OT Active shooter training

[Dave H (MI)]

Just watching a clip on the news about the federal government program to train folks how to deal with active shooters. They just had this training at wife's work a few weeks ago. They had moderators who watched and local sheriff deputy was the "assailant". So my wife is in a group of other workers, they start the scenario and everyone but her run out the door to the outside. My wife has some issues with her legs and cannot run, so she ducked into a closet and left the door ajar about 3" so she could see out. The "shooter" entered the room and proceeded to shoot everyone thru the windows and the moderators pronounced them all as "kills". Then he saw the closet door and approached. When he reached for the door with his left hand, my wife kicked the door which hit him in the chest. She then grabbed his right arm and took the gun from his hand, scooted out into the hallway. Apparently the deputy yelled "Oh S**t as she took the gun. Once out of sight she shoved the gun under a chair cushion and continued on pretending to have it. Moderators ended the simulation and they had to have a meeting to understand how a 50'ish woman was able to disarm a 30'ish police officer pretending to be a gunman. They were surprised to find she had hidden the gun also. Co-workers were seeking her out for days to ask if she had really done it. I can only imagine what kind of ribbing the officer must have gotten. Long story short, the whole situation is now part of the regular training program. Personally, I don't know how to interpret this, but I am just a little more respectful at home now. That's my girl!

 

[rbhuntn]

Good for her and I would be too....

 

[WI Dan]

haha, that's a great story Dave! Kudos to your bride!

 

[James Howell]

Good story.

Congratulations to your wife.

Deputy should be glad it was only a training exercise and that he didn't get shot.

 

[Jim Phelps]

Sometimes flight is not the best answer, you just become a target in the open.

 

[Janicholson]

Quick appropriate thinking is outside the realm of a shooter, and within the realm of your fantastic wife. Apparently outside the realm of fatal escapees as well. Jim

 

[Tech 7]

Don't mess with her! Even though it was a a simulation I think she showed good resolve. I bet the officer came away with something to think about too.

 

[psimmer]

A couple years ago our when our daughter was in college they had a similar scenario. When everyone tried to hide or escape, the "shooter" had it fairly easy. Next scenario was that everyone was to use whatever was at hand to try and fight back. Books, backpacks, etc. were all thrown at the shooter to disrupt him. While some were "kills" in that situation, they actually seemed to fair better as a group using that method. In a real life situation that might be difficult to do as our natural tendency might be to try disappear or flee. Good job done by your wife!

 

[Paul Shuler]

We have had that same stuff at my work. They want us to all run. I have had two back surgeries and any good 4 year old can out run me. I told them I am like a Sherman tank with the tracks knocked off. I can?t run away but I can put up one h%ll of a fight right where I stand. That got a good laugh also but I wasn?t kidding. When you can longer retreat you start thinking more along the lines of offensive action. I would rather die fighting than hidden under a table. Good for your wife. i am proud of her. In that night club shooting in Fl 100s of people in there and any 5 or 10 people could have disarmed him if they just had a little anger and fight in them. Maybe someday a shooter will prove my theories all wrong and take me the old fat slow guy out first. Lol.

 

[john *.?-!.* cub owner]

They had an active shooter course at the school where my wife (retired teacher) substitutes, and I came with her and attended as an observer. The "shooter" (police officer) was also disarmed. Never underestimate school teachers.

 

[centash]

Now if you hear a strange sound at night, you have good reason to send her to investigate while you remain in bed! Ben

 

[Greg K]

Haha that's funny I bet it's a long time before he lives down that day. My friend add a class at where he works and basically they preached that you are the first responder you're there before the police before anybody else knows what's going on and they try to teach them to act similar to what your wife did

 

[JOCCO]

Hi Dave many years ago we had this in the service. One guy and good friend had studied judo and did well with it. During training he took an instructor/assailant's fake gun away and put him in a hospital. About a week later in public we had a knife incident (real) he disarmed him. Guy was a problem child and was taken back to jail but on felony charges!!!

