(quoted from post at 23:18:35 03/21/15) Don't take this as a recomendation, but I have 3 Ruger 10/22's. Ruger guns are hard to beat for the money.
17HMR is a cool round. Got one for my non hunting son (he likes to shoot). Hit a crow at 260 yards with it. If you hit a gopher with it at 100 yards it just goes "poof".(quoted from post at 23:46:32 03/22/15) I would buy a 17HMR instead of a 22. The ammo seems easily available and it has a little more energy. Savage has a good line of bolt action rifles with scopes already mounted and they also just come out with a semi auto 17HMR. I have heard of people shooting critters to coyotes with the 17HMR.
(quoted from post at 19:46:32 03/22/15) I would buy a 17HMR instead of a 22. The ammo seems easily available and it has a little more energy. Savage has a good line of bolt action rifles with scopes already mounted and they also just come out with a semi auto 17HMR. I have heard of people shooting critters to coyotes with the 17HMR.
(quoted from post at 15:40:09 03/23/15) Bret;
On the subject you've brought up here, what are your thoughts on the future of ammunition for the .41 magnum and the 10mm auto? I haven't got a .41, and I reload my own 10mm, so it's just a matter of curiosity about a topic that interests me.
Stan
(quoted from post at 15:30:17 03/22/15) I have a Marlin Model 60 with a tubular magazine that holds 17 rounds, which is to say 18 with one in the chamber. More recently manufactured Model 60s have a 15 shot capacity. I agree that it's tedious to reload the rifle because you have to actually put the cartridges into the rifle---you can't load a bunch of magazines in advance, or put the rifle down while you reload. That said, the need for a quick reload because a critter is getting away is the same kind of reasoning which is used to justify high capacity semi-automatic handguns over revolvers: You never know when you'll have to protect yourself against a murderous outlaw motorcycle gang of more than six members. Could it happen? Certainly. Will it happen? It could, and it wouldn't change the odds that much to say it might happen on the same day you win the Powerball lottery. A critter running away just when you need to reload? Of course it could happen---but haven't you already missed it 18 times with my Model 60, or 10 or 11 times with your 10/22?
I'm not trying to start an argument (for a change), just making an observation. I think you should buy what you want, and not base your gun purchases on circumstances that are highly unlikely, or your retirement plan on winning a lottery.
Stan
(quoted from post at 20:37:09 03/23/15) Granting that there's been a pinch on all ammo for a bit now (though that shows signs of easing in many cases and places) I haven't had any more difficulty in getting .41 brass than any other caliber beyond the super-common ones. While the "middle magnum" never really caught on, it still maintains quite a cult following, and enough people still chamber guns for it that I think it will be a while before ammo gets scarce. The big thing the .41 has against it is that it doesn't share a caliber with any other common round, which means that bullets in particular have to be made just for that gun. The 10mm, at least in the lower weights, shares bullets with the hugely popular .40 S&W, so these can be used if necessary. The 10mm has underwent quite a resurgence lately, with many companies (SIG being the latest) offering brand-new guns just for it. Lots of people have caught on to what those of us who have shot the 10mm for many years already knew--it gives you magnum-level power in a small enough package to still be a practical choice for an everyday carry gun. Even for a non-handloader, people like Mike McNett at Double Tap Ammo load the 10mm to its potential, not downloaded to the "10mm Lite" levels of the FBI loads. Nothing wrong with the .40 S&W in its place, but you can (as S&W did) do that with a smaller-framed gun than what the 10mm is. Loaded to full potential, the 10mm makes an excellent self-defense load and is one of the few commonly-available autoloading cartridges suitable for deer-sized game at handgun ranges, with enough of a power margin to make up for non-optimal situations. I'm glad to see more companies responding to the increased demand for it, and hope that this will keep ammo availability up for the forseeable future, whether or not you handload. You're certainly right about them liking to fling brass, though I've found a heavier-than-stock recoil spring will help that as a side benefit to its primary purpose.
(quoted from post at 01:02:12 03/24/15) Interesting observations, Tim. I didn't know that the 10mm was making a comeback, but I'm tickled to hear it. I completely understand that it doesn't make sense to arm a police department or any type of law enforcement agency with a weapon that many of its members will be shy about firing, but I felt that the 10mm auto was an impressive enough handgun caliber that it would have been worth taking some extra time to get people used to it. In a large pistol with the bore axis low to the wrist like the Glock 20, it's much more comfortable to shoot than a small to medium .357 revolver, in my opinion.
It had never occurred to me that the .41 has the drawback of not having a non-magnum caliber to practice with. I knew there wasn't one, of course, but never put that together. Good point.
I have a S&W 610 revolver that shoots either 10mm or 40 S&W using full moon clips, but I don't think any 10mm pistol will fire 40 S&W---reliably, at least. Doesn't the 10mm headspace on the cartridge mouth, so that the shorter 40 S&W is held in position only by the extractor? Of course, you did say "if necessary".
Stan
(quoted from post at 20:45:41 03/23/15) Don't be too gloomy. Remember, it isn't only 90% of gun owners who sit on the sofa trying to watch TV without moving their lips---it's 90% of everybody. That means it comes down to who has the best organization of the 10% who will do something. So far, gun owners are doing fine. Nevertheless, your suggestion is a good one. Better to have the makings and no emergency than an emergency and no makings.
Wish I had a S&W Model 17, though. The SS Taurus I've got is not in the same league, and it's finicky about what it will shoot straight---only jacketed bullets. Fortunately, I bought a few of those back when they didn't cost much.
Stan
(quoted from post at 21:30:23 03/21/15) Another vote for Ruger 10/22
(quoted from post at 14:58:48 03/24/15) Except that the 10mm auto I have is a Glock, and Glock categorically warns against shooting lead bullets---at least they did up to and including the generation of their pistols I own. Maybe it's different now. I shot a lot of 9mm lead bullets through a Glock 17 before I read that they warned against it, but I find other ways to use them now. I wouldn't put lead through my Glock 10mm now, because even if it's not as dangerous as they say, I don't need to do it.
Stan
(quoted from post at 14:48:30 03/24/15) Bret;
I misread your previous post. I thought you were talking about two different handguns---a Smith Model 17 (.22 LR), and a 45AR, make unspecified. The Taurus I have is a .22
Stan
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