IH 444 with unknown loader??

[Analyte]

I'm picking up an IH 444 tomorrow that needs some work, but it is a BD154 Diesel so it will go well with my current IH 276 project I'm working on.

It's not in bad shape overall, but I don't recognize the loader that's on it. It's definitely not a 2050, but beyond that my google searches have come up short on anything similar.

Anyone know what loader brand this is, or could it be homemade? It's missing some parts so hoping to get a manual or something to see what's needed.

A couple extra pics of the piping below the seat and a rear pipe that is capped off.

Thanks

 

[Analyte]

Been searching here a while, and it seems to have some similarities to the Oliver but not a perfect match I don't think ..

 

[wore out]

I'm picking up an IH 444 tomorrow that needs some work, but it is a BD154 Diesel so it will go well with my current IH 276 project I'm working on.

It's not in bad shape overall, but I don't recognize the loader that's on it. It's definitely not a 2050, but beyond that my google searches have come up short on anything similar.

Anyone know what loader brand this is, or could it be homemade? It's missing some parts so hoping to get a manual or something to see what's needed.

A couple extra pics of the piping below the seat and a rear pipe that is capped off.

Thanks

Bears some resemblance to a "Midwest" or "Davis" loader, IMHO.

 

[Analyte]

Bears some resemblance to a "Midwest" or "Davis" loader, IMHO.

Thank you, I'll look those up.

Its weird, I found a YouTube video with a IH444 with loader that looks just like it. Unfortunately, it's years old and they don't mention the brand/model.

 

[Analyte]

While researching Davis and Midwest, I found links with what appears to be the loader on this tractor. It all looks correct, tabs and all, for a Bush Hog Freeman 2/3000 loader based on the tabs to connect to the bucket . I found some brochures with the Freeman 2/3000 on a 444, and all the brackets seem to match up.

I'll focus on the mechanical repairs needed first to get it running solid, and then I'll start on the loader. Looks like some brackets are missing as well as cylinders/ hand controls, but a welder can solve many problems.

 

[caterpillar guy]

Looks like an old trip bucket on there. Those were fun if you didn't get it right it would not come back up to latch without needing to lower it to the ground enough to roll the bucket back up to latch.

 

[JimB2]

I agree with the Freeman 2/3000 loader on your 444. Dad had a Freeman loader on his JD 420U back in the late 1950s early 1960s, it looked similar to your loader with the manual trip bucket and as @caterpillar guy says about the trip bucket. When Dad traded the JD 420 for an IH 434 with an IH 1501 loader with hydraulic bucket, it was such an improvement especially for rooting out stones and stumps, etc.
The extra hydraulic lines, it would appear that by opening and closing the correct valves the hydraulic pump flow can be directed to that capped line at the rear to a remote valve like on a log splitter, the return line would go into the hydraulic filler plug behind the seat. Make sure any additional valves that are connected via that connection have an internal relief valve or you could damage the hydraulic pump.

 

[Analyte]

Thanks for the additional information, I was wondering about that capped line.

So a trip bucket means it's fixed? Is it possible to just add an additional cylinder for the bucket to adjust as well? I'll have to buy a new control manifold for it anyway, and you are correct that makes the loader much more useful.

 

[JimB2]

Thanks for the additional information, I was wondering about that capped line.

So a trip bucket means it's fixed? Is it possible to just add an additional cylinder for the bucket to adjust as well? I'll have to buy a new control manifold for it anyway, and you are correct that makes the loader much more useful.

On the part that went on the back of the bucket that the latch pin went into had several bolt holes that you could adjust the angle of the bucket to be level, tipped downward/upward but very inconvenient. When loading manure, earth, usually go into pile with bucket tip down and curl bucket up to hold the load.

 

[Jim Becker]

Looks like you have a LOT of galvanized water pipe fittings in your hydraulic system. They really shouldn't be used in hydraulics. Two reasons: they aren't designed for that much pressure, galvanizing can flake off the inside and cause problems in the hydraulics. I'm not saying it needs to be torn off and redone immediately. But keep it in mind when you do any work on the hydraulics.

(I won't claim I haven't done the same when they were the only parts available!)

 

[Analyte]

Looks like you have a LOT of galvanized water pipe fittings in your hydraulic system. They really shouldn't be used in hydraulics. Two reasons: they aren't designed for that much pressure, galvanizing can flake off the inside and cause problems in the hydraulics. I'm not saying it needs to be torn off and redone immediately. But keep it in mind when you do any work on the hydraulics.

(I won't claim I haven't done the same when they were the only parts available!)

I picked it up today, and talking with the gentlemen his emergency repairs became long term fixes, lol. It is indeed a Freeman 2000 loader and the year of the tractor is 69 based on the serial. Overall good shape, just neglected.

He tried to rebuild the started and dropped some of the pieces damaging them, and then he tried to weld on the stator. When he realized the shaft was bent, he just walked away from the tractor. He did steal the alternator for another emergency repair on another so I'll need one of those as well.

The motor is free, but I'll need to order it some parts. Then the dash is a mess with different buttons and/or switches that he couldn't remember what they did. Once running I'll go through all the fluids and fix the hydro setup when I add the bucket cylinder and hand controls.

 

[Analyte]

Well, I started messing with the 444 today, and first thing I did was fill the radiator with water. I had noticed it was empty, but I need to know if the thing had a hole or not. So far no leaks but I'll keep watch.

I spun the flywheel a bit more to ensure not hard spots, and it spins very freely now. Next was to check the PTO lever to make sure it worked, and all checked out when on/off.

