a tea spoon or so of oil out of it.
The gasket is probably still in there as already said. A new one will
come with your new filter. Also, as said below, I use a small sharpened
nail to drive into the old hard gasket and pull it out. Clean the groove
that the gasket sits in. I use a small flat screw driver with a rag on
the blade and just go around and around the groove until it's clean.
Maybe put some oil on the rag to capture the dirt and crud. I wouldn't
worry about the small plug too much as you might make a bigger problem
trying to get it out. Again, all of this is if you have the original oil
filter set up.
Dave

 

[sharptailhunter]

Thank you for the replies. It is the original filter housing. I tried using vise grips but it is so rounded off that they cant really clamp onto it. I have a welder so Ill weld a nut in there tomorrow when I have some time. Thank you for the gasket link. I was just going to make my own if I couldnt find the correct gasket. Now if I could locate a new generator belt Id be set. I must be doing something wrong because I cant find one on this site or even the other supply place. Im going to try my local NAPA and see if they have one. Thanks again guys!

 

[rustyfarmall]

I own and use a couple of Hs and an M. I grew up driving my dad's H, and did many of the oil changes it needed.

I have NEVER removed that drain plug. When the engine is not running, nearly ALL of the oil drains back down into the oil pan. A very small amount remains in the filter housing, which can be wiped out with a rag if desired or just ignored.

 

[dhermesc]

I think he is talking about the gasket between the oil filter housing and the engine block - not the rubber gasket for the canister.

 

[redforlife]

Don't worry about the drain plug. I've
never heard of ANYONE messing with taking
it out, at time of oil change. Not sure why
it was even put there. Your not going to
get more than a cap full of more oil to
drain out of there, once the filter has
been removed.

I'll keep my 12 volt conversion thoughts to
myself. But, I will say this. There's not
much wiring on an H. Even if your steers
ate ALL of it up, it sure wouldn't take
much to put it back on the way it was. Kind
of pointless to do a 12 volt conversion,
just because of that. In my opinion. I
won't say nothing more on that. Your mind
is already made up, the way it sounds.

 

[sharptailhunter]

I know there are heated opinions on 12v conversions. I also know there's not much to the wiring on these old tractors. The generator on it wasn't working and I was tired of jumping it every time I wanted to use. IMO it doesn't make sense to spend more money to have the generator fixed than what a conversion will cost. Honestly, I think the argument as to whether or not one should convert it to 12v or leave it at 6v is a point that some people will never give up on and at the end of the day it truly does not matter one bit. I'm not going to do a show quality restoration. What does it matter to anyone if my tractor runs on 6v or 12v? More importantly to me is that I'm stilling using the tractor to do farm chores and that makes me happy.

I agree that the drain plug on the oil filter housing seems inconsequential and I'm probably not going to fuss over it. I know there was an oil leak between the filter housing and the engine block so I still want to replace that gasket and see if that fixes the leak. I also know that I could spend the rest of my days chasing leaks on this thing, haha.

 

[sharptailhunter]

I know there are heated opinions on 12v conversions. I also know there's not much to the wiring on these old tractors. The generator on it wasn't working and I was tired of jumping it every time I wanted to use. IMO it doesn't make sense to spend more money to have the generator fixed than what a conversion will cost. Honestly, I think the argument as to whether or not one should convert it to 12v or leave it at 6v is a point that some people will never give up on and at the end of the day it truly does not matter one bit. I'm not going to do a show quality restoration. What does it matter to anyone if my tractor runs on 6v or 12v? More importantly to me is that I'm stilling using the tractor to do farm chores and that makes me happy.

I agree that the drain plug on the oil filter housing seems inconsequential and I'm probably not going to fuss over it. I know there was an oil leak between the filter housing and the engine block so I still want to replace that gasket and see if that fixes the leak. I also know that I could spend the rest of my days chasing leaks on this thing, haha.

 

[redforlife]

Probably best for you to convert.

I agree, 12 volt conversions, inline gas
filters, and carb rebuilds, are constantly
beat to death on this site in discussions.
Either one is for those things or oposed,
and seemingly not convinced otherwise. So
no need in arguing about it.