 

[big tee]

So Dave--When she says NOT TONIGHT--You better listen!!!!!!!!!!--------Tee

 

[Two Dogs]

But in these training sessions they never take into consideration someone with a gun of their own could/would stop an attacker in his tracks. TDF

 

[4wdtom]

While in the closet she could have stuck her hand out in the shape of a hand gun and shouted "bang, you are dead, I just shot you with my licensed carry gun". Or she could have done the same after she took the gun away from him. Both actions would have ended the threat and shown it is possible to resist, defend yourself and others.

 

[ditchwitch]

LOL. Pretty cool Dave. next time the wife says take the trash out just dont argue and do it . lol

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

I'm not so sure that the outcome of this exercise is realistic.

First off, the people in the parking lot had no idea they were being shot at in this exercise. In a real situation, the crowd would have scattered in a panic the second the first person dropped. No way the shooter could have killed them all as happened in this exercise.

Second off, the "shooter" was acting like a police officer, not a deranged shooter. The officer attempted to "clear" the closet, while a shooter would've unloaded his weapon into the closet.

It's very likely that the outcome of this scenario would have been very different with a live shooter instead of a cop playing pantomime.

 

[Goose]

Good Show!!

We've had the same scenes at our courthouse but without the surprise ending.

I will say that more and more the sheriff's departments and other entities that stage these events are coming to realize the value of an old Marine Corps adage, "The best defense is a strong offense", and are beginning to promote a proactive response to a shooter.

 

[old]

Not sure if hiding the gun was the right or correct thing to do. Me in that type of thing the bad guy would have been likely to be shoot just in case he had another weapon on him unless he was cuffed or tired up. I was taught to always keep the weapon you take form some one just in case you need it or there are other bad guys to maybe have to protect your self from. Ya I know this was staged but no staged thing can be 100% how it would/might happen in real life and me I'll carry the bad guys gun till I have zero reason not to

 

[GeneMO]

Did she shoot the shooter?

Gene

 

[Ted in NE-OH]

I wonder if the procedure was for everyone to RUSH the shooter at once would that be effective. If all rush the shooter he probably would be limited in how many people could be shot and probably no many shot in vital spots. What do you think?

 

[4520BW]

We had to have the training last month but then we did have a shooter in our plant back in march. Scary stuff but it can happen anywhere.

 

[Married2Allis]

Too funny.

 

[4520BW]

If it is in a place a work you probably cant carry. After our shooting at work the question was ask what if someone would have retrieved their gun from there locked vehicle (legal in Indiana to keep your firearm lock in your vehicle at work..even thou they tried to say we cant) and shot the attacker they said you would be fire for a gun on company property.

 

[BarnyardEngineering]

(quoted from post at 12:08:37 12/09/16) Did she shoot the shooter?

No, she didn't.

If you read the original post, she took the gun, and hid it under a seat cushion.

If you're going to carry the gun you better be prepared to use it. Once she got her hands on the gun, she NEEDED to point it at the "shooter" and keep pulling the trigger until it was empty.

I suspect she is either not willing or capable of taking a life, or at the very least in this case, she was not comfortable pointing a "weapon" at a police officer.

Everyone knew it was an exercise, so they lollygagged, and once they were outside they stood around smoking cigarettes and shooting the breeze. Everyone knew the "shooter" was a police officer and respected him like a police officer.

 

[john *.?-!.* cub owner]

(quoted from post at 13:17:28 12/09/16) But in these training sessions they never take into consideration someone with a gun of their own could/would stop an attacker in his tracks. TDF

hat is something I have thought about, but practically all of the gun attacks have happened in "gun free" zones where you cannot legally carry a gun.

 

[dhermesc]

My understanding is many of the student at Columbine were shot in their rooms as the students followed school policy of staying put in their room and not leaving without permission.