I poured some fuel in it, and immediately found a small leak at the valve located at the bottom of the tank. I didn't pull the tank today, but I'll grab some parts so I hopefully have what I need to repair. I'm concerned the steel line might be rusted to the fittings and kink so I'll grab some line as well.

I'll need a new rear tire once it's running, but the other 3 hold air just fine for now.

 

[Analyte]

I didn't notice this at first but it has wheel weights on the front. Not sure why those were needed with the loader, and there is nothing on the back. I should have asked the seller about them.

 

[Analyte]

I found a new unused cylinder locally for a good price. It's a bucket tilt cylinder for an older bobcat. The length and stroke aren't too bad so I'm wondering if this could be used to convert my trip bucket.

I don't have an old IH loader around to measure, but is anyone able to comment on its potential use?

 

[caterpillar guy]

It will want to be about the same diameter and all as the lift cylinders other than length or you will probably bend it if you use down presser while trying to dig. Or spread material with it like gravel or dirt.

 

[JimB2]

Below is a photo of an IH 1550 loader on a 444 with a single cylinder on the bucket. The IH loader models 1501, 1550, 1801 and 1850 and JD model 37 all had a single cylinder on the bucket. The IH loader models 20XX and above all had dual cylinders on the bucket.
The problem with your Freeman loader is I don't believe there is sufficient space to mount a single cylinder to the bucket where the current trip bucket mechanism is located. Although I guess you could weld a cylinder mount on the under side of the cross beam where the loader trip mechanism is located and have sufficient free movement for a cylinder to tilt and dump the bucket???
Here is spec for bucket cylinder for IH 1501 loader:
(1501) - INTERNATIONAL LOADER (1/64-12/85), (A-38) - BUCKET CYLINDER, 2-1/2 X 16-7/16" DOUBLE ACTING » 850345C1
You will have to add a double acting hydraulic valve for the bucket or replace the existing one with a two valve version with loader valve being single acting valve and bucket double acting valve and possibly a drain back to the hydraulic filler plug behind the seat.
If you are good with a welder or have access to someone that has one and if you are going to use this loader a lot and want to have different attachments like forks, snow bucket, I would look around for a used Skid steer bucket quick attach mount for your loader and then add two bucket cylinders like an IH 2250, see photo below. I am not sure if the quick attach in the photo of the 2250 is the old IH model that my brother has but he has a very good retired welder and he adapted my brother's rock picker, bale spear buckets and the manure bucket was already a quick attach bucket and they can be swapped in a couple minutes by pulling a couple pins. Maybe someone else can comment but I believe the Skid Steer quick attach version is become the standard.

 

[JimB2]

PS, have a look at this post in this form as the mystery tractor has a loader like yours with hydraulic bucket.
Link: https://forums.yesterdaystractors.com/threads/please-help-identify-this-tractor.1780207/

 

[Analyte]

It will want to be about the same diameter and all as the lift cylinders other than length or you will probably bend it if you use down presser while trying to dig. Or spread material with it like gravel or dirt.

Ok, that makes sense. I'll get some measurements off the cylinders I have to compare. Thanks

 

[Analyte]

Below is a photo of an IH 1550 loader on a 444 with a single cylinder on the bucket. The IH loader models 1501, 1550, 1801 and 1850 and JD model 37 all had a single cylinder on the bucket. The IH loader models 20XX and above all had dual cylinders on the bucket.
The problem with your Freeman loader is I don't believe there is sufficient space to mount a single cylinder to the bucket where the current trip bucket mechanism is located. Although I guess you could weld a cylinder mount on the under side of the cross beam where the loader trip mechanism is located and have sufficient free movement for a cylinder to tilt and dump the bucket???
Here is spec for bucket cylinder for IH 1501 loader:
(1501) - INTERNATIONAL LOADER (1/64-12/85), (A-38) - BUCKET CYLINDER, 2-1/2 X 16-7/16" DOUBLE ACTING » 850345C1
You will have to add a double acting hydraulic valve for the bucket or replace the existing one with a two valve version with loader valve being single acting valve and bucket double acting valve and possibly a drain back to the hydraulic filler plug behind the seat.
If you are good with a welder or have access to someone that has one and if you are going to use this loader a lot and want to have different attachments like forks, snow bucket, I would look around for a used Skid steer bucket quick attach mount for your loader and then add two bucket cylinders like an IH 2250, see photo below. I am not sure if the quick attach in the photo of the 2250 is the old IH model that my brother has but he has a very good retired welder and he adapted my brother's rock picker, bale spear buckets and the manure bucket was already a quick attach bucket and they can be swapped in a couple minutes by pulling a couple pins. Maybe someone else can comment but I believe the Skid Steer quick attach version is become the standard.


View attachment 116152

View attachment 116159

That is an excellent idea using the quick attach mount from a loader. You never know what I'll find to do with it so having options is a good thing.

I'll take some measurements off my cylinders and compare them to those on an 1850/2250. I'll cut off all the trip bucket latches, and I'll weld cylinders on the arms like the last pic for greater strength. Now to start scanning for junk bobcats being parted, lol.

 

[Analyte]

While on hydraulics, I'm going to tear out all the galvanized pipe fittings and fix it right once at that point. I've been looking at 2 spool hand controls for the loader upgrade.

With research on this forum, I've found that the hydraulic pump is rated at 10gpm of which 3 is for pwr steering and 7 for the 3pt. Most of the controls I've found state they are for 11gpm which I assume is the max flow(?) so it will work fine with my 7gpm?.