I just hate hearing of people on here (not
saying you in particular), just people in
general, say they are going to do a 12v
conversion, and likely don't know what they
currently got (a 6v positive ground system
and perhaps with a cut out), and don't
understand how it works. And might just
need new brushes in the generator, or a
good ground back at the light switch (cut
outs require a good ground at the switch).
Something real simple as that, may very
well be all that is wrong with it. Would
work just fine if a person took the time to
understand it, figure it out, and do some
minor repair.
I just hate hearing of people doing more
than they have to, to overcome a problem.
And spending more money than they need to,
to accomplish it.

And bottom line, when it is all said and
done, the 12v battery is basically just as
likely as a 6v battery to be dead after
tractor sitting for 6 months without being
started.

For what it's worth, 80 percent of the
conversions I have seen, have not been
complete conversions. People cut corners,
or do poor jobs on it, big time. And end up
having the same amount of grief as they had
before. You see just as many, or more post
on here, on how do I fix my conversion, as
you do on, how do I do a conversion. Just
to make a point.

Usually, doing more than you have to, just
leads to more trouble. Been my experience.
Don't fix what ain't broke. And one more
other thing, is quality. Got to be careful
about replacing things, in this cheaper and
lesser quality of the new products world we
live in today. Example - - My 1940's IHC
refrigerator still works. A new replacement
would be lucky to last 8 years.

 

[rustyfarmall]

I used to be one of those who thought the original 6 volt system was all an H ever needed and there was no reason to change it.

My opinion has changed somewhat. I have a 1950 H, all original 6 volt system that cranks over and starts so quickly that it is sometimes a surprise. I will never modify that tractor.

On the other hand I have a 1940 H, also original 6 volt system, and this tractor is currently parked because I don't need it, but If I were to start using it again, the first thing I'd do is convert it to 12 volts.

 

[sharptailhunter]

I hear ya on conversions done poorly. I had an old Willys Jeep that someone did a really shoddy job of wiring and trying to convert it to an alternator. It took a good bit of time and effort to get that all sorted out. I really was going to keep it 6v but one of the steers pulled the negative battery cable off and it shorted out on the frame and ruined the battery. Probably a good thing there wasnt any fuel left in it actually. Since a new 6v battery was actually more than a 12v and the generator was shot, I just decided it was time to make the switch. I actually dont have anything against 6v systems. If I were younger and had more time and money, I would have done a really nice and complete restoration on this tractor and if I were to do that, I would have for sure kept it at 6v. Alas, I dont have the time or money to do that and I dont want to stop using it during all that time it would take. I have learned to keep the steers away from it though!!

Back to the original reason for the post, I suspect the reason for the drain plug on the oil filter housing is to be able to drain the oil from the oil filter right after one has run the engine to warm up the oil and to suspend debris in the oil prior to draining the oil for an oil change. I see thats how Pete on a YouTube channel I follow does his oil changes as part of his annual tractor maintenance. Seems to make sense but I can also see where its probably not a necessity.

 

[redforlife]

Probably the difference between having a
voltage regulator, instead of a cut-out.
Your 50 H likely has a voltage regulator.
Your 40 H likely has a cut-out.

The cut-outs look like a voltage regulator
externally. But if you take the cap/cover
off of it, you'll find that it only has one
set of points inside. And if you trace one
of the wires, it'll lead back to, and be
connected to the light switch. That is a
ground wire controlled by light switch. For
charging system to work, the light switch
has to be properly grounded.

The number one cause of a cut-out charging
system to not work, is the light switch is
not adequately grounded. The switch has to
be adequately grounded to ampe box lid.
Ampe box lid adequately grounded to ampe
box. Ampe box adequately grounded to
steering post. Steering post adequately
grounded to tractor. Anyways, a bad or
rusty connection through all that, equals
light switch not grounded. Light switch not
grounded, equals charging system won't
charge. That's the first thing I would
check out if a cut-out system is not
working.

A voltage regulator eliminates all that BS
with the light switch. It operates
independently and requires NOTHING to be
controlled by way of the light switch. A
light switch on a cut-out system, controls
the high and low charge of the generator,
in conjuction with turning lights on. The
position in between OFF and DIM LIGHTS, is
for high charge. Off setting for lights, is
also the low charge setting for generator.
If lights are on at all, dim or bright, the
charging system is also on high charge.

I hope you come back and read this reply.
Hope I didn't type all of this for nothing.