My wife is still pushing for an "AR" rifle to be kept in the principal's office behind a pane of glass like a fire ax - to be broken in case of emergency. I can think of nothing more stupid than to group defenseless children into one big building then advertise the fact that no one there can defend them. But that is the mentality of the modern government.

 

[Two Dogs]

That's why I roll my eyes at these training sessions when the real solution is obvious to any sane person. TDF

 

[onefarmer]

Old I've wondered about that. If I got the gun like she did, I'd put him down first, but after that what do I do. If there's another I want it. But what if the next guy is a LEO? Will I be shot as a gun man too?

 

[old]

Well in the case it was a cop coming up on you then you simply make sure he knows you are not going to shoot him and you never make it look like your are going to be a problem and in many cases you as you see them you lay it down and back away from it.. Communication is the big thing and you let the cops know who you are and what it going on and flat out say I am not a bad guy I have the bad guys weapon form when I disarmed him

 

[onefarmer]

My luck, he'd be the over zealous one, shoot the guy with a gun first and ask questions later.

 

[old]

Sadly a lot of what happens in a school shooting are not the whole truth of the matter like in the Sandy hook thing where spent rounds where found but the shoot while he did have the gun in his car the gun was never used by him and the cop planted the the spent rounds

 

[Greg1959]

old- "Communication is the big thing and you let the cops know who you are and what it going on and flat out say I am not a bad guy I have the bad guys weapon form when I disarmed him."

How do you tell that to the LEO Sniper that is 150 yards away?

 

[old]

Again it is how you appear to the cop as to you being a treat or not being a treat. How you hold the gun when you see the cop or even as he comes toward you, you lay it down and back away from it. Plus communication as to what your doing etc.

I always get a good laugh when you here of a cop saying drop your weapon when in reality dropping a gun can/will make it go off which will and can cause major problems

 

[old]

Easy you yell and if he is that far away from you then he is either to far from you to know what is going on let alone be shooting at you with a hand gun. At that distance the cop would have to be a sniper and in that case they have to be told it is a go no go thing to take a shot

 

[Dick]

A great story!! Your wife was smart to do what she did and it wasn't what they expected to happen. Probably, in my opinion, she should have shot the person with the gun once she got the gun, to disable him. Then she did the right thing to leave the room and hide the gun. Had she kept the gun and was leaving the building, and a cop seen her with the gun, she would have probably been shot without asking questions. In a real situation, the police are nerved up and I would not trust that if they would have seen me with a gun, they would tell me to drop it. Especially after the shooter had just killed several shooting through the window.
I know it would be hard to shoot someone at point blank range, but after you see the shooter dropping people outside the building, I would think if I don't drop him he will sure as heck kill me too.
She did good and must have had a good head on her shoulders, and was able to think correctly.
Every situation is different so a person needs to think what to do in every situation.
Also, in all the shootings I can think of, there was always only "one person doing the shooting". Not that it couldn't happen that there could be more, past examples have not shown it. So if you take out the shooter, the next thing you have to worry about is the officers responding to the insident.

Dick

 

[muleboss]

Running out into the hall way with the gun may have not turned out the best in a real situation.

 

[Bob Harvey]

Your lady done good. It is a sad situation that training to deal with that shirt exsists in your country. Mind you axxwholes are everywhere, even here. But, not so much. My real reason to NOT to any city. Yikes.

 

[4wdtom]

Please explain this a little more, I haven't heard the "assault rifle" was left in the car. Thanks.

 

[old]

It was all over the news but not normal CNN ABC NBC etc. The cops where even told if they talked they would disappear. A lot of shooing now days are staged by the anti gun people in the hope they can turn the people in this country into fools and believe the gun it the problem not the person holding it

 

[john *.?-!.* cub owner]

In an active shooter situation, if you manage to disarm the shooter do [b:8caed75759]NOT[/b:8caed75759] go around carrying the gun to show he/she has been disarmed. That may get you shot by the responding officers. Put it in a trash can and take the can with you so the shooter cannot get it, or put it in a desk drawer that can be locked or someone can keep shut, etc.